early 19th century london matte WIP

#21

personally, i think working in a professional industry, what matters is the results, and how fast and efficient you can do it. Matte painting exist at the first place because its cost effective for film production and its continuing to evolve over the years so the result has be more realistic but at the same time cost effective.

Thou i have no industry experience, but I logically assume that when an art director gives a direction, it will be regarding things like mood, composition, and vision, rather then create a matte only using photoshop or particular software constraints.

#22

I think the 3d blocks would be used more as a guide layer in photoshop for getting more accurate perspective. I agree everything else should be photoshop.

#23

You have A.

(thats where you’re stood …)

you have B.

(Imagine thats a little point on the horizon :slight_smile: )

How you get between them two points; honestly i couldn’t care less, hehe :slight_smile: the point is that you GET to B, as quickly as you can with professional results that in this case are technically correct and photorealistic. By ‘quickly’, please understand that this NEVER means rush it, it simply means as quickly as YOU can. Now some people are fasters than others which ultimately seperates the skill level and the pay cheque.

Honestly guys, there’s no right or wrong way, just hit the high way and get moving with the show. The typical process of techniques will generally be photo manipulation where possible, 3d next, then minitures and then when all else fails paint.

Edit: 3d should only be used when the alternative isn’t possible, never use it simply for the sake of using it, unless it makes the job far quicker.

Feel free to do this as you wish, im more than happy to guide you as and where i can, but the methods, well i leave up to you.

Be warned, using camera projections will present further issues.

And yes lining up 3d geo as a perspective aid is a good idea, i do this all the time.

and no, this isn’t a challenge, though feel free to play if you wish :slight_smile:

Cya,

Dave.

#24

MileDream: I do agree that in the industry the results are the only thing that counts. No-one is going to care if you build the city in your back yard as long as you stay in the budget and timeframe and provide at least acceptable results.

But this is a learning process. And by making some part hard the techer forces to tackle it more thoroughly. At least that’s how I saw it.

For the same reasons I consentrated purely on providing what was asked, and not making artistic standpoint at all. If the purpose is to learn technique, I’m only doing myself harm by arguing about the feasibility of it.

Then again, I might be totally off with this.

#25

Ok, so it’s the results count, not the way to get there. Good, I’m fine with that too. =)

Expect my next update to be 3d / painting. It will be a rough concept for the matte I’m hoping to complete with quality results.

I have been talking about a challenge as a personal challenge I took. Not that this is a official or general challenge of any kind.

#26

learning is about exploring, making mistakes so you will learn not to make the same ones again. and it doesn’t mean taking a path that is the hardest mean you will learn most.

on the other hand, it depends what yours goals are. if you want to be a PS purist then by all means take that path, but if you are struggling with perspective in PS and using 3d as a visual aid, nobody is gonna call you a cheater or being lazy to learn.

My attitude towards this piece of work is as if I am working for a real film company because I intend to show it off in my portfolio. And as everlite has stated, he (the film company) couldn’t care less about how to you produce it, as long as you did it in a professional manner

#27

Another update: WIP4

well, what I can say… still lots to do. :slight_smile: (2weeks left)

#28

Really liking the colour scheme, though still concerned about the sudden drop over the incline.

The horizon is too low down.

The left building looks warped, check the vertical lines. Also the top of the building needs some variation where it becomes suddenly flat at the roof.

Be careful it doesn’t become too boxy, which can easily happen when matching to geometry.

Also when lighting, take care to note the position and direction of the sun.

Dave.

#29

you are concern about the incline of the buildings or the road? You mean the perspective is off or you think the composition is not good?

#30

Not refering to technical side, more composition, it goes up a hill, then seems to suddenly drop down. I dont mind the incline too much, but needs to be much less, be nice to see more buildings extend in the distance on both sides, for this the road would have to be flatter.

The center building, left side seems a touch too big compare to the foregound building.

Yeh, every time i look, the hill just feels unnatural, at least to this height.

For future posts please post only the working painting, leave out guides unless needed for reference.

Dave.

#31

the perspective is looking much more solid then your previouse versions. I agree with everlite about the hill drop off. the perspective goes more upwards when you follow the guide through. the big ben view seems a little un-realistic. maybe replace it with some closer buildings simular to this http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/8/82/Marunouchi_London_Street_1920s.jpg

#32

update WIP5

next to come:
more adjustment for the left foreground main building
adding lights to make the street more alive.
adding more attribute such as phone booth, road sign.
color the street lamps

#33

Cool update!

The end of the street looks good, and the whole thing is coming together nicely.
About the decoration:
Isn’t this supposed to be early 19th century London? There was no phone booths at at that time.

#34

may be there is a mis-understanding, I set the piece in victorian period, around 1850-1901, is the period when Thomas Edison is till alive so, I think there are phone booths already with all other great electical inventions, try look up the Old traditional English phone booth. Its quite iconic if u wanna show audience your scene is set in london, uk.

Edit: ok, i am wrong, the first proper phone booth was not introduced until 1959 :stuck_out_tongue:
(no phone booth then, but I am sure there was electricity at least)

#35

The name of your thread suggest the beginning of 19th century. =)

Anyway, there is no-one to say it needs to be that era, so feel free to make it later. At the beginning of 20th century would also be cool, since you could include some of the first automobiles and so on.

I think there probably were no phone booths before 20th century. Thomas Edison performed his first successful test of the technique in 1870 or so. I might also be wrong. It happens. =)

#36

Update WIP6:

I am hoping I can finish the main building on the left by tmr and adding some attributes to the painting such as signs, bins, postbox, etc.

Critic welcome. some pointers will be good

#37

Well for me, there’s a number of issues that i saw way back and are still present.

For example the unusual drop off.

The box like composition thats occured due to the 3d geo.

The lit building face in the center, the condensed lights, the flat and blurry textures on the path and road, the deep shadow on the left building from the reflecting trees in the original plate.

The duplicated/mirrored design on the lit face building (center)

The lamps look out of proportion, regarding the three closest; they’re clearly different sizes and shapes, why?? the third lamp is very dark, why?

Over all nice choice of colours, though the lighting is hitting in multiple directions, and the black points are very different from left side to right.

Dave.

#38

[left]Thanks the comment, Dave, do you mind telling me how you will go about fixing this painting from your point of view? :slight_smile: I know there are still a lot of flaw in this painting.

for instance, how would you fix the box like composition? May be I have to looking at it for too long, but it seems to me that the composition is no different from the time before I start using 3d geo as perspective reference.

[/left]

#39

The perspective isn’t the issue, it just seems you’ve relied too much on the geo as a reference to that area, specifically the center/corner building. Its something that tends to happen quite frequently when you use 3d as a reference for lining things up it becomes boxy and sharp which you have to conciously move away from it, i’m a victim of this myself so know how it sneaks up on you with out noticing :slight_smile: try flipping the canvas and working from a flipped version, problem areas will become very noticable. The main issue with me is still the sudden dip, especially the lamps. Regarding the other comments, there pretty self explanatory, ie blurred textures on the road, the path looks too sharp and stretched; notice the black gaps between the slabs.

Honestly, might sound cruel, but i’d start a completely new version with the knowledge of what you’ve learnt from this one.

Dave.

#40

woh, thats is cruel :P!!, I will rather quickly wrap up this project and start a different matte painting using the skills I learnt. Even thou it isn’t perfect, but I don’t want to be a quiter. This project was a huge learning curve for me, to be honest, so I wouldn’t say i wasted my effort.

But honestly, if you were me, u would start from scratch again after gotten so far? Is this painting so bad it is beyond saving?