Modo + C4d 9 looks like win!


Best of both worlds, modeller (how it should be) and a great modern fast GI renderer.
C4d has excellent mac support and FCP now supported in 9.
Ngons, cache shadows, micro displacment, fast GI comparable to vray, instances, history.
Modo has edges, modeller style creating, ngons, excellent play with others attitude.

I feel LW8 to be was a plugin pack upgrade.


So if you already have C4D, the upgrade price is about $595 or more depending on what version and modules you have, plus the $695 for Modo on top of that. To buy the top end C4D from scratch - Cinema 4D Studio R9 which you will need if you were to dump Lightwave, costs over $2000. So that’s nearly $3000. Doesn’t make sense to me. You are better off getting that other 3D app that’s lowered it’s price recently. Who knows what future updates to LW8 will be. May be pleasantly surprised :thumbsup:


Atleast for $3K i get a fast upto date renderer, edges, ngons, inatnces, history etc…
These all allow me to work quicker with archi stuff and make more money.
NT isnt worried bout these features, adding plugins to shut us up is enough for them.


It is important to look into the best tools for the job for your business as I do mine. To be fair to Newtek, I think they had a rough patch when the old dev team left to start Luxology. I am sure they will catch up and maybe overtake (they have to really). So I am waiting to see and Chucks comments on more frequent updates is encouraging. C4D R9 certainly looks good, but my eye is more on XSI to compliment LW.


I want to believe seriously I do, but NT is far to secretive then ppl get their hopes up high and nothing happens… Its unfair for NT and customers.
I just feel LW8 was more a .5 update than a full version.

If NT was to announce future missions for their app maybe it would help optimistically…
Like luxo and c4d do…Just hints of interest is enough…confirmations undestandably not needed.


AFAIK Cinema has no history. It has parametrical objects, but no real construction history.
And it is overpriced.


the grass is always greener on the other side:rolleyes:

C4D is over priced & no user base if you want to drop LW for it, i think you’ll be coming back soon

Modo is only a modeler !! wake up people it makes points and polygons if you find using LW’s modeler hard, Modo isn’t going to help you any it the same with an interface update, the features havn’t blown away LW, Maya or XSI modelers and if you want to buy it you got more $$ then me :wise: try silo first it’s cheaper


c4d 9 will bring them new users…
Ive seen threads on howto get vray style renders with c4d and it gets easier and easier…
Why would anyone in this day and age settle for the slowness we have in lw’s renderer…
Fprime doesnt help/


C4D render is quicker then Lw’s but no sorry with Fprime, C4D isn’t up to it by a long way

and with XSI price drop and maya would have to follow soon C4D will have to fight to get more users and so will LW

at the moment Maya would have to be the biggest “working” userbase and that’s some of the reason Studio’s choose to uses it, with XSI price dropping and gaining users, all the other 3D companys have to sit up and fight back


I very rarely post these days here, but I think what peeps are trying to say in hidden messages is that NT are not really listening to its userbase. C4D is storming ahead in features cos’ it listens, LW chucks in some plugs, doesn’t even finish off that half baked symmettry solution…

Wings3D rox bigtime, I have used this quite a bit now and NGONs are great, as with working with edges, I remember when the NGON thread kicked up about do we need it. I was dead against it cos’ I only worked with quads, but using Wings has opened my eyes and there’s nothing wrong with using NGONs, much better than having the odd triangle in your mesh, no pinching etc…

I am soooo gonna try Modo as I couldn’t get on with Silo but each to their own…

In a nutshell NT really need to listen to the userbase and do some kick@ss updates otherwise I see them going the way the Amiga went, stop innovating and ahem RIP…


Ummm…as an fPrime owner and a C4D owner, fPrime is not any faster than C4D…I have done my qualatative tests to my visual certainty. fPrime is faster at times, but for most things C4D 8 is just as fast and faster than fPrime. The whole reason fPrime appears to be so fast is because of two things: It is iterative in nature, and it just shows how slow LightWaves rendering engine is.

Please be precise in your observations and statements.

C4D 8 and now C4D 9 is a freaking leap in proper evolution of an application…and the thing is, the end user, the artist…is at the front of their development.

i remember just mentioning 8 months ago how combustion project files would be a stellar export feature…and to see it in C4D 9 freaks me out and amazes me…and to have FCP as an export potential just floors me.

