So, what do you think of modo?

#21

Hey I hope my last post didn’t come off as a flame either c-g. I totally see where you are coming from for the most part… I just have a strong stance on the whole “value” issue as well. Ultimately it’s just not worth arguing about, as it steals time from actually using Modo to model with. =]

#22

Chaz: Yeah bevel is closer to using SuperShift… this is part of what my comment about falling victim to the old LW tool methodologies was about. Too much overlap in tools. There’s really no need for all those tools when a little more thought can be put into refining one tool and giving it multiple features that are all relevant to that tool, as opposed to having several that do the same thing, but maybe one or two things slightly different. This is also where the Tool Properties, and extra key/mouse input would be useful. I’d sooner see less tools in my tool palettes, knowing that they can handle whatever I need them for than having to shuffle through tabs or menus for extra buttons, or even memorizing extra key binds. The less you fight with the UI the more work you get done.

Example: The polygon tool palette has 4 different tools - Inset, Shift, SmoothShift, and Bevel… all of which have overlapping functionality that could easily be absorbed into one tool or two if you really want to keep bevels and extrudes separate. =] And these don’t work on edges or verts, so I need to have extra bevel and extrude tools for verts and edges. Ok now I’m treading in someone else’s water… I believe Ambient Whisper has already brought this topic up in another post anyway so I’m not going to regurgitate it all here. Let’s just say that I happen to agree with him then. =D

#23

i personally do not see any hostility from anyone, i take telling personal outrage as a form of self expression. i agree on certain comments from gwot, like needing some refinements in modo.
but what i see most of the time is that, the very basic idea of modo fades away in details of how particular tools should be.You can judge modo based on how symmetry has a bug or you can judge modo based on how you can add falloffs to many tools, or idea of tool pipeline or customizing modo or macros etc. it is so relative really. At this point i personally belive in talking about structural princibles rather than why luxology should give up spacebar, even thou it may sound like a structural matter. i personally LOVE changing component mode with SPACE bar, because i like to have different selection sets in different component modes, so rather than assigning 3 different buttons i use 1 button for fliipping through. but that is me and my needs, but if you want you can assign those functions to another key set and use your space bar for something else. but you made a good comment on space bar, it could have been used for ability to add new selections, i would prefer that with another key but not a bad idea at all.

slice tool, that one needs improvement i personally complained about adding new features to it and some other testers did too. and i belive they did not have enough time to add to v.1. hopefully we will see it improved and get faster.

uv, it is a monster. uv technology has not changed in last 5-10 years at all , and noone could come up with better and faster and versatile ways of doing mapping.
Modo needs better and more uv stuff. but as you know it is v1 and they just tried to stick in enough for starters i belive. from point of developement it makes sense, so actual users can shape the software during newer versions.But that does not justifiy not having more robust uv toolsets.

and patch it forget it is not a good way, as in lightwave case it clogged developement. and we never had edges and real working uv stuff even in v7. But it is yet one fo the fastest and best modellign software out there.

#24

That is why I said it wasn’t directed at Gwot AND put that part in BOLD. I did address something he said because there seems to be a lot of people comparing Modo to LW with a buttload of plugins. (again not just Gwot). As a matter of fact Gwot seemed to have taken the post as it was intended.

The reason why I posted it is because there is a lot of people on here “attacking” the work of others, namely Luxology. Luxology didn’t find Modo under a rock or at the end of a rainbow, they busted their ass programing it. To have someone say that it isn’t worth the price just stinks of hypocrisy when they turn around and charge high dollar for their art they sell to others. That was where my rant came from.

