Realism: bolts

[Max4d]

oh please… I hate when someone starts to pop in all this social interaction bulls**t into the meaning of art. Then perhaps we should start talking about our subconsciousness and what we really are?

If you don’t bother who you are are and what you’re capable of, then why do you even bother to live??

[CGTrader]

“A successful work of art is not one which resolves contradictions in a spurious harmony, but one which expresses the idea of harmony negatively by embodying the contradictions, pure and uncompromised, in its innermost structure.” Adorno

“Art is a selective re-creation of reality according to an artist’s metaphysical value-judgments. An artist recreates those aspects of reality which represent his fundamental view of man’s nature.” Proust

Is the render of the bollts art? No. It does not represent its creator’s view of reality nor tell us anything about human nature. It is a technical exercise, nothing more.

I missed that one. Now that’s more than funny. You just copy/pasted someones ideas and made conclusion from them. Man don’t you have your own opinion? Of course, if Proust has said so, then so it be. Here we have a definition of art. I don’t think we should set standards here…
You start MAX for the first time and in one click create a teapot. If it looks cool for you, then you can call it art. Another question, how long it will look nice to you? Maybe tomorrow you will start thinking about something more sophisticated. Here we have perfection of oneself.
Another question: what’s the difference in sense of art between Mona Lisa and these bolts image? I see no difference, maybe only that I like more these bolts.

[internot]

“You start MAX for the first time and in one click create a teapot. If it looks cool for you, then you can call it art. Another question, how long it will look nice to you? Maybe tomorrow you will start thinking about something more sophisticated. Here we have perfection of oneself.”

so art just has to look cool for you? that’s it? the mona lisa looks cool, the teapot looks cool, the bolts look cool: they’re all art. great. everything is art. so i do something, say make a teapot. i’m now an artist. don’t i fell good, i can make art. i can pat myself on the back for making something as good as the mona lisa. it’s all art, after all.

why don’t we demand more than teapots? the mona lisa, after all, was not easy to paint. i couldn’t do it. granted, i couldn’t make those bolts, either, but somehow i think it would be a bit easier. but that isn’t the point. it’s a cop-out to call everything art. THAT’S the point. if you are an artist, and you make art, why not defend it? why not let people know why the should look at it and appreciate it. “Oh, but it’s all art, it’s all good. Why judge another person’s effort?” Because we SHOULD have standards, we SHOULD demand more than (a) “looking cool” or (b) technical perfection.

Once again: art should move us. Why do we expect less? Are we too lazy or untalented to make anything BETTER than teapots?

[adren]

art is the result of anything that involves creative energy or expression.

[CGTrader]

“THAT’S the point. if you are an artist, and you make art, why not defend it? why not let people know why the should look at it and appreciate it.”

first of all because I do it for myself, I get most pleasure if I like it.

Once again: art should move us. Why do we expect less? Are we too lazy or untalented to make anything BETTER than teapots?

art should move us… I don’t clearly understand what do you want to say? I think we both are talking about the same thing. move, get pleasure, motivate us to live… but then I ask what motivates us to create an art? It’s the same thing, the pleasure we get from the creation, boast we get from it. nobody expect less and it’s not the question. If your teapot will drive you crazy all your remaining life, then I can say you are a very lucky man. for yourself you will be perfect and unimprovable artist. But if you endeavour at perfection then probably all your life you will want to create something more than your last creation. And maybe at the end you will create Mona Lisa or image of a pile of bolts in the way that will knock out anyone who will see it. It’s everybody’s choice to set stadards. for himself. that’s why we shouldn’t do it.

[Zhai_Tian-Feng]

What is art to some is not art to others.

These bolts moved me.

This forum is about computer graphics.

Art does not need to be intentionally.

I don’t like to sit and say this piece is art and that piece is not art.

[Atwooki]

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Yawn - wish you guys would comprehend (and appreciate!) the difference between the words ‘ART’ and CRAFT’ someday…
Of course, everybody wants to be thought of as an artist rather than a craftsman don’t they!

Technically speaking, the ‘bolts’ is brilliant piece (no doubt), but use the approriate adjective, please.

[funchski]

What software was used for the modelling - Rhino?

Art or not, I like it.

[orion119net]

:drool: great render! i wish i could do that.

[CGTrader]

:rolleyes: yeaah, so sad that many of us cannot be artists.
:whispering: I have heard that artists can see dead people…

[jcbray]

Two people are looking at a green wall, one is colour-blind. One man claims to see a green wall, the other a red wall. Who is right? Both are telling the truth exactly as they see it. If your going to argue that a group of people will prove the colour blind man to be wrong, then you’re being childish. Consensus of the majority does not create truth.

The debate of whether this is or is not art (or craft :P) is irrelevant. All that is important is your own point of view. Whether you feel the need to express your opinion to everyone else here is your own issue (hurrah freedom of speech) if you’re going to condemn other people for their opinion, then…well you know what you can do.

