3D ArtZ Joint Tutorial CD!!! Fast and easy character set up!!!

#1

For an interesting and DIFFERENT fan bone tutorial take a gander at www.3dartz.com
More effective than standard fan bones. Easier and faster than smartskin. It’s the truth!!!
Hash on!
:beer:
Mike Fitz

#2

But if you’re unhappy with it, and you return the CD for a promised refund, Mike will happily ignore your emails and never return your money!!!

You will have to go through a formal complaint with PayPal, but you will never see your money.

Mike will happily accept any suckers who are unfamiliar with rigging a “fan” and sell them a tutorial on his “cog” system.

But it is still just a fan bone, and it is a $30 waste of your money.

If Mike Fitzgerald would like for me to “shut-up”, he can return my money like he promised…

#3

William, what do you have selective memory? Or did you forget about what you did to me? Had you just acted in a professional and respectable manner - I would have played ball.
Anyone interested in seeing what sort of professional William is please visit
www.3dartz.com/Shoulder.html

Now, this is all I’m going to say on this for now…
if you feel you can criticize my techniqueWilliam (which is different and better than regular fan bones), you’re going to have to show some samples that perform as well or better than my samples. And then you can show us how you did it instead of the partial incomplete work you’ve offered.
Why don’t you show us some samples of your Hippo man moving… or maybe you have not finished smartskinning him.
Who knows… but also, who cares.

:applause:

Mike Fitz

#4

so, you unilaterally decided to penalize william $30 because he wrote a crushing review of your product. did your money back guarantee only cover people who were mildly unhappy with your product? :curious:

i can’t speak to the quality of mike’s tutorial, as my criticism of his marketing practices has recently compelled him to refuse my money.

in the end, i’m prolly better off.

-jon

ps: william’s hippo guy kicks butt!

#5

Jon, I was waiting for this too.
Please point out to the great people of the hash community where the problem is with my marketing practices.
I send a couple emails here and there about a product that is different and a product that works…
I mean you are a typing contradiction.
At one time you say it’s my marketing practices… Show us or shut up.
the next time you’re saying I’m not allowed to offer a product because I have not payed my dues. - what the heck are you talking about? What dues? Is this a frat? Are dues like a code red? It’s not in the manual but it’s just understood.
Let’s see some moving joint samples from you.
Ans. the questions… until then you’re blowing smoke.
Mike

#6

Mike,

From your post here it almost sounds like you purposely didn’t refund someone’s money (because they hurt you in some way). If this is the case, then I would have to say that shows bad business practice. If that is not the case, then maybe you better clarify your return policy.

I’m not trying to take sides, but your post sounded kinda bad (business wise).

#7

that’s fair… this is a new list. my argument, in a nutshell, is here:

http://www.bluemoonrising.com/darkly/word.html

if people really want to hear every word i and others have written on this tired subject, they can visit the killernuts archive:

http://venice.killernuts.org/animaster/list.php3?qType=contents&qLogic=OR&query=cogs+3dartz

i can’t add anything more to the record.

-jon

#8

Once you offered to refund my money, I admitted to you that my criticism went a little overboard. I took-down the “critique” movie, and I sent you the action file–because you asked me to, under the pretense that you needed to examine it in order to correct any flaws in your rig.

I emailed you the file, and I mailed you your disk back the next day, first class.

I refrained from discussing it any further on the list, since you had promised me a refund, I figured you were all right, and that I was wrong for trashing you.

As the weeks dragged by, I kept checking my mail, but no refund. I emailed you–no response. I emailed again–no response.

A few weeks later you post an outrageous defense of your product full of suppositions about my motives, and speculation of why I use the “Fitzman” character on the disk and not the “McKnuckles” character.–which you claim wouldn’t have “popped” the way the Fitzman character did. This personal attack on me was completely untrue–and you knew it. You posted your defense, but didn’t put your “McKnuckles” through the identical action (that I had sent to you to examine, at your request). In fact, you only wanted the action file so that you could try to fake a defense of your worthless product.

I contacted Paypal–too much time had gone by, but they promised to add my complaint to your file. Meanwhile, I have no way to get my money back from you.

Everytime I see you soliciting your product, I email you and remind you that you’ve yet to send me my $30. No response.

Whether or not you think my opinion of your rig is fair, unfair, biased, whatever. You have not lived up to your obligations as a businessman. You promised me a refund if I returned your disk. I did.

I returned your disk. I took down my critique.
I accused you of being a “con man” in my original review of your “cog joint” tutorial. But you turned out to be worse than that…

#9

Well actually in the legalesse it states that there are no refunds. Just replacements.
That being so, it’s up to me about refunds.
I will, on a case to case basis, give a refund.
But Williams intentions were to absolutely halt sales by depicting me as a fraud without giving the material a chance.
That’s just wrong. And it was blatant too. You see he sent me the action file he made for that bogus movie and it was a total set up. Why, you ask? Throught out the arm movement he had elbows bending backwayrds, arms moving out of the range of motion…
That model was to be used as an intro to the instructions… I mean, the chest is wider then the lenght of the arms!!!
C’mon.
What can I say…
I’m not careless… I had this information reviewed and I was nice enough to turn my head from this.
Now I hear he wants to write a book!!! That would explain his change of attitude. He’s basically trying to do a pr job for himself… so that when the book comes out (yeah okay) no one remembers the rotten things he did.
Well guess what. I’ll be there. You can believe it.
Mike

#10

William, the action file you used is the best evidence of your malitious intentions.
It is doing things that people can’t do. If you want me to I’ll post screen caps from it and post it
to further support my gripe.
Bottom line is this… William didn’t like what I was doing and went to extremes to stop me, just because
he didn’t like the idea of offering products on the hash elist.
William, seriously, think about it. Are you suprised that I’m treating you like a kid. - Ans. that.
Mike

#11

You specifically asked me to send you back the disk, and that when I did you would send me back my money.