#25

Hey I have seen a lot of whingeing lately about price, and quite frankly I’m astounded…was anyone around 5 years ago? Maya unlimited would have cost me $30,000, lucky I didnt have the money then or I would have rammed the manual somewhere dark and steamy:thumbsup:
Since softimage came out with fundamentals for $495 everyone seems to think everything else is too expensive, is anyone drugged out enough to think they’re making any money doing this? So there are less funds in the coughers for product enhancements and even if they get a few hobbyists and some studios signed up.I’m not knocking XSI either I think its a great package and as soon as they come out with a real linux port I’ll buy myself a copy, but XSI fundamentals isnt maya complete(and no I’m not trying to start a flame war either) I think complaining over a couple of hundered dollars is pathetic, and as someone put it probably from someone who’s never earned a cent doing computer graphics.I probably should have waited for a demo because I sure cant afford it, but from the demo videos I saw some pretty cool tools that are gonna save me a lot of hours im maya I think in the future, once I learn how to use it and once I get electricity hooked up to the refrigerator box I’m gonna be living in in a coupe of weeks.

Anyway just my 2 cents, hoping to see some 15+ cg’ers in the forum

MunCH

#26

As far as similar tools, some people want fewer tools with more options and some want more tools with fewer options…

Someone commented on having different bevels for polys, edges, and vertices. That’s just something in the default UI. Simply mapping the command “bevel” to a key or button will give you a single bevel that will work on any element type. This workflow carries through to other tools as well.

#27

There is the best example for the price argument.

Check the About box in Modo. FIVE of the Software and engineering people that are listed, post here in this forum. How many of the Alias or Discreet programmers are here posting and helping people out?

#28

Alias and Discreet don’t need publicity as much as Lux does. So it’s quite obvious why they would post, to get people’s attention. Understandable why, and definitely not a bad thing to do, but I personally don’t see them being that much around here once modo will grow up, as community will take it on its own.

#29

pyoDuncan Brimsmead posts quite often in the maya forum but thats the only guy I know of.

but I personally don’t see them being that much around here once modo will grow up, as community will take it on its own.
This forum is linked to in the help menu of modo, so I guess the guys will be hanging around to be a nuisance and teae us with new product features ( a little joke fella’s :D)

Cheers

MunCH

#30

That must be why they have those stupid commercials Alias made with the “scientist”

#31

I honestly don’t know how much “attention” we’ve gotten, because we post here… I honestly think that everyone at Luxology recognizes that there is way too much company between the people that use the other tools and the people making the other tools. I don’t know of any better way to find out what people really need in a piece of software than to listen to what they say they are doing with it, where they may be stumbling, misunderstanding etc…

At least to my job, these forums and the ones like them are gold…

#32

I have to say that it realy isnt revolutionary, but more of evolutionary from the other product they once developed.

The Pro’s are that it does enhance the workflow of Modeling for the folks familiar with the LW Product.
Interface is clean, smooth an intutive.
Mesh editing Tools work with all object modes, vertex, edge, poly so you can slice & connect as needed.
The President of Lux is also a user, helpfull on the forums, and not a corparate shmuck that doesnt use the product they make, like other manufactures of other well known 3D products.

Some folks who are used to modeling the old way, will not benefit from the newer aplication. they will most likely stay stuck in their box if they dont think out of it.

Users, who arent familiar with LW might have a harder time getting used to the new workflow… which isnt a bad thing. ( there is more than one way to make a box)

Still a bit buggy on my end with mirroring, sometimes it just goes poof, so autosave is enabled all the time now.

I have to say that at 1.0 its pretty good for me, except for the small goes poof quirks and the intial stage of knowing where what was and where to get at it.
I purchased MODO, becuase… I was moving on from another product, which I sold to purchase MODO. so I sorta evened out <-----thats for folks who complain they dont have the dough ( Yard sale TIME) :wink:

Having not modeled for about MMmmm…almost 7 years, I feel like a new kid with his first bike. Modo realy make me look forward to modeling again its given me a new life as far as 3D Modeling apps GO.

Yes XSI was less expensive, but I flipped a coin and MODO won.
Also, the developers first product was my intruduction to 3D , when I was a wee LAD on my skateboard… I was ollie-ing to a rail slide near a puter store… that had a chrome sphere on a checkerboard patterened plane. I fell off in amazment ran into the store and asked what the fudge is that (pointing)
sales guy ( Nerd) thats a toaster!!
Me, No!! DUDE that (Pointing again)
Sales geek, yes dude a Toaster!!
Me, scratches head… mumbles fudgen toaster is for bread man.
Another geek in store explains
Ya toaster is the computer box with program that you can do 3D in and Video.
me, Ahhhhhh!! How much
Sales Geek 3grand about.
Me, member im skateboard kid, Uggggg little Ceasars dont pay me that much.
So years later after savings i got 5.5 and thats another reason for my purchase.

