voting bug?

#114

Hi there,

I haven’t posted anything for quite long time and so I was very surprised by that change of voting. Well, finally I found in this thread what happened… I just wanted to say something, even though it might sound a bit silly… I know everyone here wants to see something awesome, a ‘five star work’ - but I though this site was also for users that aren’t so good, those who want to learn and get better - and it was always so challenging to put artwork in the gallery and wait for others oppinion. Most of the time there is no single comment by works that aren’t breathtaking and so ‘stars system’ was usefull at least in one thing - people who didn’t comment, usually voted and so we knew some ‘ranking’. It made us work hard and wish for more stars with new work (surely stars aren’t everything, but still they had sense). Now when people can only ‘love it’, we know nothing. Because as I said, most of works of us ‘still more or less average’ don’t get commets. It’s just a point of view, but it’s a bit frustrating sometimes. Hope you won’t mind what I wrote, it was just a quick thought :slight_smile: (sorry for my english)

#115

Well just read my previous post… YOU CAN VOTE WITH A RATING FROM 1-5 if you leafe a message! and sorry if i say this again… this is the best thing ever!

You don’t have do be afraid anymore to submit an artwork to the forum and to get pushed down by jealous people! And this happend to a lot of People… and not only guys like you and me, but for example : pascal blanché, Krishnamurti Costa… Philip Straub… to name just a few.

I remember watching the gals and saw a lot of 4-5 star artworks maybe 5 in a row … and reallly! these where good works worthy of the voting!

After a few hours i was watching a guy who went to all the threads… and after watching… the Voting was pushed down for all of them.

Now you have to get more than 20 votes until your vote get’s visible… and this makes it almost impossible to push votes down… except for the users who have more then 10 identities :wink:

And after watching the first results:

[ul]
[li]far more images posted in the forum for consideration (not only in the portfolio)[/li][li]more feedback on the images (i guess because we are looking more at the thumbnails right now and not at the voting as previosly[/li][li]more frondpage plugs[/li][li]And more quality image in the Choice gal[/li][/ul]Call me an Idiot but i was praying for a change like that a long time!

-Alex

#116

vampeta: I’m sorry if it wasn’t understandable… now I’m a bit confused - there is some chance to see votes that pictures got? Because I see everything without any ranking and it would be strange if those pictures didn’t have at least those 20 votes… maybe mistake is on my side… or you meant only votes on cg awards (so just 5 stars) are visible? Well, that would make sense :slight_smile:

But in general - what I was talking about were works of ‘not famous artists’ (so there was no reason to put the work down by jealous people) and if people can vote while leaving a comment, so this is also what I mentioned - because sometimes people just don’t leave ANY comment… to be honest it happened to me many times and if I got for example 3 stars before, at least I knew it might be better done than pic that got nothing… well, everyone is learning…

I said it might sound silly (and maybe I just misunderstood something before), don’t worry about it :slight_smile:

#117

No Problem my friend… I am not a moderator and i figured these things out by myself the last days :wink: so… welcome to the club! :beer:

Most of the artworks did not get so much votings to become visible… you can see this in the Choice Gal… a lot of Artworks lost their stars… that does not mean they don’t have them anymore… they are just invisible untile some more Folks vote for them.

I think it will take a few month until the comunity get’s use to this new System… and after that it will be the BEST on the whole Internet :slight_smile:

Take care
-Alex

-Alex

#118

I dont even understand the rating system now. I either know where it is explained. Now I only see 5 stars rating or no stars

I dont understand anything. Before I knew that 3 star works were good, and 4 star works were really good, and some of them amazing. And it worked for me, it was a nice guideline around the 90% of the time. And the complaint I see mostly among the moderators are “nice works rated bad”, maybe meaning that not even one work was rated with 5 stars.

Well, the solution is easy, make works 5 stars when rated above 4. Add a 0 stars rating, and when average is above 0, that stands as for 1 star. Between 1 and 2, is 2 stars, and so on. No rating, or average is a round 0, then no stars.

So now the problem might be, many trolls voting 0 stars? Ok, we can apply the average system compared to number of posts, or/and start showing stars when a fairly amount of votes are calculated, lets say 10. And we can make an axception with the 0 star voting making it even wider, so 1 star requires an average between 0.5 and 1, and not 0 and 1 like before.

I think all these sum a nice filtering, taking into account all the votes and ratings in a fair way. If maybe the weighting of number of posts versus rating influence is too exagerated, you can cut that influence into half, so people doesnt feel so excluded, but makes you still feel to be more participative, which is a nice thing for the forum. well this is my opinion

#119

I thought for sure by now it would have been changed back, it seemed like MOST everyone agreed it completely sucked but understood we should give it time to catch on/improve. Well, from what I have seen it’s worse now than it was right when they switched it. Pretty lame. Oh well.