[DN1]

Why do people say “post wires, post wires…” Look on his site and you’ll find the wires of the given image. As for the wires confirming its not a fake… well people can model to the likeness of a photo image and them match them up… SO wires doesnt mean much from an image this simple, A screen grab from the 3d package with wires in the view port and the material/shader hierachy open is proof positive.

[Tonal]

Two people are looking at a green wall, one is colour-blind. One man claims to see a green wall, the other a red wall. Who is right? Both are telling the truth exactly as they see it. If your going to argue that a group of people will prove the colour blind man to be wrong, then you’re being childish. Consensus of the majority does not create truth.

Well spoken sir. I agree wholeheartedly that actual truth is a personal experience. Especially when it comes to art.

[Velgor]

Well spoken sir. I agree wholeheartedly that actual truth is a personal experience. Especially when it comes to art.

That was the point I was trying to make too.

Art and life are totally subjective. To deny someone’s expression just because it doesn’t fit your criterion for “art” is what I find offensive. The definition of art is not a stark black and white delineation. Art doesn’t have to be pleasing - it can be shocking or revolting too. Art doesn’t have to have a deep meaning or emotional impact. Art can engage the mind as well. Art can rise above itself too. Meaning is injected into it by the viewer.

I also believe that almost everyone has the capacity to be an artist in some way. Art is not just paint, or wood, metal or plastic, it’s words, sounds, ideas, emotion…We all can be creative, some more so than others. Don’t stifle that. You never know what wonders there may be.

Some artists are better than others in expressing themselves. Some art is “better” than other art because, to you, it communicates to or inspires you more.

[adren]

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:
Yawn - wish you guys would comprehend (and appreciate!) the difference between the words ‘ART’ and CRAFT’ someday…
Of course, everybody wants to be thought of as an artist rather than a craftsman don’t they!

Technically speaking, the ‘bolts’ is brilliant piece (no doubt), but use the approriate adjective, please.

instead of worrying about the semantics between “art” and “craft”, perhaps your energies would be better spent in trying to get a girlfriend (or boyfriend, you never know), as then you wouldnt be so uptight.

[BESTrin]

A painter could paint a black dot on a red square with blue stripe and it would be art. A sculpter could make a strange shape out of clay and that would be art. Yet a piece of digital art is always doubted. I could make an image of a sphere and go into photoshop and make it look kindof kool and to the general population it would be considered art. I could do a little autogenerated teragen landscape or something in bryce and it would be accepted by most people but if i posted it on these forums i would be laughed at. So digital artists work hard to make a unique beauhtiful technically dificult piece. Something that will be respected by those in our field. Then its not art. Its a craft project. Its photorealistic so its not art he could of just taken a picture. Its not photorealistic so its crap no skill no art. Just by the fact that there is an image of something that never existed is something to think about in way that can make it art. Who are we to judge what is art. What is art anyway.

[Atwooki]

adren@line:
Haha! I am married, not gay , and have lots of energy

Atwooki

[Aceroner]

I don’t see what’s so amazing about this image. Just an instanced model, some HDRI, and an assload of DOF and film grain. It’s not particularly unbelievable that someone could do this in CG.

ok tough guy, let me see you do it if it is so easy

[Jackdeth]

I usually don’t pipe in on these threads only because of the overly positive banter that drowns out any useful feedback. We are already at page 11, and what real comments have been given? Let me try to be the un-sugar coated voice of reason…

At first look its interesting, but very simple and basic. (That doesn’t mean bad) The low depth of field sampling is a real nasty eye sore, as is the brownish color palete. It only feels a little “photograhic,” mostly due to the extreme contrast ratio and over-sharpness where it is in focus.

Flaten out the image by lifting the blacks, and then de-saturate it as well. Fix the sampling issues, but then re-add real film grain, but not before you do an edge-detect blur to take off the CG sharpness.

It’s a nice raytrace image, but nothing to set CGtalk on fire. I don’t want to come off as a hard ass, but come on people. If Arsney really wants real feedback, he doesn’t need 11 pages of fan mail to make himself feel better. Either add something useful, or move on… but don’t overwhelm this thread in such a “over the top” way.

Posted again for effect.

[internot]

Atwooki, I’m with you all the way.

What is it with the ARTISTS that are posting here that cannot even give a coherent definition of art? or tell the difference between art and craft? come on people, take some pride in what you do and don’t give me (and everyone else) this whole “it’s all subjective and therefore all good art” bullshit. does art (as opposed to just images, etc) do anything besides give a little pleasure? are you trying to SAY anything (perhaps give an alternate view of reality/theworld so people will have to engage their minds)? does no one have standards?

another question: what makes “good” or “great” art better than normal art?

take the futurists, for example. they had a certain view of art:
http://cscs.umich.edu/~crshalizi/T4PM/futurist-manifesto.html