One thing though that I dont want is MODO to turn into an aplication of old dated tools that folks want implemented , becuase they are to scared to move foward.
I also dont want it to become a half assed aplication full of work arounds to do X mesh edit workflow.( I hate work arounds, and poorly implemented tools)

At a 1.0 release its good, but like most apps it will truly shine at the .5 update, and I think thats why there is no Demo yet.
Folks like me are the early testers, and Lux will most likely inprove the product based on what we have all said on this forum…

the future is pretty simple… folks want to be able to have it 2 ways either implement Mirai/Wings3D/ best tools with more intutive worflow.
or
a more enhanced LW/MODO worflow.
I want both, and MORE!!..becuase I sez sooooo :twisted:

And the LUX Folks are the only ones who can do it AT the Moment!!

Yes its long and prolly, went on rambling, i had to type quick to see the prez debate.

:wink:

#33

2nd that…Waaayy to expensive…a comparable app Silo is $109 U.S.

#34

Realy now, you would think that ppl would stick to the topic
the Original thread is about folks who have it and have used it since its release
comments about price comparison have nothing to do with the original thread. I suggest folks start their own thread instead of Hijacking it…

#35

Cry about it will you…Price has more to do with it than you think.

Hes Curious what people think about it , and thats what I think about it…PLus If Luxology is reading this , then they can hear that it’s overpriced as well…

#36

do not get me wrong, but you guys are spinning the same cycle again. Silo is a great great program, noone questions it. But comparing modo too silo is not a fair game for either. i am telling this as someone who is using modo for a year nearly.
how about this, silo is too expensive when wings3d is free ? it is not a fair question or attitude at all

silo offers alot for the price, but that does not make other programs expensive.

#37

If your so concerned about price? sounds to me that ur Modo envy? :wink:
well let me tell you something my Modo is bigger than urs :wink:
here let me walk you over like a little baby over here to a thread just for you
dont forget to hold my hand :wink:

http://www.cgtalk.com/showthread.php?p=1639098#post1639098

unfortunetly at the moment this is the only forum available for MODO, but i dont want it to get full of degenerates like it did in the LW one.
This is the only forum/option i got for MODO stuff,so DAM straight Im gona Cry over it…
:cry:

#38

Apples and oranges… art invokes emotion, apps invoke commands, or something like that :wink:

I think the next block of cg money I will be spending will be on better hardware for the apps I already have… :wink: :smiley:

#39

matty429, realistically there is no comparing silo to this. Compare silo to wings if you want a comparable application. Wings is better.

#40

Price is relative.

You can sell a program cheeply if :
a) There are only one/two people working on it.
b) You are part of a large established company that has a much more expensive “full featured” program (or two) that you can use to offset the charge.

Unfortunately for them Luxology doesn’t fall into either catagory. At one point their website listed about 15/20 software engineers working for them. What’s a normal yearly sallery for a software engineer, $15/$20k pa ?, then times that by two for the time Modo has been in production without other sources of income. And with no established base to work from Luxology has had to invest heavilly in advertising and select promotional events.
I don’t know what all that came to financially (sounds quite scary for a gamble, even before you add in support staff, equipment budget and rent), but all that would need to be recouped in initial sales, and as Brad has already said that sales have exceeded expectations it can be assumed that the necessary recoupping was calculated on a lower turnover.

Is it too expensive ? Considdering what was spent on it to get it this far, I don’t think so.

Is it value for money ? For me it is. Already most of my rendering was being done in Vray and Mental Ray, and I had already partially moved over to XSI for my modelling needs. Since getting Modo I haven’t been into LW at all. Also because LW’s export functions were quite bad I had to use Deep Exploration to get my models into MAX, but with Modo’s good export function, and a quick script to handle sizing and rotational transformations, I don’t need Deep Exploration either.