How can CGtalk help those working on a 1 -2 min short?(Request for ideas)


#1

I have some ideas that I want to pitch to the “power that be” from the forum
to help thos who are interested in producing a indie short (indiviual or colab)
in a short amount of time (6 to 8 months ). Maybe using a “Chuck Jones” type of story.
The lenght of the short would be (30 sec to 2 min)

I would love to hear yours ideas, so when I make my pitch I can use
you input.

-R


#2

The problem is there’s alot of forums out there already doing this…9 months 30 second forums comes to mind right away. As for how CGT could help…I can see it getting people together to collab…and then getting constructive crits from this place but other than that…I don’t see CGT willing to dole out cash or anything for funding or whatever…I am curious what others take on this would be though…maybe i’m just a putz:)


#3

Hey Robert whats up? It’s me Lord Ryan, I met you and Jose at Siggraph. How are things going. Well here is the animation challenge proposal.

  1. Everyone that wants to participate has to have a script. You can work as a team or as an individual, it’s up to that person. This will be the initial post to start the animation challenge. Everyone who will participating has to give feedback. This is to ensure that everyone has an equal participation in the challenge. ( There are alot of people out there that don’t get responses, so this should help those people get noticed too. ) Another thing is once you update your script you must replace the old one with the new one, so you don’t have pages of updated scripts. Time given should be no longer than a month to a month and a half.

  2. Once the script has been finalized by a moderator than they can proceed to do storyboard, also moderators will finalized each segment for each person to move on. Storyboard can be rough just as long as everyone else can understand it too. This will work the same as far as critics go as above. Again moderators will look at it and finalize storyboard. ( Moderators who participate will be more so like mentors. ) The storyboard should take no longer than one month.

  3. Here is character creation and modeling. Self explanatory. This we will give each individual a month. Again same thing, drawings and models need to be posted for feedback.

  4. Rigging, skinning and texturing. This will be about a month and a half. If an individual needs some help rigging then its only best to find someone that knows how to rig and skin or texture. But other than that moderators need not to finalize this, because the rig is setup to individual setups. This is exactly a month in a half. No one can move on until it reach the end of the time limit. This only to be equal to everyone.

  5. Animation should be a month. Again post, post, post. You only can get better as an animator if you get feedback. Moderators need not finalize character animation. Each individual needs to give full heart into there animation. This is what the whole project is about. Story and animation.

  6. Finally rendering. About a month for each individual. So a good 6 months should sum up the project. Feedback is the most important. So anyone who participates needs to give fedback for each individual at least once. The only thing moderators should look at is script. If the story is there than its up to them to finalize it. With everything else community should be helping each other out. This is a community to help each other. Everyone is all going for the same goal why not share.

That’s it Robert if there is any other questions just email me or pm me. My email addresses are lord_rms@hotmail.com or [color=white]lord_rms@yahoo.com [/color]what ever one works for you. I hoope to hear from you soon. Take care.

Ryan


#4

Lord Ryan…nice name:)

As for getting approval by mods…how would that work and would people be comfortable with that…I mean…then the mod becomes the director…just curious:)

Devil’s Advocate:twisted:


#5

Hey Remi, thanks. My mother gave me that name.

Anyways as far as mods go for finalizing script, they are mentors not directors. They should have more knowledge as far as how good a story is. If not we can get someone who is knowledgable in scripts. This challenge is basically for all animators to express a story and act out a character, give it emotions and feelings. The most part is everyone should participate in feedback, no matter what level you are. There should be no intimidation what so ever for newbies. Overall this should be a learning experience. If you complete the short or not at least you will have an understanding of how to better your own production pipeline and you will gain the knowledge and respect of everyone that has participated in the animation challenge. That all I have for right now. Later Remi, have a good one.

Lord Ryan


#6

this sounds like a very good idea, though i wonder how newbies would fit in, if at all. maybe segment the projects into “levels”; beginner’s projects, intermediate’s projects, advanced projects, and professional’s projects. each would be catagorized (by mods) based on former work the participants have done. people applying for the “beginner’s” level can be anyone with the least experiences, but with somewhat familiarity with the application he/she wishes to use, for example, someone who’s been trying to learn for a few months. and then the intermediate, advanced, and professional level applicants can be assesed based on thier previous works.

is that a good idea i wonder?

anyway, also,

what he said.

again, looks like a good idea, lets hope it picks up and people get enthused about it.


#7

Wouldn’t it be cool if we could take the Monster Garage approach? 5-6 builders, 1-2 weeks, limited budget (in this case … “zero, zip, nada!”) and one wicked monster!

I think it could be done. Would be interesting if we could watch the action via webcams or something. Heheheheh.


#8

hmm … there are fewer replies than i’d have thought, guess the idea isn’t appealing to most?

as a side note, working on a project just for the fun of it can be very educational, and can also be a challenge to one’s own abilities. as an example, someone onced asked me to do a model for him, and i said i was a total noob (which i still am btw) but he said he wasn’t looking for quality, just something recognizable. so i modeled a bunny (lol), something i’d never have done otherwise, and although he didn’t end up using it, i did learn from it quite a bit, things about modeling and things about texturing. so it was very useful for my learning.

as i’m sure this idea will be useful to a lot of people if it ever takes off.

cheers.


