Don’t worry I am not one of those wild forum flamers.
Forums will always have conflicts. The question is how will the admins or mods handle them. I was an admin of a forum wayback and we had no conflicts. maybe because I am cool.
Hey spiritdreamer should it look like this…
The menus kinda get in the way. lol. control+h hides menus
Hi Pushav
Yes that is the basic set up for the two pictures at once on Painter.
I would pull the photo all the way to the right to give room to make the picture bigger.
I close all the various menus except those that I am currently using. That way I have more room. I generally work in only one layer.* The only boxes I have on the screen are the color wheel and the brushes; and then when I use liquid lens I open that box and put it in the picture I am working on and when I am done with it I close it.
* Working in only one layer, everytime I get to a point that I like I do a “save as”… and give each version a number after the file name. I open it back up and work on that version and continue to do “save as” with a new number after the file name. For instance on the pictures I have on this tutorial I think I have at least 73 versions, each a step beyond the last. (Makes for a good development slide show later, too!) (and you can go back to any previous version at any time to develop it a different way or whatever) I usually put them in BMP instead of the Painter RIF format, that maintains the layers etc. Since I save so many versions, BMP seems to use less memory. I had some problems on an older computer when I was using RIF that I started using the BMP.
Hope this is a little help. Seems like you are on the right track.
(My typist is going to sleep now, though I will be reading any comments, you may not get an answer til in the AM.)
Take Care,
Glenn
Tate,
Good to see you back online! 
Here is a quick review, which I hope helps to point out the major points of the lay-in of the figure:
[left]The main thing is to not worry about details / shading until you are confident that the main lay-in is correct. This is particularly important when doing traditional work, and even more particularly when doing traditional painting, as there is no Ctrl + Z in the traditional world.
You want to make sure that your axes, foremost in importance, are correctly aligned, and that the figure has not only a head but a neck which is aligned properly with the average direction of the spine.
To find the placement of the limbs, mark their narrowest points, and connect the dots to find their basic shape.
The last part of the basic lay-in is to superimpose the MAJOR CURVES of the figure overtop of the basic measurements which you have established. The key here is to SIMPLIFY ~ do not overcomplicate things, as you will end up adding random insignificant details in some places, and adding NO detail in others. Try to describe the torso (rib cage and pelvis) with as few curves as possible ~ offset them to achieve form and flow.
Hope this helps!
~Rebeccak
[/left]
Alright Here goes another useless update rebecca lol!
This is what I have so far Spiritdreamer… Thanks for the tips! (p.s. you can sell your slide show tutorials and get rich!) Make sure you and your typist get a lot of rest because tomorrow is a new day and I will have some questions lol:thumbsup:
Once again this thread is fantastic.
Wacom graphire 2 and painter 7
The big oil brush did not work me too well so I used a cutom chalk brush that I created and a custom normal hard round brush that I made in painter7.
And instead of using the liquid lens brush I used the smear/smudge brush. It is a nice trick to shape the figure digitally. I will work on this more tomorrow.
I painted this with the zoom at 100percent or 90percent something like that. I have to get in the habit of not concerning myself with details.
I guess that I am doing this right so far…(this is my first ever 100percent all digital painting atempt. Viewer discretion is advised lol!
Crits anyone?Well here’s my overdue updated version. It might not look that different but I have made changes. One of the big ones was trying to soften the edges and add that orange/red outline that I’m wondering if was produced by the fact that its a photograph or the way the scene was lit. The other is the face, which I’m still not happy with but I don’t think I ever will be either. I’ve always had problems when drawing the head that’s tilted at that angle. I think its got something to do with the fact that the jaw loses the obvious outline it would otherwise have.
I also colour corrected the whole figure to put some of the red back in it. I have guilt issues over this since I promised myself I would try not to do anything that I couldn’t do with a traditional picture. Except for undo. You cannot take away my undos.
Note for next time: work on image that is larger than the original picture. For this I work on a template that was the same pixel dimensions as the photo. I’m wondering if this was causing me trouble with the details. At the very least it was causing some nasty aliasing with some of the tools at smaller sizes.
belail,
Great going so far!! 
I like the choppiness of the background, and really like that area right around her left armpit where you have a nice hard shadow contrasted with the softer shoulder area ~ I’m a sucker for edge contrast, what can I say!
The main thing I notice right away is that the axes of the face need to be parallel ~ ie, the axes of the eyes, nose, lips, chin, and brow all need to be at basically the same angle ~ right now (and I know this must be hard because you are working at such a small scale) I think that they are at mismatching angles, and that is what is causing her to look a bit unnatural. Also make sure that you determine the proper central axis of the face, as this will really determine the axes of all of the important features of the face.
Overall, this is coming along really well! I would suggest for the background, keeping it loose and desaturated, and focusing your energy and detailing on specific bits of the figure ~ ie head and torso. These should receive the most attention, as that is what the viewer’s primary focal point will generally be.