#120

Fixed your post for you.

If you’re going to make statements as if they were facts, then please get them right. If what you said were true there certainly would be more than the 40-ish people posting in this thread about how much they truly dislike the system. Of the 40-ish people that did post, not all of them are expressing a dislike of the system. So, less than 40 of the hundreds of thousands of people who visit the site share your opinion. The rest are OK with the change or don’t care enough to post an opinion.

#121

so now voting is exclusive to members?
what stands “I love it” for? Does that have any meaning?
Yesterday I saw an awarded work with 0 stars… isnt it like a paradox?

uhm I guess many people dont even know where to find this thread, it took me a while.

#122

You’re kidding right? Have you re-read this thread lately? Instead of “fixing my post” (acting like an eight year old), why don’t you keep your cool and understand there are people who don’t like this system and have good reasons not to. Perhaps you could take that view into consideration with the goal of improving the system instead of getting your panties in a bundle everytime someone disagrees.

Of the 40-ish people that did post, not all of them are expressing a dislike of the system.

Instead of saying everyone I should have said most everyone. Good catch. Your argument about small percentages is stupid, though, and either way there is a group of cgsociety members who don’t like it. That should matter to you.

So, less than 40 of the hundreds of thousands of people who visit the site share your opinion. The rest are OK with the change or don’t care enough to post an opinion.

Or have not see this thread. Or have an opinion on the system but for one of another infinite reasons don’t care to post (whether they like it or don’t like it). All we KNOW is that from the people who have posted, more are saying it sucks. Quit wasting your energy trying to make a pointless theory about numbers of people on either side.

<3

#123

I didn’t say that. But yes, you have to be logged in to vote on a thread. Now I’ve said it.

what stands “I love it” for?
That means that you love it, as opposed to not loving it.
Does that have any meaning?
As much meaning as stars do. You’ve never loved something?
Yesterday I saw an awarded work with 0 stars… isnt it like a paradox?
A self-contradiction? No. To be a true paradox, the exceptional work would have to make the statement of it being inferior work and not the member voting system doing so. I’m not sure how that would be possible but if someone can pull it off I think it’d be rather exceptional artistic statement.
uhm I guess many people dont even know where to find this thread, it took me a while.
Maybe so, but you’d think they’d start another thread in another part of the forum if they really wanted their voice to be heard. So, finding the thread or not, the fact remains that very few have expressed a disliking to the new system after months of it being active.

#124

As much meaning as stars do. You’ve never loved something?

This is a terrible argument. There are multiple opinions expressed on this very thread saying why the star system was more meaningful than the… “I love it” system to some members. To refresh your memory here is a post on this thread I made months ago:

I mean, 4 and 5 star threads always got my attention and were almost always excellent in the old system. 3 star threads were generally average/good and I was happy to get rated 3 stars on any of my works, and then there were 1-2 stars which were poor, or poser or something, and I could easily avoid looking at any of it.

Now there are rarely any stars on any image, and as also pointed out multiple times on this thread, there are (imo) non-deserving works sporting 5 stars.

#125

BenCole - I kid quite often, but in this case … no I’m not. We take all suggestions quite seriously around here and we do listen to what user’s have to say. Many features of the site come from user suggestions or discussions among the FL staff (who are users also). I’ll correct your post if I see you’re trying to propagate false information. There is no evidence that “everyone” or “most people” share your opinion about the new system. Strong evidence to suggest those statements would be seen in a thread that is thousand’s of posts long. Or multiple threads appearing on the forums (anywhere not just in Support) with the same subject. More interest is shown here daily in discussions about the front page plugs or newest movie releases than there is in this subject. That’s not an overwhelming response in favor of the opinion you support.

I never said that the opinions didn’t matter to me. I said the opinion of a small percentage is not going to change anyone’s minds here. We cannot please everyone with everything that we do around here. That’s an impossible task in any situation. For example: A small percentage of folks don’t like the latest front page plugs. A small percentage of folks don’t like smilies in posts. A small percentage of folks don’t like cheese on their sandwiches. Should we not post front page plugs, have smilies or make cheese for sandwiches because of these minority opinions? No.

Now if you want to continue calling me stupid or insensitive to the question or opinions, then that is your choice. But until you can prove otherwise, your arguments are the proof of your own stupidity and stubbornness within the discussion. There is no evidence to support your statements other than your opinion and the opinion of a small handful of members (by comparison to the total number of people who are allowed to post here).

Am I wrong?

#126

I’ll correct your post if I see you’re trying to propagate false information.

Back at you. For starters: I never called you stupid. If an argument you made was stupid or terrible in my opinion, I said so. On the same note, I would like to thank you for calling me stupid (among other things) in the very same post you lied about me calling you stupid. Comical.

