Well I’m going to stick it out with A:M for my first feature. I just wish I could get to the animation part faster, but that is where the speed will finally come into play.
After that I think I’ll move on, or stay, we’ll just have to see how big the project gets from there.
If it gets to big from there I’ll be forced to leave for other pastures. Although I believe I will promote A:M after the first movie.
And who knows, once a library is created it will probably be a whole lot faster
Well, If all that is holding you back is not wanting to make all of your models, then hire someone to make them for you!
I saw your posts on the Hash Forum, but you were looking for collaborators. Except that donating your time and resources to achieving another artist’s vision is NOT collaboration, it is just working for free…So, If you would like a quote for some modeling, I would be more than happy to help you.
Otherwise, the “If only A:M was more like_____” is a waste of your time. If you stay stuck there because you think that it is A:M holding you back, then you should move on. A:M is what it is. Some people love it. Some people want it to be something else… It is what it is. I love it. If you want it to BE something else, then go buy something else.
In the working environment I have, I offer a 10% on any profits made, with a contract.
So if 10 dollars is made you get 1 dollar. If 1 Million in profit is made you get 100,000. 50 Percent goes to another production and I get 10% myself. The 10% varies though from someone who is active participant to others who are more casual and throw a prop or two here and there.
Someone has to have the idea before the collaboration begins. Someone has to direct the collaboratioin. If people want to join in and finish something then that is good, if they want to be a part of it I surely could use them. It is not just working for free. I mean if someone says hey I have an idea (Like Ninjai) and others want to join in the idea and help out, that is called collaboration.
Why not collaborate? I mean you have ton of folks modelling everyday. What do they model? Star Wars, Lord of the Rings, Spiderman, etc. What is wrong with them working on something original. Something that doesn’t already have a team of artists who get paid for modelling. Why not collaborate on something that hasn’t been done before or doesn’t have a billion dollars behind it?
I mean you I really love to see how you are so original. I enjoy going to your website. You do your own characters and original stuff. But look on this forum and see how many characters from movies and stuff ahve been done. Why don’t they put their talent to somethng new?
I do pay people for modelling as well if I cannot find collabers. It does get expensive, but that is why I go to foreign markets or work up deals with others. I have found some great folks. The pay I offer is not grand, but I do want to give some type of small incentive .
I’ve descided to stick for now to A:M, can’t wait to work with it’s major strength in Animation and lighter spline based models. Buildings and such I can turn out fast and descent in Wings. The SWEEPER tool is the bomb.
When I had already modeld and collected a whole bunch of models in AM, the horrible version 9.5 and the dreadfull handled Hash-e-maillist at that time got me so frustrated, that I bought C4d and motionbuilder, since a close friend of mine is working with it and I thought of collaboration options as well.
The fact is both programs hang on my computer unused since more then a year now.
I found the learningcurve of C4D and MB quite a bit steeper then AMs and MB not as easy and elegant to use as AM.
Since AM is sufficiently stable now and the forum is a great improvment and I already have so many AM build models and sets and an opportunity for a poly-colaboration hasn`t occured so far either, I am sticking to AM for the time being, even thinking of selling my polysoftware again.
But who knows, I might still need it for special ocasions on compostting for instance.
Just my expirience on that topic
And as William said: Here is a splinemodeller for hire as well.
As for the collaboration-projects: As long as no direct payment is involved, why dont you collaborate for my project?
No offence, I just mean, every artist has his own ideas, that he wants to realize… but maybe the “starwars”-modelers…
;>) Jake
Im glad that I saw this thread, I thought about buying AM
but if I can’t import poly models then it’s not for me 
Hi Flog, I think I remember you posting to the Hash forum a while back asking if it was possible to model fast in AM as it is with Zbrush. I boasted that I could knock a head mesh up in AM in about half an hour - 15 min for the main mesh and 15 min for the ear. I then felt guilty that I had boasted without checking if I was right so I did the test. Half an hour later I had a head mesh.
Tweeking the mesh to make it look good took longer but, hey, I set my standards quite high.
Again, If you are getting hung up on modelling characters then that shows that you have yet to learn how time-consuming the rest of the process is (unless you want lots of bevelled stuff in splines).
I would also like to remind you that I offered to work for pay a while back
Hey John,
hehehe Yeah I still have your number. I have descided to go and stay with A:M as for now as it is the wisest choice.
I started thinking about it more and more and thought part of my movie is to show people how to do things on a budget, basically a how to. A:M has that mentality.
I have not seen alot of how to movies out there that really show you how things are done in the Animation Field or how to make an Indie animation. That is my main plan. Just to show it can be done and on a budget and those involved can make a small profit or at least make something worthwhile. (trying to encourage folks away from the ol’ Starwars modelling)
I’m going to stick to my A:M roots for now, and work with what I have and composite the rest as the need arises.
I was just at a point now where it is time to begin and get things rolling. I was trying to descide whether to go another route or stick with A:M. If we can still work together on a budget I could definately still use your help.
Just have to finish up some character designs and we are set.
P.S. Your stuff in Painter is freakin me out, lol
Still confused? Check out newtek.com (L.wave’s homepage)… they reduced price! $795!!!
But please... give A:M a chance ;)
–just wondering, I know A:M is quite stubborn with their “spline” mentality, but they don’t have to be unique with this. What makes A:M standout from the rest is their ANIMATION SYSTEM. If only integrated well with polys… <sighs> … c’mon Martin and the H-team(Hash) … open the door for polys and subDs!!! Hehehehe.
Should this happen in the future… I’ll leave Lightwave in a flash and stick with A:M forever. But I don’t think its gonna happen soon so I’ll stick to my method of hybriding A:M and LW for my projects.
I feel the same way you do. It is a great product, perfection would be achieved if this one thing was done.
That would definatley put the issue to rest, there would no longer be those DXF to A:M, 3ds to A:M type questions coming up anymore.
I’m just going to work with it though and composite the rest.
I may move over to Lightwave or C4D a bit later.
I’m loving clothtylde on Cinema 4d. I bet that can be achieved in A:M 12.0 though with a plugin like Emilio’s Sweeper tool. Quick cloth design that conforms to a character and is auto constrained.
It would be awesome if Emilio had more tools like Sweeper. This has definately been a great help. I asked him if he could do a clothtilde type plugin for A:M. You should check it out in C4D. I do not see why A:M could not have this wrapping feature.
Still confused? Check out newtek.com (L.wave’s homepage)… they reduced price! $795!!!
Sweet price! But I heard animating in LW sucks if you don’t buy messiah:animate…:shrug:
Lightwave just looks complicated though. I hear the new Animation tools rock though. IK Boosters and such, but I don’t like the look or feel of the program.
I had tested it out awhile and just didn’t feel all natural with it.
I think after Animation Master, C4D is probably where I would go. Get the animation Mocca, it works with Motionbuilder, it works with other programs really well and has a very similiar feel to Animation:Master, but with the Modules and such, it is pretty expensive.
I would need Shave and a Hair Cut, Mocca 2, Sketch and Toon, the Base Cinema 4d, and possibly Motionbuilder to be equivalent to what A:M can do. All of that just to be able to work with Poly’s and Model faster(but then I would use other programs outside of C4D). It would be a time saver(in modeling and rendering), but expensive.
It is funny how powerful A:M really is. I would have to buy all those modules just to have the power A:M has. They really have a great tool. Who know’s what the future holds for A:M but they have always been on the right track. Maybe someone will make some money but finally programming the conversion program that truly works. We’ll just have to see.
Because of it’s only limitation I have turned it into a strength. I have descided for my animation to composite as many people have suggested, but then I descided to do a unique cartoon in line with Cartoon Network’s “bumps” between shows. The full 3d world and 2d characters.
http://www.animallogic.com/film/CN/index.html
I thought about it and that would be awesome. So keep your eyes opened, production has started and I’m sticking with A:M and for everything else COMPOSITING!! Thanks for the suggestions everyone.
Still confused? Check out newtek.com (L.wave’s homepage)… they reduced price! $795!!!
For version 8 with no manual. From what I can tell, Newtek is price-dumping version 8, and charging yet ANOTHER $395 - $495 “upgrade” price if you want version 9. These sorts of upgrade pricing policies were the biggest reason for me getting rid of LW a year or so ago.
Of course, XSI FND dropping to $495 might have influenced my decision a little as well. 
edit : Maybe the new $795 pricing is for v8.5 with a free upgrade to 9? It’s hard to tell from their online store page. If so, then oops…
LW is decent. So is C4D, blender and so on.
Really the problem you have is that you need something that you can collaborate with poly modelers on. Since you are doing a movie C4D and Lightwave both are good general packages. With LWs price dropping to 900 it is comperable to C4D with Mocca module but you get more bang for your buck.
AM’s splines or is it the tools require a steep learning curve to get models to look the way you want. I spent years working with them and finally gave up as polys gave me exactly what I wanted. This does not mean AM is bad just that my head does not “get” splines. So if you find that zbrush & company work for you switching will save you some grey hairs.
Animation I have found was much easier in AM. Not as much gimble lock or join popping. IK Booster seems to turn the skeletons in LW into the skeletons you have in AM, that is the whole body is IKed. THere is some other stuff tied to it but trying to make a stable rig with
LW seems to have alot in store for 9 but I haven’t heard any pre-order info yet so I would hold off. XSI is also a good well rounded package.
Like Z said pick one and stick with it. I stuck with LW and got alot further for it. I still play with AM, it’s my second love afterall…
It’s actually slightly better than that. $795 gets you LW8.3, the LW8.5 update when it’s posted, LW9.0 when it is released AND a full copy of Vue 5 Infinite as well to give you something to play with in those quiet moments :twisted: If you already own a registered copy of LW8, then $395 gets the LW8.5 update, LW9.0 when released and Vue 5 (straightaway).
OK, back over to your A:M debate 
Thanks for making it clear Qexit.
I love Lightwave and I also love A:M.
But to survive in the CG industry, one cannot stick to splines alone.
winkwink
But then again, Animation Master has a very complete workflow. Their app even includes compositing. Its very much a one-stop shop for a small group.
http://amfilms.hash.com/search/entry.php?entry=1056
That movie (Haruwo) is half an hour long, and pretty darned impressive. Made by 1 guy in 2 years (1 year modelling, 1 year animating). That’s just amazing. I gotta admit, the more I play with it, the more I like it.
All my best,
lafnjack
Haruwo was great. 1 year to model all those models. I can see with another programming doing that same work in 6 months or less.
I wish I had a demo version of Lightwave so I can try it out and truly see the new stuff going on with it.
P.S.
I wanted to share my 5 minute building with no textures. Complete with doors and top roof using sketchup.
I love sketchup and Silo 3d for modelling. I’m going home to see if I can put it into A:M somehow, maybe composite and such.
Y’know, I just figured… why not try Softimage? I’m slowly drifting away from LW to XSI… price is awesome too ($495 - foundation).
There’s a trial version. Check it out 
I still have to see more for myself but lately I saw a lot of wavers migrating to XSI.
I tried it for the last 2 days and I’m hooked! I think I’m gonna like it.
I’ll set aside A:M for a bit.
So I guess I’ll see ya guys later then
P.S. – nice building model. I love Silo. I model in Silo and animate in LW. Keep up d good work
is xsi easy to learn?
You know one thing I did notice is there is no perfect application.
There is always that one tool from one program you want, that your tool ain’t got.
I wish I could combine Sketchup, Zbrush, and Silo all in one for modelling.
I wish A:M would import at least OBJ or FBX like all the other 3d programs do.
But then the Lightwavers have their deal they wish for, C4d folks were looking for N-Gons and less modules, Max needs this and that, etc.
Nothing is perfect, but I guess as an artist I work with what I can
I need to learn more about XSI.
I need something with a good renderer, easy animating and rigging, celshading and easy to use hair.
XSI looks really good to me and the latest new tools are just more compelling reasons to check it out. I’ve heard the ease of setting up shaders and rendering are smooth as butter. I’ve been thinking of getting Foundation just to add it to the toolbox. I have played with it in the past. Really excellent toolset and elegant UI. Just don’t know if it’s worth it to me at this point to pick up yet another app. Between Max, Bodypaint, Maya, Zbrush, and A:M, I think I’m pretty tapped out.
I haven’t used A:M for about a year now. I stopped at v. 11. I didn’t “quit” out of any real dissatisfaction, just didn’t have enough time to devote to it. My day job was Max-centered until I switched teams. Now we are Maya-centered. So, squeezing in A:M time was difficult. This morning, on a lark, I re-installed A:M on my home computer. I have been trying to get as good as I could with those other apps, but I still love the deceptively simple A:M world (I say deceptive because there is a ton of depth there).
What’s the word on v. 12? Hot or not?