Is there a problem with the 'Rate This Thread' Option ?

Wow, thank you for bring this up! I was wondering the same thing!

About rating system being abused, I too have been noticing that lately with some great artworks that they only get 3* stars. I rationalized that by thinking that the current art’s standard has shoot up last few months. Understandably, the rating system change had to be done; however, I find myself missing the stars rating system.

Admittedly, I am one of the biggest “rating voters” here, but a serious, real one! Often, I don’t have time to comment so I rate instead, at least it’s something I could do to contribute quickly without losing too much time. Being a learning and passionate artist, I find managing time so difficult to master, it’s my biggest weakness, so I often have to seriously prioritize few selected things such as painting/drawing study, etc. to develop my secure life and future. Commenting takes me a while to do because English is not my native language (probably same for a lot artists out there) and I always want to make sure it is understandable for everybody by putting my effort in writing. Hence, it’s not uncommon of me to spend about 30 minutes or even more time writing a comment like this post.

With that being said, visually expressing (overpainted criqitue) and star rating provide a much more natural and quicker method for me because I’m strongly visual. Furthermore, often, I don’t feel qualified to give a comment because they are great masters! They all are my masters, I’m merely a learning servant and just by hearing my comment, it will cause more irritation rather than happiness. And if I do give one, I always make sure it is more than “It looks good, cya!” comment. Obviously, depth is very important to me. I always do it with depth, whether I vote on rating or leave a comment. So, without the stars rating system, I feel like I’m missing out. I am aware that we all should comment more and get more involved, which I do agree with; however, like I have pointed out earlier, I just don’t have all the time for leaving a comment and I am the type of person who doesn’t like leaving a short and over-general comment… so I hope that the new voting system provide at least some same flexibility in rating like before, of course without being prone to the abuses so that I could at least contribute a bit more than just viewing without losing too much time in writing.

Just my two cents.

Also hey, I can see that the CG staff are trying so hard to provide us all a good art-surfing/learning experience! Thank you! I really appreciate that!

And then on the flip side you’ve got someone like me. If I voted it was 5 stars everytime. Why, because I only voted on pieces that I liked and felt they deserved 5 stars. But then, I hardly ever thought about voting because I would comment more often than not. So hard to please everyone. Hope this new system works out good for you staffers.

Have I told you lately that I love you…for bring this up
your question is not ridiculous at all! it’s totally valid! you get jack’s approval now! (>’.’)>

obviously, the system still needs some tweaking. Yet i agree, good to see the mods and engis care about the users.

imo, get rid of the stars (not saying get rid of the rating system). there are 8 years of old works in choice gala rated as 4 stars and now all of sudden 5 stars everywhere. get rid of the stars so nothing conflicts with the old habits. start something new.

Hehe Jack , nice to see you here .

As you know, stars never meant anything to me caus’ sometime some excellent works were forgotten only become people didn’t see them .
Naturally , ( and I admit I sometime act this way) , we look at work with stars more easly caus’ it means it ‘s probably a good work .
But due to that, sometimes, we don’t even see a great job as well just near, caus’ it hasn’t stars on its thread .

So I agree with Jack, no more stars .
I personnaly think that comments have more value than only stars.
Caus’ this way, the user really shows that he have some interest about the work he looks at !

This forum is really great, with many talented artists .
Stars don’t help people to communicate each other.
Comment really helps about that .
I think it’s that moderators have in mind by changing this rating system .
I hope I am right

I’ve noticed the missing ratings over the last few weeks and while I concede that the previous system was open to abuse I’ve found that the lack of a basic guide to image quality has driven me away from the site. Which is a shame as I occasionally spot talent through this forum.

[color=white]I simply don’t have time to wade through every image in the morning, I used to use the rating system as a quick and dirty quality filter; it didn’t mean I agreed with every rating but it was a fairly consistent guide.

Might I suggest that your problem is with the users rather than the system. Could a way be found to weight trusted users ‘votes’ over more impetuous casters?

Cheers

Ian Lovett
Fable Franchise Art Director
Lionhead Studios / MGS
[/color]

Such things have been discussed behind the scenes, and whether they happen or not will come down to many variables - time being certainly a big part of it. vBulletin is a great forum software, and many custom features have obviously been hacked into it here at CGS. Whether a complex and fair weighting system can be constructed and bolted on to vB in any reasonable amount of time is unlikely.

same feelings here. I don’t come to CGS anymore because I can’t see where the good art is. Don’t want to post either since I think no one will look at my stuff anymore.

Agree. The old voting system was the way better than the new one. At least, i’ve always knew, where to click for getting some good piece of art, and where not to bother. Yes, i have to admit, that situation with voting vandalism was, well, annoying. But still, for lots of users four stars was the way better, than none. And if you may see now, the amount of clicks for most of works is fell down quite badly. And, i guess, the great number of cg-users are in this exact forum mostly because of an ability to show they’s work for as big public, as possible. Well, at least im here for this reason mainly, to be absolutely honest But yet, all what’s written above is only an IMO. Anyway, im quite happy that someone cares for that situation. Thx for that:)

Sorry for my chinglish, if what.