Regarding the digital bit not straying from the traditional bit ~ don’t shoot yourself in the foot. I kind of had this reluctance too initially because I felt as though I were “cheating” ~ however, now that I’ve worked with painting in Photoshop, I now consider painting with oils and brushes “cheating”, lol! With oil paints and brushes I can get a tremendous variety of strokes and tonal values and colors in a matter of a few wide expressive strokes ~ in order to do this in Photoshop, at least on my machine, it would take ages to do this, and there is no tactile sense of brush to canvas! Also, having not chemically engineered the properties of oil paints and brushes myself any more than I programmed Photoshop or Painter or Maya, I now realize how dependent I am upon certain properties of traditional media which make my conversion to the digital medium a sometimes reluctant one. So, in short, I understand your concern, but realize that using traditional media is ‘cheating’ to some degree also in that what you are using is a tool ~ just as using Photoshop or Painter is using a tool, also.
Enough babbling on my part. Why am I awake, really? Who knows.
Keep going, and post your results!
~Rebeccak
The Dagger,
BTW, your piece came out really well, and I hope you participate in the next round!
I don’t think the piece is yet totally finished, but I can appreciate your wanting to put it away for a bit. Some pieces are just for practice, and that’s totally cool.
Thanks for posting, and hope to see more of your work on the next Figure Drawing Workshop!
~Rebeccak
Thank you Rebecca. I’ll definetely be back for the next round. This workshop is a good place for practising and learning and it’s great to see different artists working on the same subject as well.
Woohooo Becca, I managed to finish all the other tutorials you did while I was away.
/me cracks knuckle. Lets go 
I am painting thru a thunderstorm. Yay!
Anyway, I am begining to work on rendering the skin a bit more and added detail to the hair and I am starting to correct her right leg with a smuder brush I made…
Any crits? I need to know if I am going in the right direction.
Used painter 7 and tablet along with my custom smeary round brush and custom acrylic smudger brush that I imported from painter 9. (yeah I imported a brush from a new painter to and older version. It is possible)
Hi Pushav
You are off to a good start. Doesn’t matter what medium you use, chalk etc, to start with, but I do think if you are going to try to get away from being just a line work artist, not that that is bad by any means, I think you should start in oils. Oils are the best medium out there and it would gratly behoove and benefit you to get used to them from the start. Whether it be traditionally or digitally applied. What I find to be nice aobut them is if you over blend, which happens often, it creates another color that wasn’t there to start with. So I end up putting the color that I think should be there over the color that I overblended. Behold a happy accident happens, the colors start to vibrate and become luminous. DaVinci’s trick, I think? Can’t be achieved with any other medium that I know of. It’s kind of like when you put a pearled paint job on a car, which you don’t see too often anymore, except maybe the “low rider” cars in San Fernando and East LA. Their cars are beautiful, the colors on them are unbelievably luminous. And sparkle and vibrate when the light hits them. They achieve this magical effect by putting layer upon layer - sometimes 40 or 50 layers of paint mixed with laquer and letting each layer dry thoroughly before putting the next layer over it. Same principle applies with oil paint, except linseed or walnut oil mixed with the paint pigment. You can ask Don about this he probably knows alot more about this than I do. They also vary each color layer ever so slightly until they get the desired color they are after. Same principle applies to figure painting or oil painting in general. I’ve been using the liquid lens as a tool to carve my figures and shape them like you would as if you are doing a sculpture. It’s fast and helps me to get the rythm flowing in the figure. And to keep its spontenaity alive. Creating its curves and indentations etc. I then blend the rough edges it leaves behind with a blending tool. I’ve been using the “just add water” tool because it’s the first one I came upon while searching for a tool to blend with. But I’m sure there are others that are probably better out there. Stipic mentioned one, I wrote it down and will test it out on my next painting. If anyone knows of any other blending tools in Painter I sure would appreciate it if you would let me know. Or I should say, let us all know.
Next I go to the apply surface texture tool, and tint my whole painting usually with the lightest yellow on the color scale. Just to give unity to all the various colors I start with. Becomes the common denominator or general color unifying all the various colors in the painting. Next I experiment with all the effects settings and tricks that Painter has to offer. Contrast warp etc etc etc. Just to see what effect they have on the painting I happen to be working on. If something happens that I really like, I save a version of it in the folder I have created for that painting and also write down how the effect was achieved. Very important to keep a written record for future reference unless you are gifted with a photgraphic memory. Ha Ha.
Finally the funnest part and most exciting part for me anyway, the colored spotlights.
Found in effects under lighting. These I really love and appreciate the most. They allow me to create an unlimited variety of dynamic drama. Using light just like the movie studios do,. More so in the past with black and white film. But, when you think about it, they learned all their tricks from the old masters of painting. Like Rembrandt Reubens DaVinci etc. While enough said for now, went on alot longer than I had planned. Made this little tutorial especially for Pushav, but hope it can be of some help to everyone.
Now I just hope I can get my wife to type it for me, Ha Ha. (Before she goes on strike and leaves me and goes to the beach)
And thank you again Rebecca for creating these tutorials.
They are all great and your teaching method is excellent and exceptional. Seems to bring out the best in everyone involved in them.
Have a great day
And take care, Everyone,
Glenn
[color=lime]PS Pushav, Get a black or dark purple background on your painting, so you can see the values and tones properly (like Rebecca says we should do… ) [/color]
SpiritDreamer,
Awesome commentary, thank you for this!!! During the day it’s pretty hard for me to look at nude drawings at work without getting my a** fired, lol! I HIGHLY appreciate all of the wise words you have to say to us, so thank you Mr. and Mrs. SpiritDreamer for the great contributions!! And, Mrs. SpiritDreamer, just look at all the typing you are so nicely doing as collateral. 
And thank you for the compliment. Lots of really great work going on!!!
Great stuff!!!
~Rebeccak
wow! I whished that I would have seen your post before I started to work on my picture more spiritdreamer.:arteest:
Don’t get fired Rebecca!
I need you to give me your wise insight.
Painter7 and wacom
This time I used a brush that I like to call value separator number2 and a little just add water, acrylic smudger and a custom smeary round brush.
This is where I am at so far…
Thanks you guys for the long statement. And to mrs. spiritdreamer thanks for typing for your husband!:bounce:
Now I’ll give you my tutorial.:buttrock: Everyone else can try if they have painter.
Spiritdreamer I am going to tell you how to make a blending brush in painter(s) One of the best tools in painter along with just add water.
This is what I do.
1. Find a brush i like
2. right click on your mouse or press that button on your wacom pen to bring up brush selection menu. For example. Liquid/water should stuff like rake, bulge, just add water,etc… select Save variant and name your brush. Now select your new brush from the menu.
3. Then I tweak the brush. Usually under general in your brush option I set my blending brushes to soft cover. Now this is how you will make a normal brush a blending brush. Find well in the brush options and you should see some slider bars such as dryout, resat. and bleed. Turn the resaturation down to 0 (this means that no paint will be saturated on your brush. Kind of like a dry brysh in real life) Now bleed is the strength of the brush. I usually turn this down to a low level like 20 or something and I tend to keep my dryout maxed out most of the time.
4. After you have your settings in place, use the brush to see if you like it when you blend. If not then play with the settings once more.
5. after that right click on your mouse or press the wacom button again and click save varaint. It should ask do you want to overwrite your variant? and click yes/ok.
[img]http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v222/pushav/color/lifedrawing6wippainter3.jpg[/img]
[left]Any crits or questions?:shrug:
[/left]
pushav,
Here is a little review I jimmied up for you: hope it helps! :)
[img]http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/rebeccak4/Open%20Figure%20Drawing%20Workshop/pushav_REVIEW_1.jpg[/img]
[img]http://i8.photobucket.com/albums/a35/rebeccak4/Open%20Figure%20Drawing%20Workshop/pushav_REVIEW_2.jpg[/img]
[left]Hmm…damn gif. Finally!
Pushav, try darkening the bkgrd and lengthening her form. Try to establish a rhythm in the body by using Opposing Curves. AXES are of utmost importance ~ these should always be put in first, and checked against and modified as you go along. It may be helpful to keep them on a separate layer to turn on and off as you go.
Always draw the head and neck BEFORE drawing hair. Hair doesn’t exist in any shape without the underlying head ~ therefore, it is always important to draw the head FIRST. Also, it is easy to forget about the neck ~ make sure you always draw that, too.
Try implementing some of these changes yourself. At the very least put in a darker bkgrd, and work from dark to light. Bear in mind that VALUE trumps Color ALWAYS.
Hope this helps.
[/left]
[left]~Rebeccak
[/left]hey thats nice pushav,i like.ewww i hate just add water,especially when u use oils,in traditional that wud be impossible haha.but thats a great job.
…so rebecca,when r u gunna pose nude for us? :drool:
wuhaha.
I figured that I did not give her that turn. Time tor me to sketch over to get the proportion right.
NOOB! lol. Remember how you got banned off of the ledheavy forums and the other one! lol! Try not to make it 3 lol:eek:
Anyway what happened to team world domination.
NOOB,
Erm…ha…ha…ha…ha…
When Leonardo DiCaprio ditches Giselle for me and we fly off to live in a mansion on the Aegean. Or never, whichever comes first.
Wondering…hmm, are NOOB and pushav related??? Holy cow, the long lost Spam brothers!!! Reunion Tour 2005!
dude that was like a year ago,and i was immature back then not saying i’m not now…but i was worselol
quit bringin that up.
hahah rebecca.i’ll just use ur siggraph pics as ref then.
i didn’t spam,i was commenting on pushavs work.
Crap.
Ok, no more spam, guys. Got pictures? Post 'em. Got spam? Shelve it.
Grits teeth
~Rebeccak
No we are not related. Legend has it that NOOB! is one of my groupies from various comic forums. evertime I sign up some where later on Noob! finds it lol!
Anyway Noob! post a painting here. Show me what you can do with your new painter!
World domination! lol. Ok no more spam for a while.