m:studio 2.4d in use on SA Sports Hall of Fame

#121

Well, I would recommend 2 Gig of Ram anyway - very cheap these day.
If you are using XP Pro, you may want to activate the /3GB switch in the boot.ini of windows. Even with only 2Gb Ram it can help to use them fully.

Great stuff!

#122

I’m running Windows 2000 Pro. A RAM upgrade seems a good way to go. Just a pity that I’m on the verge of selling this edit suite / workstation to get me a notebook + big LCD.

#123

Does messiah have any features for managing low to high poly object replacement?

Here’s what I’d really benefit from…

[ul]
[li]select low poly object and specify render-time stand-in[/li][li]at render time, unload low poly version, load high poly version, and re-apply materials[/li]
[li]master switch to activate high poly rendering (default should be off for fast preview render testing)[/li]
[/ul]What bugs me now is when I do object replacement, I have to reassign materials, even though the object’s surfaces and UV maps are exactly the same. I understand there are times when this is in fact what you want. Perhaps a global messiah setting, or a per-project setting which tells messiah you either want to replace an object and…
[ol]
[li]import new materials, or[/li]
[li]keep existing materials[/li][/ol][color=Wheat]
While I’m asking :slight_smile: I might as well ask for these settings somewhere up top on the Render Output tab…
[/color]
[ul]
[li]master switch for scene shadow casting on/off[/li][li]master switch for scene reflections on/off[/li][li]master switch for whatever else on/off[/li][/ul]What may be cool is if there’s a preview and final render setup checklist which can be basic or more detailed but which allows you to switch between preview and final render settings. In that way you[color=#fffffe] keep your settings separate and don’t forget a crucial switch when doing final, or fiddle endlessly with settings to either preview quickly or render beautifully.

I know 3DSMax had this, in fact it had full seperate Render settings panels for preview and final, with a simple toggle button between the two.

This should be even easier to implement, just put two tabs on top of the render settings block, one for final and one for preview and a little button in each to copy the one’s settings over to the other. I’m sure Taron could have this working before tea-time on Monday morning :scream: [/color][color=#fffffe]One cool setting may be to force all soft shadow quality to 2 (or whatever) in preview mode.[/color]

I’m enjoying messiah’s setup features, light rig testing and switching, material editor is way cool, render speed is respectable (but of course never fast enough), soft shadow lights (yummy panel lights), etc.

[color=YellowGreen]Did I mention how cool the materials editor is? Fantastic work environment for multi-layered maps, dirt, compositing . . . what a pleasure! :thumbsup:

[/color]

#124

Are you using metanurbs for your objects? Then it is very easy to have them low poly in the viewport with the metanurbs setting “only draw at rendertime” or setting a different subdiv level for viewport and rendering.

There is also the “metamation” effect, but I have never used it. I think I remember that your objects have to be created in a specific way from the low poly object for it to work?

I honestly never had this problem since I can’t even remember when I was using high-rez non-subdiv-objects the last time :slight_smile:

Sorry, can’t help much.

But sure a lot could be done towards better management functions…

But at least you can save rendersettings from the right mouse menus…

Cheers,

#125

Thanks for the tips, Thomas :thumbsup:

I’m using mostly non-metaNURBed objects. I suppose this is the “old” way of doing it. Speaking of old, here’s the opening frame of my sequence…

final_test_01.jpg720x576

720x576 (PAL res)
5min render time
2 panel lights with soft raytrace shadows

The trophies and watch are lo-res stand-ins, hence the bad quality if you look closely. I’m still developing the scene.

I’ve decided on this front angle so that the eye is not distracted with angles and things happening in the distance. This way the eye immediately looks at the various objects and details.

#126

Very Cool! :thumbsup: :thumbsup: :thumbsup:

#127

Rendered this while I took a break and watched the live action film Heidi with my wife and kids on DVD. What a grand story and so nicely retold.

final_test_02.jpg720x576

same scene (unfortunately same low poly objects)
1hour 17min 32sec render time
AA = Adaptive SS, Level 5, Threshold 0.005
lowered the intensity of the 2 panel lights (left the soft shadow quality at 2)
turned on Monte Carlo GI with 7 samples, Depth = 1, GI Intensity = 0.2, Light Source = ALL

  • added the old South African flag pin in the far corner of the tin

Rather nice except for the render time. I would rather fancy rendering my entire 875 frame animation like this but that would amount to 1,094 hours of rendering, or 46 days running 24/7. Even if the client was willing to wait, I’d really miss not being able to use my computer in that time, so I’ll not consider it (although I’m sure my wife and children wouldn’t mind).

#128

Are there any easy ways to get the Motion Graph / Dope Sheet and the Shader Flow to jump open and closed? Or is dragging them open the only way?

#129

Very nice renders, Paul. I don’t know of any way to make them pop open/close either. Maybe it should be a feature request. :slight_smile:

#130

I’ve been dojng render tests to get the best balance of quality vs speed.

Quality in most things are acceptable with AA using Adaptive Sampling Level 3 and a threshold of 0.015. However, soft shadows need extra quality to get the grain out.

Note that these tests are based on 2 panel lights with ray traced soft shadows.