So what some are saying is that they went to the galleries looking only for the pieces that had a certain average of stars and now feel lost because that doesn’t work anymore?

Sorry, for me that’s a very good reason to like the new system even more. Personally I try to visit, see what’s new, and then form my opinion without being influenced by 1-5 stars…
It would appear, from what I read, that, with the old system if for any reason a piece didn’t reach a specific average for some members it didn’t exist…and what about the pieces overrated by fanboy-voting?

I prefer to use my own eyes, and (eventually) the comments as a guideline. Thank you.

what buffles me personally is the fact that one can only give 5 stars to someone, which would obviously mean an average score of 5.0, yet when you hover over the the stars you get all sorts of numbers like 4.78 or 4.92… now how the hell does that happen?

I think 3-5 should be available or none at all, personally…

Apparently there is point devaluation (controlled down voting) going on behind the scene --moderated quality control, converting one to a few votes to a 4-point value to create a hierarchy of quality not based solely on the number of votes cast per entry. It seems, after all, it is necessary to down vote in the new system as it was in the old one. :hmm:

Nonsense. There is absolutely no such “moderated quality control” going on. However there are some anomalies in the ratings, which have negligible effect on the system, however I’ll have a look into it.

I just got an idea, which punched me out of bed:) What if, to bring back that one-to-five stars voting system, just not the way it was before, but according to number of that votes we have got now. Like, five votes - one star, ten votes - two stars, etc. And that, i guess, would solve the problem with that shifting down of results, and, on the other hand, would let people to feel more comfortable in surfing through the gallery. And just because you will not be able to make “minus one vote”, technically, it will make that vandalism just impossible, in fact. Or, something like that. Not sure if its easy to make in this vbulletin system, but still… That’s the idea. May be this is complete nonsense, dunno. So, don’t hit me with a boots, if this solution is absolute rubbish, or my spelling is terrible as hell:)

i like your idea

Nonsense? Whether absolutely true or not, it is a perfectly viable scenario—far from nonsense.

*from the current ‘Voting Bug’ sister thread in the support forum.

Whether purely algorithmic or manually manipulated, I’d call that system-bias, moderated (filtered) quality control. The non-5-point valued vote/units that comprise the vote average are all 4-point units, which can be viewed as 4-star votes, whether algorithmic or manual.

**Not to say that’s a bad thing. I think it is necessary, since I think that there is just as much (actually more) of a problem with rampant overvaluation in general, as there was with down-voting devaluation in the old system.

Yes nonsense. We do not change the ratings. Period. What we are tweaking is how many votes are needed over how much time before a thread is marked with stars. That’s what Kirt is referring to. If a thread receives x number of 5 star votes, that is how many they have.

Based on what ? Have you performed analysis of the trends in extreme voting? Because I have, and the actual numbers tell a different story. If you do not have access to the raw data, you are unable to make any sort of judgements on this. I’m afraid you’ll just have to trust me

I trust you! I trust you!
I greatly appreciate your informative reply. Information is good.
I can put away the chicken bones and astrological charts now. :argh:

“Based on what?”

1. I saw a trend of extreme voting, based on closely tracking quite a few old-system entry vote histories (over time), using an Excel table I put together for the purpose (though not as rigorous a process based on the detailed and complete vote history data of every entry in each of the galleries (which of course I’m not privy to).
2. It’s obvious (to me) that there is a consistent overvaluation trend in play concluded simply by looking at the images and their vote averages (again, referencing old-system entries). Yes, this is a subjective opinion, with the realization that some subjective opinions are more objective than others (e.g. this is why the general voting community does not have the final say in what gets a choice award).

Pity to know about people giving 1 star to good artworks.

Anyway I hope the new systems works fair to everybody, it seems strange to me, I liked rating system, but I understand the points here.

Anyway I value more the comments as any stars, and I used to spend some time clicking over any, literally ANY artwork posted, not only hot ones, I think that’s what makes us a community isn’t ?
To look for some great inspirational artwork as well to help and advice, motivate, others who are just starting on the path right ?

After all I think Jack is right:

imo, get rid of the stars (not saying get rid of the rating system). there are 8 years of old works in choice gala rated as 4 stars and now all of sudden 5 stars everywhere. get rid of the stars so nothing conflicts with the old habits. start something new.

Best wishes to everybody,

but in the end only with 4-5 stars will make the artwork into CG Choice Gallery.
i agree with some friends here about stars sytem, not every artwork with 4-5 stars is great artwork. we still need to see the overall detail, creativity, originality, effort, passion and development.

no offense here, in the past year some of cg mate use download model, place it nicely and render it own skill still manage can get 4-5 stars! they really lack of creativity or original skill.
the only skill i saw is rendering.
this is totally unhealthy to the cg industry.
cgsociety is one of the leader cg community and should have a proper solution and sytem to generate much more talent, skill and great cg people and not only the artwork itself.
a good cg artist will produce good artwork.

thank you.

*i m one from the short of stars player but never give up in this cg industry coz i believe there is an evolution and working hard to see the change.

Thanks! I was getting really frustrated by my work getting two star reviews and less polished works getting four!

This makes me feel better…