So the DAVE school...

#21

Hello,

My name is Michael Davidson and I graduated from the DAVE School in Q1 of 2006. I was in a class of about 18 students and felt that my time and money were very well spent at the school. The staff were all industry professionals and really took the time to develop the strengths that each of us had as students. As a working professional now for over 8 years I have maintained a personal and professional relationship with most of the people, both students and staff, that I met at the school. Jeff Sheetz has done a great thing by pulling all of the resources and assets together there and I am proud to recommend the school to anyone who is very serious about learning the skills necessary to enter the entertainment industry.

Let me be perfectly clear … this school is not for everyone. One can not expect to simply float though some classes here and walk out with a sweet gig in the industry. This school can only return to you whatever efforts you put into it. If you are serious and really want to be a prat of this industry then you have to work for it - and if you are willing to do so then the DAVE School will be an amazing experience. I was able to achieve what I have in my career due to the training and industry contacts that I made at the school during my time there. Not to toot my own horn but if you want to get a better sense of what I have done since graduating the DAVE School then please take a look at my IMDB page (http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2752412/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1) or my personal site (http://3dartguy.wix.com/3dartguy2013). I would be happy to answer any questions you might have or your daughter might have and you may contact me directly if you choose to do so (michael@3dartguy.com).

Everyone’s experience will be different, of course. As far as placement is concerned - while I am not privy to the exact numbers of graduates working right out of school or how long it took to get that first gig I can tell you that my first gig came within two weeks of leaving the school and moving to Los Angeles. It was a direct result of the time and effort I put forth at the school. From my class I know that for a few of us, after they worked for a while they decided that the industry life was not for them and they have moved on to other things in their lives. For the rest of us - we have all been working regularly and all viewed our time and experience at the DAVE School to be very positive.

The placement number is quite high from the school and I can understand someone who has not attended or graduated from the program to be suspicious - but the commitment to the students at the DAVE School does not end when they get the tuition payment or when the student graduates … all of the staff takes a very personal interest in the success of each one of us!

I hope that your daughter finds the right place for her training and if it is to be the DAVE School then I would expect that her experience is similar to my own.

Cheers!

Michael

I hope I can be of assistance to you and your daughter as you both try to select what will be the best source for her education and entry into the industry!

#22

Jimi, I really appreciate you registering just to provide me with your feedback! We honestly can’t wait to do the tour of the DAVE school over the summer. I understand the VFX program is different than their Game Development program, but I am being very open and optimistic.

Thank you for sharing your story and congratulations on your success! If it’s ok with you I will definitely reach out if I have any further questions.

Charles

#23

Everything I had heard about placement seems dead on. I had no reason to doubt it because I have read so many amazing things from DAVE school graduates like yourself. We’ll be definitely packing up the “fam” and traveling down for a tour over the summer. It would be interesting to know which companies picked up the video game graduates. I’m sure that’s information I can find out on the tour, but if you happen to know and would share, that would also be appreciated. Thanks for the feedback, really appreciate it!

Charles

#24

Game studios, from what we’ve discovered, are the same way. Demo Reel/Work trumps degree every time it seems. Thank you for chiming in!

Charles

#25

Yeah it is always good to talk to graduates that is what I do. I mean I go hardcore research and more research.

#26

No need to apologize for the post, I’ve read it multiple times and WOW! I just wish I had the time to write back a response of that magnitude. :slight_smile: You have no idea how we appreciate you sharing your success story. If it’s ok with you, I might reach out to you in the future with some more questions, etc…? My daughter’s new computer is almost assembled and I’m going to have her register with CGTalk so she can start asking more questions and gathering information. She probably has questions I haven’t even thought of asking. :slight_smile:

Thanks so much Daniel!

Charles

#27

Josh, thanks for the post, and you are correct. It is the journey, not the destination. There really are no boundaries because she will be enhancing her already admirable creative skills that can be applied to a wide-range of available fields. I went to a 2 year college simply for the piece of paper. It was my creative skills I had been nurturing from an early age that lead me to my career.

Thanks again,

Charles

#28

I’m sure the game development industry is just as tough. Thank you for bringing up the importance of networking. I’m going to be passing this entire thread onto my daughter so she can read, review and sign in. I’m sure she will have more questions to ask, so thank you for being open for discussion. :slight_smile: Really appreciated!

