R21 in one month...we'll know



Sad…I wish we could talk more about the features and stop lamenting over pricing…


I’m mostly hobbyist but once I unlearned C4D method I found Houdini nodes and procedural way far more intuitive. For example if you need to change the way a bevel looks you go to that node, make change then it goes through rest of model or you can branch off with a different set of nodes and if that works better then you carry on,

Of course it is steep learning curve and if it’s your bread and butter you might not be able to spend the time comin to grips with Houdini


But the price is one of the new features :sweat_smile:


The price shown on the site for European countries is VAT inclusive - so it’s varying based on the sales tax in each of those countries. The Rest-of-World Euro price estimates VAT using the Irish tax rate of 23% - but the actual tax will adjust after you enter billing information in the checkout process.

The US / Canadian price is VAT exclusive because here in America we’re not used to quoting prices that include tax, and there’s no way to calculate sales tax in the US until you have a zip code (for those who don’t know - we don’t have a national sales tax in the US but 16,000 separate municipalities that all charge different taxes).


A month ago I started this thread:
“R21 in one month…we’ll know”

The month has passed and we now know. R21 is a thin, tepid update. And Maxon has joined the bloodsucker crowd with Adobe and Autodesk.


I think there things more serious than that.

The PR Hype that break the trust build in many years, the penalization of current buyers.

The lame attempts to price whole year subscription as monthly cost… how is that necessary? it is just gives a bad taste. Do the PR think they win any client with that?

that is one thing, worse is the complexification of C4D. Meanwhile in greener side of Autodesk expect Bifrost which seems to be well designed to start pushing things strongly, will came to 3dsMax soon and they have the critical mass that Softimage lacked.

To not talk about Blender evolution. So i would say the future does not look bright.


So a few hours ago I get an e-mail from Maxon about features of the new release…the R20 release.

Yeah…the one from 12 months ago. How does an e-mail like that happen?

Maxon corp seems drifting towards a ditch.


I don’t get the callousness of the whole process. What does Maxon lose by showing some respect to the long time stuidio MSA group. Taking away the Cineversity priviliege is salt in the wound. Maybe the cost of a seperate maintenance contract is so expensive that PR be damned? I suppose the nunber at CGTalk and C4Dcafe are so small, that they don’t need to give a sh*t.

The availabitliy of the subscription option can still be used as an enticement to attract new users, less-than-studio users and corporate users.

BTW check out the Boxcutter and Hardops addosn for Blender. Nothing in C4D can touch them.


Yeah i don’t get it either. It seems to be in a rush or a desperate measure.

I mean if they need to push everyone to subs for whatever reason you don’t do it with a whip but with honey. For example put Redshift in the deal.


I’m not sure if the FAQ mentioned this, but I would be open to a “Rent to Own” subscription (that would of course include Cineversity).
At the end of a yearly subscription, I would be given the option to continue the subscription or get a perpetual version that I could walk away with.

  • Lack of video explaining new features in details.
  • Poor R21 improvements.
  • Bad new pricing.
  • Sending the wrong version info in Emails.
  • Wrong Marketing.

Seems like the work of a bunch of trainees who are still getting used to their new posts…


I saw a video of the Maxon CEO saying “Maxon needs to be a global company”.

You can start to see what that means. You bully your customers, treat them like shit and put them inline. Train them to be good little sheep. Make them dependent and bleed them for every dollar possible.

It’s how the big global banks and telecom providers do it.

Maxon is the enemy now.


Who would have thought that Maxon would go from hero (one of the few remaining non-subscription options) to the villain so quickly. I think perpetual licenses will only be available until current MSAs run out.

As much as I hate Autodesk, I have to say that I’m at least happy that they immediately stomped on Maxon’s “good news” about their new pricing policy by offering significantly lower indie licenses at the same time that Maxon was offering “3D for the Whole World.”

I’m out. No MSA for R21. No subscription. I don’t think saying anything here will make a difference, and I don’t think not getting my money will make a difference, but those are the only two things in my control, so I’ve at least done that.


I’m not here to add any fuel to this fire. I just wanted to mention that I got my yearly email from Maxon about renewing my MSA. No mention of an available subscription, or any details on the special rate to convert to subscription.

I thought I had read that Cineversity would also only be part of the subscription plan.

The email I received says:

"Your Cinema 4D Annual Service Agreement Expires This Month

Renew Now and Receive All the Benefits of MSA

Your MAXON Service Agreement (MSA) for Cinema 4D Ends on 8/31/2019.

Renew now to receive and enjoy:

Access to thousands of tutorials and dozens of plugins/resources on Cineversity
A savings of up to 33% or more versus standard upgrade pricing
Annual fee that translates to half of the monthly cost of other subscription models
Upgrades automatically/electronically when released"

So would I be getting one final year of MSA? If so, they are including Cineversity?
Or would this be a subscription? NO WHERE in this email is that explained. Just a link to view the invoice and pay $725. So what of that 2 years worth of discount that is mentioned in the marketing about R21 for existing MSA customers? And what would the price jump to after that?

I’m sure it’s just an oversight, but this is all a bit confusing.

Some time before August 31 I will call them and get the real details so I can make a decision.

Funny, this is the only time since R7 (when I started as a C4D user) that I’ve seriously questioned whether or not I feel like upgrading. Yes the licensing is about as clear as mud right now…but that will get resolved. I’m mostly just on the fence because of the lack of updates I was hoping for.

At least with the subscription plan, I don’t feel rushed into jumping on MSA with R21 by my deadline. Now I can take my time if I wish. So this whole mess has that going for it. ha


It’s not funny when you essentially give up ownership of everything you create by choosing R21…, Maxon are in so many ways screwing you over…


If you don’t own the software required to open your own artwork, you have given another party the lock and key. You are a dependent. A slave.

Your subscriptions become slave-scriptions.

Greedy companies love slaves.

My word to Maxoff: Shame. Shame. Shame. <Insert Cersei’s walk here>


If you renew your MSA this month, you’ll receive a perpetual R21 in September and Cineversity access until your MSA expires. At any point before your MSA expires, you can choose to convert to subscription at a 20% discount for 2 years.



All this outrage could be ended just by giving a perpetual license after five years of subscription and current MSA users.
I 'm not sure how much would it cost Maxon, but maybe with new users(subscribers) and a positive vibe around a brand, it could be worth it?

Indie would be nice, but I know we can’t have everything.

Look what’s happening in a high-end gaming industry. Everyone hates those big, money sucking corporations without soul.
But there are outliers like CDProjekt Red. Everyone loves them, and literally throws money at them.
Just because they care about users and listen.


So I’m in Australia and my price for sub is Rest of World price? Is this correct. If so then MAXON just upped the price considerably. I understand I will be able to have a perpetual licence, since I just paid MSA. However if I move to subscription with discount does that mean my R21 becomes brickable if I don’t wish to continue. I would prefer to keep it perpetually and have access to my work