Xsi ???


you have object motion blur, scene motion blur and vector motion blur which is pretty slick i guess…anyways they improved it…depends on when people were complaining i guess.


the vector moblur works very well in my opinion. and besides, even without it, a simple post plugin like Reelsmart Motionblur for After Effects/Combustion can add fairly convincing motionblur to an animation.


scene motion blur is old and has always worked perfect—
Vector motion blur does not work in every occasion (with overlapping Motion) but its a nifty shortcut to rendertimes–
could it be that you meant complaining about DOF?
There was a lot of shortcoming there until-- well,
We have a usable DOF since Rel.8 (or was it 8.5), but it is not as good as Mental Ray (but faster).



Maybe it was DOF. The ONE little example on the website doesn’t look too bad. I guess I’d be more interested to see an example of it being used in animation.

Anyone use both mental ray and c4d’s renderer? Any speed comparisons? Quality comparisons?

And what about mocca 2? Could I get by without messiah or motionbuilder now?


One man’s hell is another mans heaven. Me for one, look for terms like “polygon/face”, “point/vertex”, “move”, “extrude”, and so on when I get into an application, as these are terms common in most 3D applications. The first time I fired up C4D I got totally annoyed as none of the icons had a nametag popping up next to the mouse, and I didn’t catch the little message box in the bottom left corner on my 1600 x 1280 laptop screen. It took some time before I learnt its possible to have the name of the tool next to its icon.

Icons have to be interpreted to get its meaning, while text is normally read and understood straight away. Combined though, it will assist the user in finding the right tool, and then memorizing its “picture” for later access means faster searching. But initially, icons on their own take longer time to interpret and learn.

A good interface is all founded on good structure, not pretty graphics, so in that sense I would say both XSI and LightWave have very good interfaces as the features are categorized in sensible containers (drop down menus in XSI and tabbed menus in LightWave).

Just my thoughts as an interface designer…


The beauty of Cinema’s interface, IMHO, is that you can configure it in virtually any way. Too bad more people don’t take advantage of this.


Keep in mind that XSI also has a customizable interface, not like C4Ds. It is rather cumbersome to use, but works and works great. You can also create custom tools, by either scripting them or just drop and drag scripts in some combo and make one super tool, and use your own icons if you wish.



I have afriend who is totally into Mental Ray (for Max).
Its hard to colmpare.
I usually beat him a lot in speed ( by a lot),
but when you are willing to spend some time on MR and have a renderFarm (he has around 20 machines) MR kicks ass.
My opinion:
if you have renderpower & Money & time to dig into MR it produces a quality no other renderer can.
This is not the case with me, but might for you–

As for Mocca:
it seems you can get by without outside help if you are after a little CA.
IK and setup have dramatically improved, have not tested the motionmapper , though-- if it works it as advertised it takes some advantage from MB away–
For poweruser:
I would not want to do without MB.

The timeline is the remaining problem in C4D- until they address it, C4D is clumsy for character animation compared to XSI or MB.



k, so its been a while since ive posted…and as good as xsi is, im tired of this price drop bullshit…ok so like $450, big deal…the package you get with this is about equivelent to the core application of c4d (which is 695…befor student discount) and then you can upgrade xsi…much like c4d…except the highest level of xsi is like $6000 where as c4d is 2500…so drop that stupid price drop…its nice…opens up accessability…but its old news…


I think you need to look closely, as Foundation would be comparable to XL not the core. You don’t get Cloth or CA tools with the core, nor do you get GI and advance render capablility with the core. Also, that $6000 upgrade to Advance includes a built-in compositor, Hair, SyFlex Cloth, ODE RGB, RIG SDK, and I think 10 MR license. In which case the Studio would be comparable at $2500, + $395 for Shave, + $1000 to $3000 for a node based compositior equal to the one in XSI, so whan it comes down to it you are paying about the same in the end.


“That price is for a non-upgradeable, non-updateable version” (XSI foundation)

“There’s a sucker born every minute”

'Nuff said.


tjnyc - you beat me to that very same fact. Also with foundations you get two cpus for rendering which you don’t get with core of C4D

Also there is the benefit of learning XSI for employment. I think this is the reason for the price drop. XSI gets in the hands of more users and employers have a larger pool of users to choose from.

I think if you’re interested in work at a studio XSI is a steal. If you’re looking to be a one man studio C4D is the way to go b/c of price and speed in workflow.

While I think that C4D is on the rise at the moment I would choose Foundations to get a job and C4D for contract work.

Don’t get me wrong I’m not knocking C4D but the fact is in the US market there isn’t a demand for it right now.


Where are you getting that from? I thought I heard the oppisite.


Messiah’s character stuff is more elegant than Mocca, but to be quite honest, you can “get by” with Mocca 1 already, and Mocca 2 is, based on my initial experimentation with the demo version, considerably easier… and I still don’t even know what all of the new stuff really is yet, just some of the obvious ones like pole vectors (HUGE difference from up-vectors to pole vectors). I haven’t even tried out FK/IK blending yet.


Several folks at XSIBase heard the opposite from Soft customer support, so you probably thought correctly.


Any bets that their will be a price war SOON.


I agree that Foundations is closer to the XL Bundle than the base module, but you have to consider that with the base module you get a three-seat net render license, which in effect gives you up to 8 cpus (three dualies for clients plus the main machine). With Foundations you are limited to 2 cpus and it will cost you an arm and a leg to expand beyond that. For me personally that totally rules out Foundations as an option.


Just to complete the info: C4D natively supports up to 16 CPU’s on each machine. So if Apple would for instance come out with a quad machine, you could still use all CPU’s without any additional charge.



5… 4… 3… 2…



Oops, I meant you get a three-set license with the XL Bundle–not the base module.