Charles

#29

Jeff, Thank you for getting involved in the discussion and providing the placement statistics! My daughter is extremely excited about coming down to see the DAVE school, and quite honestly so are we. I’m an old Lightwave guy (think Video Toaster) and have watched more than a handful of William “Proton” Vaughan’s tutorials online. Hopefully he will be there and I can say “Howdy”. :slight_smile: I know the game development track is new, but can’t wait to learn more about it.

Sincerely,

Charles

#30

Great info to bring up! We have already done some preliminary research for obtaining a loan through our local bank branch. They actually seem to have some flexible options for students, but we still need to do a formal sit-down with them to learn more. Although the DAVE school is expensive for their 12-15 month programs, it’s not near what an “Art” school would cost over the course of 4 years. You’re talking 40k vs 120k-200k.

Thank you very much for the feedback

Charles

#31

Hi Charles -

I am a DAVE graduate from 2004. The school was a little different back then, but still - money well spent. There’s also something to be said that some of the staff are still there, even after 10 years in the industry. Yes, that’s correct. I got a job within a month of graduating, and even though I switched jobs once since then, I’m still in it.

I was 34 when I enrolled, choosing a different career and looking for an educational opportunity - I do better with instructor-led classes than on my own. I toured a couple of schools when I was looking, both 4-year programs and DAVE school. DAVE appealed because I already had quite a bit of college under my belt, and wasn’t looking forward to retaking a lot of ‘common core’ that is required in the 4-year programs. DAVE offered a 1-year, tech-school experience, and was able to transfer enough of my credits to get me an associate’s. They also gave me an intense, 1-year education specifically in cg - and the program was designed to give me exposure to as many elements of the process as possible (A generalist study). What that gives the aspiring artist is the chance to figure out where their strengths are, and what aspects of the pipeline they want to really pursue, whether it’s modeling, animating, rigging, texturing, lighting, or what-have-you. It is NOT a 1-year modeling program, it’s a 1 year generalist program.

They also offered me the chance to stay on and take a (free at the time) Maya course upon graduation, as their primary software for the main curriculum back then was LightWave.

I never intended to move to LA and make movies. But I did head back home to the northeast, and found employment at a small ad agency within one month of my return. I worked with them for three years, and then moved to a position at a DoD contractor, and I’ve been there ever since. I also was nudged by William Vaughan (from the school) to write for then-industry magazine HDRI-3D, and I did a number of feature articles for them. It gave me the opportunity to talk to and meet a number of the ‘movie houses’ and ad agencies in our industry, helping me to network in a way that not every school can provide. I should probably note that the DAVE school didn’t get me my job at the ad agency. I got me that job. But they gave me the tools to back myself up, and to interview confidently.

I’d like to expand on that. Attending a school isn’t JUST about the classes or the teachers, though DAVE has both of those in spades. It also isn’t JUST about the dollar value - I wasn’t looking for a ‘budget education’ here. I wanted quality and was willing to pay for it. But I also want to know I’m getting my money’s worth in the end. I can’t tell you that your daughter will be the best cg artist ever (that’s your job :wink: ), but I can tell you that the DAVE education is a quality one, and that she’ll get out of it what she puts into it. If she slacks off, she won’t do well. If she does the bare minimum of what’s required, she’ll be ‘okay’. But if she spends her time focused on her education, and practices in the off-hours when she’s not in the classroom setting, DAVE can feed her mind quite well.

Another thing DAVE offered that I think some institutions might fall short on, is the networking. Many times, someone will get a job not just because they’re a talented artist, but because of who they know, and who THOSE people know. The staff at DAVE are industry pros - they know people. And those people know people. The responses you’re seeing on this very thread are testament to that. I didn’t happen across it - I was ‘pinged’ and alerted to it. Networking in this industry isn’t the end-all-beat-all, but it is so very important, and DAVE has it.

I suppose the reason you’re looking for opinions from people on here (and your daughter isn’t… yet) is because you’re footing the bill. Is it money well-spent? I think so. Will DAVE provide what they state? In my experience, they did. I am proud enough of the school that I recommend it to others who are seeking the tech-school style education.

If you’d like to contact me with further questions, feel free. And I wish you and your daughter the best, no matter what school you choose.

#32

Of course Charles, whenever you have any doubts of anything you can either message me through LinkedIn, or shoot me an email address to "daniellopezjr@gmail.com", DAVE School is like a huge happy family, any of us I’m sure would be more than glad to answer any of your doubts!