Where is our working .PSD exporter, where the hell is our Digital Fusion flow project exporter…i bet I get DF export in C4D sooner than later.

At the end of the day what matters are the results one produces and an SDK that is catered to the developer to create tools that make art a great experience.

Cinema is going for the artist…and embracing them. I look forward to my relationship with them.



As good as Fprime is, it just isnt mature enough for GI solutions…
Its actually usless.

To credit Worley they are champions, noone disagrees, Fprime saved NT’s ass when LW8 was delayed for months.

I read c4d user boards and they have reps on there listening to everyone.
Ppl ask for ngons, they get em, ppl as for better shockwave support, c4d gets it.

Now ppl are asking for network construction like in 3sd where 2 ppl can work on one scene and it updates it… Soon you watch c4d get it!

Just leave it to the germans to innovate and advance.


Polys right, Im sick to death of all this secrecy NT has.
Man this is a competitive industry, give us some hints on where they see LW going.
Who knows it may hold off ppl jumping ship, like I and many others will soon.


On the contrary, IMHO, LW is really over priced compared to C4D R8/R9.
By the way, C4D user base is growing quickly, and lots of them came from LW side. From what I know, they are very happy with their decision. :slight_smile:


I am not right…I only listen to the artist in me…in us all. :wip:


Exactly! Maxon listens to their customers.
They demanded ngons, they got ngons.
They demanded fast cloth, they got fast cloth.
They demanded subpp diplacement, they got subppdisplacement.
They demanded better modeling tools, they got kick-ass new modeling tools.
NT. instead of listening to their users they implemented half-working tools.
LW8 fells like a a hack job and, on top of it, is stable like jelly.
NT loose customers to SI and Cinema, and I´m sure it hurts em.
Maybe they wake up one day realizing that it would be better to give customers what they want. The only thing I realize is, NT isnn´t a leading force anymore.
It´s not my intention to blame them. But if NT doesn´t listen to their customers requests in the next versions, I can´t see how they want to rescue the sinking ship.


personaly i think i have 2 options…or 3 options…

1: modo or lw-modeler in combo with messiah:studio. Why? messiah:studio renderer looks already very promising and the animation part is in my opinionen far prior to lws animation capabilities ( same goes for c4d )

2: xsi or maya…

3: stay with lw as long as possible and see what happens in the future. there are still a lot companies using lw on big productions … so why giving lw up???

andras kavalecz

technical director (lighting and animation)

the indestructible production company ltd
pinewood studios
iver heath
sl0 0nh


HAHA thats all the time soft war. Some are better in that, some worst. Whatever dont know how much time you spend with learning soft and how much with do your job. I didnt learn alot in LW, but learn alot about character design, rigging and animation. Dont need over 40% what LW can do… why do I need to look for other soft? Just think a little what is really important for your work. N-Gons, well sounds well, but anyway, I know how use LW modeler well, so what this N-Gons will good for me? I dont want learn soft, I want work easy and effective, that what you can when you spend more time with one soft, not looking all the time what other can do :slight_smile: anyway never seen soft what listen to me, still need use my hands and brain :slight_smile:


So settle with what you have a continue to make your work.

I don’t see what the issue is.

An artist can use as many tools as they care to based on their workflow, patience, understanding and wallet.

The concept of 3D is the hard thing to get over and learn. Software is just about pushing buttons.

And in the end we use the software that allows us to push these buttons most efficiently and within a price range that makes sense.



The problem though, is that not many companies can be too open about their development schedule, or be overly zealous in promoting what might be in their software later on.

The dilemna for NT, is that they have lost a lot faith from users, each new release isn’t stellar from the last, and this in itself makes people be a little more cautious in where the future development is heading. In turn, it’s why many of us would like some clear hint as to where it’s all going.

For other software devs. this situation doesn’t exist, the users aren’t in such a doubt about the product they ask for a roadmap. For example, take Sofimage, nothing was really known about XSI 4, no features released, no release date, nothing. Did it really bother anyone? Not really because the users know that Soft have lead by example in releasing forward looking updates, on time when they give a release date. It’s pretty much the same for Alias, C4D, etc.

That kind of doubt that NT attracts doesn’t exist for most other companies, and NT, I guess, can’t realy play the same game as the others now either.