I went ahead and corrected the post in question.

Alright, fine, we have no way of knowing how much of the community (or even if it’s a significant portion at all) likes, dislikes, or doesn’t care about the new system.

All I know is my experience on the portions of the site affected has become worse. To the point that I will whine about it on the internet. Also, I feel like some arguably valid points have been made about the new system (since the get go) that have not been addressed or taken into consideration. The fact is, I think the same glaring problems that existed right when the switch was made are still there, glaring away, waiting to be fixed. If I didn’t think this system sucked, I wouldn’t be wasting my time letting you know.

Am I wrong?

I believe you are. You said there is no evidence to support my statements? What about when I said:

All we KNOW is that from the people who have posted, more are saying it sucks.

You want evidence? Go count.

So unless am I as stupid and stubborn as you seem to believe, perhaps you should consider admitting that MAYBE there are some problems with the new system.

#127

BenCole - I’ve read this thread. I’ve read many threads on CGTalk. That’s my job here. If there was an overwhelming opinion that the system “sucked” then I’m sure I’d have heard it by now (outside of this thread). I don’t agree that there is one beyond the grumblings in this thread.

I’ve also counted already. As stated, there are roughly 40 individual users who have posted in this thread. I’ve been an active poster in the thread. And as such, I’ve read it many times. I don’t think you have or you’re not understanding the opinions and comments of those who disagree with you.

I get that you don’t like the system. I get that a few others don’t like the system either. That point is not in debate here. We get it. The point is, not enough people have expressed their displeasure with the system for it to be a topic of debate among the FL and Admin staff here (for the purpose of changing it again or back to the way that it was).

But please … go right ahead and continue to counter me with childish retorts such as “back at you”, skirting the issue of what the definition of calling someone stupid is or diluting the discussion of quantities of how many people dislike the system based upon your own opinion. Don’t forget to throw more random red herrings into the discussion like a quote that’s already been addressed on more than one instance in this thread. That always helps us when we consider the validity of the issue at hand.

#128

I’ve read this thread.

Prove it! (note the sarcasm, it’s the same as the sarcasm I used when I asked the RHETORICAL QUESTION “have you even read this thread?” earlier)

I get that a few others don’t like the system either.

Since you’ve counted, you know it’s more than a few. Regardless, there are people upset with it, and that should count for something.

go right ahead and continue to counter me with childish retorts such as “back at you”

Ok, we (by we I mean you) need to lay off the name calling, it gets nowhere, it’s what’s actually childish here. You don’t know me and I don’t know you. I don’t care which one of us is more mature, I’ll I am going to say is I have not called you anything or tried to judge your character. Also, I am no more guilty than you from straying from the issue at hand.

Kirt - maybe admitting there MIGHT BE some problems with the current system is too big of a first step to you. Maybe it would be easier for you to just try to admit it’s not perfect.

Let’s try to be friends.

-Ben

#129

During the period of time before we changed the voting system, more people told us that they hated the old system than have told us that they hate the new system. Unfortunately we’re not omnipotent and cannot please everybody at the same time. One way or another we’re going to be robbing Peter to pay Paul. Unfortunately Peter often seems to be the small vocal minority who will never be satisfied with anything we do, and constantly finds fault with little things which really don’t matter that much in the greater scheme of things.

#130

That’s quite a lot of words just to call me a negative nancy.

Anyway, I’ve said my piece. I think there was some validity to some of the points brought up (not necessarily by me), and I still don’t like it, but I can deal with it.

The truth is, since I have found this community I have LOVED IT (obviously, it kicks ass), this is the first time I believe I have voiced my opinion much less have a negative opinion about the site.

-Ben

#131

You assume too much. That’s the problem here. I never said the system was perfect. I never said there were no faults. I said the same thing consistently.

“There are not enough people complaining about the current system to warrant a change again.”

Where do you figure that 40-ish people complaining about this constitutes as “more than a few”? I don’t understand how less than 50 out of 300,000 registered members (or if you want a smaller figure to look at … 1,000 currently online members) who might express an opinion about this constitutes as “more than a few”. Less than 5% (in the best possible slant that I can offer your view) does not classify as a majority in any respect.

Explain yourself … please.

#132

I’ve never been notorious for my brevity.

#133

Kirt - I have explained my point many times. I understand your point of view, please try harder to understand mine, and quit saying “40 people think this, 100000000 think that.” That’s stupid, I was never trying to convince you a certain number of people were on my side, it seems to me the general consensus of this topic was a negative reaction to the new system, but I am aware I can only speak for myself - so take my opinion as my opinion and quit throwing meaningless numbers at me.

Khendar - Nothing wrong with that.

Also, let’s knock off the hostile bullshit and be friends, I really am not here to piss you guys off, I just don’t like the new system.