  • Daniel Lopez de Medrano
#33

Not going to re-hash everything that has already been said. Just gonna throw out a few thoughts. (From 2004 8)

There are 3 things that I feel the DAVE School offered me, that I wasn’t likely to get anywhere else:

  1. Real World experience. The Instructors had worked in the industry, so they were well-equipped to prepare us for what was coming. So much so, that my first job out of the school, actually felt like the Fourth Block (the Final Project). It was nearly identical in every way, except I was getting paid for it.

  2. Networking. They have a ton of contacts throughout the film industry. I knew that going in. What I was surprised to learn was they also have contacts in games. A guest instructor came through while I was around, and I got to know him, and learn from him. A year later he offered me a job.

  3. After graduation support. One of the best parts, was getting to come back to the school to continue to learn, while I worked on things on my own. They also had a few different opportunities for me to earn a bit of money while I learned. I saw that someone mentioned the TA thing as a negative, but I’d like to give another spin on it. I was one. It wasn’t because I couldn’t get a job elsewhere. It was a place to continue to learn and work on my skills while getting paid and looking for the next job. As soon as work was found, they pushed me away. (Hopefully to make spot for the next guy 8) It wasn’t a job or TA…It was TA till I found a job.

DAVE School was one of the best decisions I’ve ever made. (Worked at Monolith Productions for 8 years)

#34

I would like to address a couple of the comments made about The DAVE School regarding jobs and our placement rate. I am the director of career services for The DAVE School and it is my responsibility to help our students find a job after graduation and it’s a responsibility I take pretty seriously. The graduates who know me are familiar with my work ethic and the heights to which I will climb for them. I have helped many of them find not just their first job, but sometimes even their second and third jobs as well. We offer LIFETIME career placement assistance for our graduates and I am happy to help whenever I can. Often I learn about new opportunities from graduates who I have helped in the past
that’s because the DAVE School network is tight and our graduates absolutely love this school as evidenced by the replies. :thumbsup:

It should be noted that nobody coached our graduates on what to say. I simply posted a link on facebook to this thread for ALL of our graduates to see and I mentioned that there was some misinformation being posted on CG Society.

With regards to what types of jobs our graduates are getting
it’s a wide variety of companies who hire them and contrary to popular belief not everyone wants to work in Hollywood. In addition to the many graduates who are currently working in gaming companies and doing VFX for TV and feature films
we have also placed graduates in Military Simulation, architectural visualization, medical animation, 3D print advertising, trial and jury simulations, VFX for commercials, and 3D printing companies.

NO SCHOOL can guarantee job placement but anyone who attends our school should expect an intense year of very fast paced hands on training and the harder a student works the more successful they will be. If anyone has any questions about our placement practices, please message me and I will be happy to answer all questions.

#35

Charles,
I graduated a four year State University in Dec 2004 with a Bachelors Degree in Digital Art. I spent 4 years trying to learn visual effects, buying books, self teaching myself things and all it got me was a pay bump at the Graphics Design job I already had for the last 3 years. I was fed up and began looking around. I toured Dave School and stated 3 months later in March 2005.

I graduated Dave School March 31st 2006 and started April 3rd 2006 in Los Angeles at my first job that I lined up a month earlier with help from the skills I had learned while attending the school, their instructors and most importantly the schools already large network of graduates successfully working in the industry. (The school was barely five years old at this time). I had that job for 2 1/2 years helping create work for Dogfights on the History channel. Since leaving that job I have worked at Digital Domain, Rhythm & Hues, Zoic Studios, Pixomondo, Eden FX, Ntropic LA, Ntropic NY, Origami Digital, Visual Cue, HiFi3D, and Motion Theory to name a few with 9 days between jobs being my longest unemployment period. I currently freelance from my home office for Encore Hollywood and a few other studios around the world. I attribute the success I’ve had to the Dave School. The way they approach their curriculum now and even back then has helped me to sit down at a desk in any capacity and not be intimidated by the software. I’ve worked in various roles throughout my career (supervisor, modeler, lighter, texture artist, lookdev, compositor, game engine artist) and on various pieces of software (Maya, Nuke, Lightwave, After Effects, Fusion, Max) and had the confidence to do all of them from that initial skillset I got while attending DAVE.

I had the privilege to work on site at the Dave school from February-May 2014 and supervise a few of their recent graduates working on Why Planes Crash for MSNBC. Those guys were amazingly talented and the ink had barely dried on their certificates. I got to see first hand that the Dave school is still striving to improve their curriculum on a daily basis and keep up with industry trends before a lot of larger schools even know they exist.

Can your daughter achieve success going somewhere else? Absolutely! She’ll get out what she puts in. Will they work their tails off to help her succeed and get a job? Now that’s a whole different conversation entirely. Does she need to join this forum to get help? Wouldn’t hurt and it’s a great resource, but I can count on one hand the amount of times I’ve needed to come here in the last decade. I used to have a different account but it’s been too long.

To verify I’m not just blowing smoke, you can refer to the following links:
http://www.imdb.com/name/nm2485873/?ref_=fn_al_nm_1
https://vimeo.com/94707202
http://www.dutch360hdr.com/shop/?page_id=695
http://www.digitalvfx.com/

Leigh,
I’m a big fan of your work and have been since I first bought Lightwave 8 Lighting (upon recommendation from my Dave School instructors). Our mutual friends have nothing but great things to say about you and I mean you no disrespect.

#36

Let me speak about the DAVE School from an employer perspective.

We currently have three DAVE School graduates here at The Global Asylum and all of them are extremely talented, well-versed in the industry and were ready to roll right from the beginning. That two of them have been here for nearly three years (and another I’ve worked in the industry with nearly five) speaks to both the longevity and quality of both the people and the training.

We have in the past also used DAVE School talent in freelance capacities and helped with educational projects in order to see how things might work. Though the results can be mixed we found that, as in the industry, the people who put in the effort with enthusiasm and great attitudes got the job done and done well. Those who didn’t likely wouldn’t make it past a job interview either way.

Still and all our experience with DAVE School grads has been exemplary and in the right circumstances I’d give them a higher rating for knowledge and capacity than anyone else just starting out… even coming away from the school with a strong, varied demo reel is a major thing.

Is it perfect? No. No one place, no person and no thing is. There are rough spots, challenges, learning experiences no matter where one goes… and there is definitely truism that you get out of things what you put in. That the DAVE School provides such a wide range of education with instructors who have, more often than not, actually BEEN in the trenches can be a wonderful thing for a student looking to jump-start a future.

Full disclosure: Jeff Scheetz, the current director, hired me for my first job at Foundation Imaging and is a long-time good friend… but I don’t jump on here on his or anyone elses request or behalf except your daughters: to give her the widest range of knowledge and opinions to make the decision that is right for her and her future.

The truth is that the DAVE School has the capacity to be one of the best options available. If I didn’t believe that, irregardless of my friendship, I would have chosen to remain silent.

I hope the decision no matter where it leads goes well and best of fortune in the future!

Joseph J. Lawson, VFX Supervisor, The Global Asylum

#37

Hello everybody!
To introduce myself, I am Chloe, the daughter of Charles. To start, I would like to thank everyone for posting helpful information about the DAVE school(especially Mr.Scheetz, and the numerous graduates of DAVE).
I would also like to touch base that I am actively working on my portfolio and looking into schools that would be the right fit for what I am interested in. My father, and mother, will be the ones supporting me going into this field so it is only normal that they want the most information as possible(as I do, too) and I appreciate them helping me through this.
I understand some of your worries about how hard working I am and my ability to cope under the stress of this industry. Of course, as an artist who wants to take her work to the professional level, I am very dedicated and I am up for the challenges I will surely face with a career in this field.
My new computer is almost built, and my learning is about to begin! I also want to bring it to your attention that I am a junior in high school so I do have time to expand my skills and become familiar with these programs(Maya, Unity, and Modo).
Also, a little bit about what I have done with computer graphics ranges from Photoshop, Firealpaca, and Paint Tool Sai. I have also messed around a bit with Toon Boom, but I need the newer computer to operate it smoothly and efficiently as well as Anime Studio Debut.
Thanks again for the information all of you have provided. I am sure I will have a flood of questions and will need to reach out to those of you working in the field. I appreciate all of you being open for additional questions and communication.
I know I have a TON to learn!
-Chloe Moser

#38

Hello,

I am a current DAVE student, VFX, current Block 4.

I think that all the other graduates pretty much covered it all. I am sure that you can see how passionate we are about DAVE school. I am not very good in writing or sugar coating anything so I will just start stating facts about DAVE.

  • It is a lot of hard work! I can not stress that enough to everyone who asks me about the school. I am currently in Block 4 – the toughest block, my day is leave for school at 6:45 AM, leave school at 12:30-1 AM. That is the average. If you don’t put at least 14 hours a day, something is wrong (also know that is my choice - no body is making me do that :). We all sleep, on average 4 hours. And guess what –LOVING EVERY WAKING MOMENT OF IT!!
  • If this is not what she is passionate about and loving it with all she’s got – she will be miserable. It is the main reason students quit, they simply realize that this is not for them.
  • This program is tough, but that is why our students come out of the school prepared for whatever is thrown at them in the real world. I am yet to meet a DAVE school graduate who found a job in a studio and was not prepared and did not know how to tackle their assignment.
  • Instructors are incredible!!! I am one of those who always has questions – They always have the answer and more importantly PATIENCE for it. Not such a thing as a stupid question is their policy. So that crap about instructors not being teachers irritated me so bad! That must have been a very sorry and jaded bunch of students that said that. There are always slower students in a class and I have never seen an instructor not working in every possibly way he can find to make students understand and make himself clear. Another thing about instructors – Know that I have done a whole lot of research myself before enrolling. I went and toured Full Sail as well as SCAD. What I loved about DAVE instructors was that: A- They have had at least 8 years experience in the field and B – ARE STILL IN THE FIELD. They are all active, freelancing. You know yourself how fast paced this industry is, if you are not current with what is happening you are lost. All the other schools had instructors either not having enough real studio/production experience or worked years back. Well, what good is that to me?? Means that they do not have any contacts that are useful. And how are they supposed to teach you what is current?
  • Side job, I would not recommend, even though students do it. With me, I’m all in or not. I invested a lot into this school and do not want to be side tracked or anything else to drain my energy.
  • The job placement was explained, which I am glad, and know that the percentage that makes us short to 100 is because of students. Students often think that they are Pixar ready after school. Your daughter needs to understand that chances are slim that she will be immediately working for Naughty Dog or Blizzard. Some students keep rejecting offers because they think so high of themselves. You gotta move up a ladder, but with hard work and right contacts there is no reason she shouldn’t be one day working for those companies.
  • My block 4 is graduating in April with the second generation of gaming students. We only had one gaming graduation so far (as you know, the program is new). I believe that the Gaming graduation class from December 2014 had around 7 students or so, out of which I know for a fact that 2 have a job. Other students I do not know so I can not say what is their employment status.
  • School helps you a lot finding a job, getting knowledge, getting you the contacts, but at the end it really bulls down to us. Again, if you are passionate about and you love it, anything is possible.
    Hope this helps a little bit. Any questions you may have, please don’t hesitate to contact me. You can reach me through my website or facebook. I would be more than happy to answer any additional questions or concerns.

Cheers!

Hope Brackin

http://www.hopebrackin.com

#39

Dave School Rocks! Just be determined to do well. If you go in with the wrong attitude, don’t expect to get far, but that goes for everything in life. They do have some good people in place to help you succeed, so it shouldn’t be too hard. Just don’t be lazy and bring your best. They give you a tough environment and if you can make it there, you can make it anywhere. Yeah, I’m in NY. Email me, if you have any questions.

thomascheng

@

fusefx.com

#40

I was a Student (2001), and Long Time Employee of the school (6 years till about 2007-8), By and large I thought the school was a great experience, and while placement from any school can never be guaranteed the school does give you ample opportunity to succeed and make industry contacts. The latter being probably the most important aspect of the school, at least during my time there.

While I was employed there, I met a lot of great people, both industry professionals and students who went out to do great things. My own experiences ranged from doing small animation projects for small clients, to working on the BSG pilot, shows like Fringe, BSG: Blood and Chrome, Defiance etc etc. And while the school has changed a great deal since my time there, I have recently visited it, and it looks and feels a lot more substantial, than it ever had in the years I had been there.

Check it out before making a final decision, let facts direct opinion, and not supposition, or rumor.

However like anything in life, you get out what you put into it, you work hard, and are friendly with those around you there is no reason you can’t take it to the next level.

The industry itself can be a pretty brutal one, but I suppose that is like any job where you have to meet critical deadlines.