I don’t know or care what “legalese” you’re referring to, but where I’m from the word is “Liar”. You are a liar.

All of my tutorials are free. In fact I have posted my feelings about what I think of “paid tutorial” prior to you coming out with yours. That’s why you claimed (fairly) that I was prejudiced against your product. I’m not writing a book…

I will stop hounding you when you live up to your promise.

#12

Dude, so you are admitting that you didn’t give the product a shot.
That you were biased.
And now you are saying that I have wronged you.
You ought to be ashamed of yourself.
Someone just posted and interesting thing to the hash list that your tute was incomplete. That was the first thing I thoought when I read it. I just wanted someone else to point it out.

That is the difference between a paid tute and a free tute.

As for my product… you can’t deny this… It works and what I say on my web page is true.
My product works. You can continue to say what you want, but you can’t change the fact that it works.
Also, when do we get to see the hippo move? I bet you can’t do anything with it cause it is taking you soooo long
to set smartskin up.
Is anyone else reading this besides me, jon and william? Probably not, but I can’t blame them. This convo needs to take place in a bar over some beers!

Mike

#13

Im still reading this basically because I’m getting a good laugh at it.

Mike, you basically admit your policy of exchanges, but have not returned an exchange for the cd William has sent you or money back - basically breaking your agreement. (I am assuming since you haven’t argued the point that William did send you the CD and his files).

In fact - you have wronged him, By your own “legaleese”.

User’s express different opinions about products that they have received, some like it, some don’t. Some post good reviews, some post bad reviews. It’s the business game.

Send him his $30 back, or send him a “replacement” CD. If you send him his $30 back, you can always say he just took a quick look at it and thats what his opinions are based off of. If you send him the replacement Cd, then be prepared for criticism…

#14

If I’m a liar William, then what the heck are you?
You just admitted that you were biased before you bought it.
So you bought the cd for the sole purpose of gaining leverage in an argument to the tune of
“I bought this product and it does not work.”
You knowingly lied about your expereince in order to manipulate the perceptions of others.
I business terms- other potential customers. In legal terms… we’d be discussing this in NY small claims court.

You are a liar
and
a despicable member of our community.

You seem like that type that checks emails every second of the day. Attention starved.
Again, I ask for wireframe renders of your hippo matching my characters movements.
I’m calling you out. Here’s your chance for attention.
And Jon at http://www.bluemoonrising.com/darkly/
you should feel free to do the same. I’ve seen nothing from you guys. I’m getting the feeling that you are all talk and no show.

#15

hey mike… check the timestamps on your messages… it seems you have little else to do today as well. :rolleyes:

you, however, just seem starved for abuse.

:wip: :wip: :wip:

-jon

#16

Yeah, I know it’s a slow day. I’m just going through some venting!
I’m am now leaving… but I admit I really like this forum.
Kinda like a new toy. Anyhows… Still waiting for you guys to dazzle me with your skills.
Instead of just saying how my “marketing” practices make my joint set up not work.
I mean, you guys are grasping at straws.
At some point in the future someone else just like me is going to approach the list with a new helpful product.
And I hope that my expereince will make it easier for people who want to make knowledge available to people who want to learn… And hopefully you guys will be a thing of the past.
While the hash community is going through some changes… I’ll be there until I check off planet.

Mike

#17

Mike what are you doing buddy!

You dont need this, is giving up your integrity worth $30, your better then that!! Ask yourself what have you done to encourage your hash mate to keep plugging away on their project? Your like a few sentence of calling them a loser, and you dont need that on your character either. Do the peacefull thing and give them what they want, and avoid stripping of one character. This is making both parties look bad and he admitted that the trashing he did to you was wrong. And I know your man enough to follow thru what is the right thing to do.

“be peacefull toward all men as far as it depend on you”

#18

Give me my money back!

If I need to prove my commitment to the A:M community, I will gladly run over you with my car.

Any challenge from you is silly. I have seen your work. You have seen mine. we both have websites.

Since you didn’t give me my money back as promised, and have no intention too-- Let anyone else who considers buying your product think twice about YOUR idea of customer service.

As for community service to A:M, the community think what they will…
:thumbsdow

#19

One thing I find interesting is that Mike hasn’t yet responded to the claim that he offered a refund to William.

Regardless of what you think of his motives, Mike, did you offer to give him his money back? If so, why hasn’t it been done? It sounds like William has done a lot for you in good faith…apologizing for being overbearing in his crit, taking down the crit page, sending the action file at your request, etc. When is there going to be some good faith shown on your side? At this stage, I think the issue has very little to do with his opinion of your tutorial or his ability to match your cogs with anything he’s done, and everything to do with keeping your word as a business owner.

Regardless of what the “legalese” says, William claims that you offered a refund. If you made no such offer, then say so. If you did, then explain why you haven’t followed through.

#20

William should get his refund, regardless of his intentions. Businesses shouldn’t refuse a refund because their feelings were hurt. This alone makes me want to steer clear of any future products you release.