#9

Newbies could model and rig props. :stuck_out_tongue: Sometimes, doing that is as fun as doing a character. Or you could have a junkyard scene and have some people put in their item of choice. Then we could just import them all in, set them all with rigid body dynamics and then have them just fall in place. Everyone could easily get in on this.

peace,

Lu


#10

If you wanted to get a good model than you would have to colaborate with other people. But the main focus would be storytelling and animation am I correct? I am sure if one or a team had a really good story and good animation then modelling shouldn’t really matter as long as people can understand what they are looking at. What about we have a topic, lets say a children story. We have modelers model out a few characters. From there we have riggers, rig the characters. Then we have texture artists texture the characters. Then to begin the project each group or individual has to write a script using the given props to tell a story. Everyone will critique each script then move on to the next level, this would storyboarding. Then once that is done than animation would begin to give each character to life to tell the story.

Lord Ryan


#11

This is a wonderful idea. Its been similarily proposed by http://www.fiercefire.com/cgi-bin/yabb/YaBB.pl

Would be need to see some homogenity here and have the two sites work together? Who knows but great idea ;D


#12

I dunno about the webcams, but I think that’s a great idea for a challenge here.

Have a team of like 4-10 people do a 30 to 2 minute animation in a set amount of time say 1 month or 2 tops, and have a panel to judge the winner.

That would be pretty cool, and be a good experience for people who participate because it simulates some real world tight deadlines :slight_smile:


#13

Maybe sub-threads in collabrative team projects forum? I would like to dividi up the tasks into buildings, characters, and props, etc.


#14

This is actually a touch of what is happening at Pixel Corps Online… there is a member fee associated, but that funds a lot of things including bandwidth, software, training, and many other aspects.

It would be interesting to see something similar happen here… but there is advantages to the PXO dynamic that the open-cgtalk environment might not be able to facilitate. As I am a staunch supporter and under a beta agreement… I cannot divulge much more than I already have. Perhaps too much already.


#15

watches Jdex get beat up and thrown into a tinted limo

wow…I guess he wasn’t kidding…:eek:

hah…my stupid sense of humor aside…

what’s the address to this site? Is it up yet…or just strictly all beta right now?


#16

Still in beta… but you can see a bit of what it’s all about at http://www.pixelcorps.com/

The director is none other than Alex Lindsay of DVgarage/ScreenSavers/Call For Help/ SW:TPM Fame.

There may be an openly announced call for participation sometime soon… but there is a membership limit, and it looks like the vast majority of beta members will stay involved.


#17

Roberto,

I think it is a great idea to encourage the creation of short films here on CG Talk.
In what ways can CG Talk help facilitate this?

Let’s look at the problems facing the successful completion of an animated short:
The number one issue is motivation. People tend to start out enthusiastic and fizzle after a few weeks.
Perhaps CG Talk could use its clout to get some sort of prize. Doesn’t have to be big. That way the production teams have a carrot so to speak.

The second issue I think is time. Many times, people will bite off more than they can chew and that directly affects the first problem of motivation. Keeping the projects simple and managable is key. Especially for a first-time project.
I would suggest posing a time limit. 30 sec to 1 minute is probably more than enough for a first project, especially if it’s collaborative with personel spread over many parts of the world.
I also suggest coming up with a handful of scenarios that people could pick from. Keep them vague enough that there is room for interpretation and even if 5 teams pick the same scenario, the end result will be five different shorts.
If a team would like to do their own idea, perhaps then would be a good time to have it approved to make sure that it is a viable project to complete.

Lastly, DEADLINES are crucial to keeping a project on schedule. An idea would be to break the short film down into a production schedule of script, storyboards/concept art, models, rigs, textures, animation, lighting, rendering. Each stage would have a set deadline that is strictly enforced. If a team misses a deadline, they are out. Fired so to speak. This gives it a real-world feel and stresses the importance of working within a structured schedule. They can still finish the short and are encouraged to, but would be out of the competition. That may sound harsh but strict deadlines keep the production moving forward. Perhaps there could be one grace given for acts of God that interupt production and affect the deadlines (these can and do happen from time to time). Each team would get one “mulligan” that could be used for one production deadline only. A second chance.

Maybe CG Talk could then create a DVD of the shorts (sort of like the Expose books). I don’t know how realistic that is, it’s just a sugestion.

Well, those a just some thoughts and suggestions to take or leave!

Art :thumbsup:


#18

So lets get this all “out in the open”…

Is CGTalk going to open a new “contest” where small teams of members band together and submit a film? The best man( or Lady! ) wins, an’all?

Would CGTalk set a “theme” like they already do in the already-established “challenges”?

If this is so, I would suggest the following…

  1. Set the films for 5-minutes maximum. Entries submitted over five-minutes must be cut-down.

  2. The first prize is something like a…umm…bag of malteziers! Nahhh…errr…the chance to produce a decent 20-minute film using resources at a film studio or whatever.

  3. Films should be judged on story & character - not flashy VFX. This gives everyone a fair deal and just as good a chance as the next person.

  4. Those who make into the top-ten should get at least an EXPOSE II book… :cool:


#19

sounds good,

and don’t forget people … that the whole animation should be in the style, or at least simplistic atmosphere as the chuck jones cartoons.


#20

Thanks for the comments so far.
The proposal idea i have in mind (And this is ONLY a proposal ) is to do a no prize milestone based animation challenge modelled after the tesis program at Ringling School of Art and Design.
Some of the principles of their animations are:

  • Keep It Simple
    *Milestone based process
  • No more than 2 characters.
  • If using 2 characters, one hass to be a simple rig
  • Between 30 secs to 2 minutes.
  • Story is the key

The REAL final prize could be to have a short that could be aubmitted to the SIGGRAPH conference.

The reason I want to make it in the Chuck Jones style is that aI belive that the wit and simplicity of his toons are the way to go for this kind of thing.

I stronly belive that cgtalk can have the same impact at the SIGGRAPH conference that places like the Vancouver film school and Ringling currently have.

-R