[ol]
[li]AA on Level 2, soft shadow quality 0 = bad AA and very grainy shadow…4min 4sec[/li][li]AA on Level 2, soft shadow quality 1 = bad AA and very grainy shadow…4min 4sec[/li][li]AA on Level 2, soft shadow quality 2 = bad AA and very grainy shadow…4min 5sec[/li][li]AA on Level 2, soft shadow quality 3 = bad AA and good shadow…7min 31sec[/li][li]AA on Level 3, soft shadow quality 0 = grainy shadow…8min 0sec[/li][li]AA on Level 3, soft shadow quality 2 = grainy shadow…8min 0sec[/li][li]AA on Level 3, soft shadow quality 3 = same grainy shadow…8min 1sec[/li][li]AA on Level 3, soft shadow quality 4 = excellent shadow…14min[/li][li]AA on Level 4, soft shadow quality 0 = excellent AA and shadow…13min 25sec[/li][li]AA on Level 4, soft shadow quality 1 = excellent AA and shadow…13min 31sec[/li][li]AA on Level 4, soft shadow quality 2 = excellent AA and shadow…13min 28sec[/li][li]AA on Level 4, soft shadow quality 3 = excellent AA and shadow…13min 27sec[/li][li]AA on Level 4, soft shadow quality 5 = excellent AA and very smooth shadow…25min 32sec[/li][/ol]It seems that while soft shadow quality is equal to or less than the AA Level, then there is no difference in shadow quality. As soon as the soft shadow quality is more than the AA Level, then suddenly render time increases and the quality significantly improves.

Exactly how AA and soft shadow quality interact may perhaps be best answered by pmG.

#131

Yes, I agree. Where is Wegg lately? He has been more in contact directly with the developers than any of us with the exception of Taron. My experiences concerning the Soft Shadows and AA Levels have been similar.

Off the top of my head, I remember having to be careful with Enhanced AA with GI renderings. It appears that the final “beauty” pass of the algorithim creates a bit of a mottled paper texture appearance. I remember doing a screen capture just befoe the final AA pass happens. I’ll have to look into again.

#132

Beautiful stuff man! :thumbsup:

Warmly,

Kelly

#133

Thanks for the support Gary and Kelly. :slight_smile:

I hope to be wrapping up this project really soon. Although that still involves a process of getting approval, making changes, delivering a rough timing master for audio mixing and so that video packaging can commence while I run the final quality renders. Once final rendered, I simply replace the rough animation clips with the finals and the update will reflect throughout all the packaged shows on the client’s edit system (Video Toaster).

I’ll be posting more final work from now on and once the final is delivered, I’ll post the sequences.

#134

Agreed - very confusing that AA/Shadow stuff.

And yes, the Enhanced mode reintroduces grain from the first pass in that final filter pass.
For ages.
Makes it rather unusable… :frowning:

I really like your renderings, I would maybe make some stuff going out of the frame, so it does look less “arranged”.
Rendertimes are a bit steep, but you may need a little renderfarm anyway in the end…

Best of luck!

#135

Thanks Thomas!

Final scene setup happening this week. I’ll consider your advice, although I may be going for the “more arranged” look. It is supposed to be someone’s display area for their trophies and memorabilia, so that is naturally a bit more arranged.

I’ll see what can be done about rendering. Didn’t you once mention that messiah has a stand-alone renderer? In other words, if I’d like to distribute my render job among disconnected machines (not a render farm), would I be able to do it?

#136

“Standalone Rendering” is basically using a renderfarm with non connected machines - which just makes it more tedious to setup but otherwise works the same.
I think Wegg is the one to ask here (but he seems to be rather busy these days) since he is using Butterfly Netrender AFAIK. This is the only available solution for messiah network rendering that is maintained.
I also got the free “Spider” working with messiah: There is/was that little commandlinetool called “render.exe” that should still work, but it was rather limited and had problems with loading large images. There is a helpfile included with it (Command_Line_Render.htm).
I think it came with 2.2.
It was only working with mpj files.

So yes, you should be able to start standalone renderings with this tool from a commandline. But be prepared for some problems, better test it early.

Cheers,

#137

Thanks for the tips Thomas. I downloaded Spider and see that it accesses renderers via the commandline.

Can’t I access messiah’s renderer from the commandline myself?

Or is this not an option?

I’m hoping to keep the workflow simple without introducing more software. Any further advice?

#138

The motion graph can currently be panned left and right by holding ALT while dragging left and right with the left mouse button pressed.

It would be cool if vertical cursor motion translated to zooming in and out with the cursor position on the graph as the center. For those who may get freaked out by such behaviour, an option menu or toggle button could perhaps en-/disable this feauture.

The reason I need it is that I’m a tablet user and using the pan and zoom icons top right of the motion graph is not feasible since there’s no more room to move. This feature would reeeeeally make motion graph navigation slick.

I know this has been posted previously, but no harm in asking again…I hope. :slight_smile:

EDIT: OK, I just saw that vertical motion is vertical pan if you unlock the “Lock Graph to Curve Values” toggle button. Perhaps then another ALT + RMB for zoom?

#139

This may or may not serve your purpose, but you can start a sequence of renders on one machine, pulll the dongle out and plug it in the next computer, start the renders on that one and so on. There will be a popup about the HASP dongle not being present, but the they will continue to render and save without the dongle. :smiley:

#140

ROFL, you are kidding, right??? :wip:

BTW. I mean that in a “man that is a freaky, but cool solution” kind of way. :smiley: