There is no perfect system, there will always be pros/cons in absolutely any method used.
The purpose of this forum is to promote art & skill. How many post before mine focus on that?.. 10% ?
Art pieces like this one are not beneficial for this type of forum. Not because they are not good but because people loose track of why they are here in the first place.
As the admin who rejected the image, I have not received any correspondence from anyone regarding this.
I rejected it because I think the texture and shading work is not a high enough standard. For example, dried blood is not a transparent red, it is a dark, almost black, mostly solid colour, while the blood on the armour here looks like spilled soda. The details are also haphazardly placed without much thought to their motivation or origin. The shader is generic, so much so that I can’t figure out whether the armour is plastic or metal. The lighting could also be improved as it’s really incongruous - the setting and feel suggest a studio lighting setup, while the colours are like a sunset.
Regarding the religious nature of the image, personally I find it skirting the border of appropriateness, but considering the obvious reference to historical crusaders, that would not have prevented it from being accepted.
I really don’t get where the sense of entitlement is coming from with regards to people not getting into the galleries recently
Hi Legih,
thank you for clarifying that it was not religious connotations that got the image rejected.
Personally i did not think it aswell.
I respect your critique and respect you as an artist.
No image is without critique- that is in fact one of the reasons people post work- to get critique.
Since the image was accepted into other galleries and was (as i have mentioned before) spotlighted as image of the month i feel you should re-evaluate when you deem an image not good enough even to be presented.
There was not ONE bad post on other forums
INFACT in the 40 comments it received it got only high praises
to post a few:
NEWTEK
LUXOLOGY
SPINQUAD
FRONT PAGE OF IT S ART (for some reason the forum does not let me link to itsart so youl have to do it on foot)
even Rhys said and i quote “personally I think the image excellent”.
Now, perhaps all of these people are just wrong, or have low standards, or are just too nice to give bad critique-
perhaps…
Or perhaps you should reconsider how you position yourselfe when rejecting images.
Even in this thread people fabricated religious reasons for rejection failing to see the image to be as bad as you see it.
Perhaps being in a position to deny people exposure of their hard work, you should give this more thought.
thx.
veljko
www.lemonade3d.com
The grounds the admin used to reject the image do seem perfectly valid and observable…
Now, would a dark blood, metallic shading and direct sun lighting make this image better?
I think the image as it is does hit a cord… a lot of subtle contrast going on… a lot of neither/nor’s…
The pose shows strength without enforcing it.
Perfectly clear in the center surrounded by dust or smoke.
Beautiful light defined wings next to his own dark undefined shadow.
He looks up for guidance but for something that has already happened.
He yields a gun but holds a rosary even tighter.
Add what the admin said:
Neither Plastic nor metal. (Soft/Hard)
Neither indoor light nor outdoor. (Cold/Warm/Direct/Diffuse)
Neither blood nor water. (Real/Not)
Everything is a mix, everything hints to its opposite… I like it… good work.
Position myself? I’m really not sure what you mean by that. All galleries have criteria by which they judge submissions. You will not find a single art gallery in the world that accepts absolutely everything that was submitted, and I don’t understand why there’s a handful of people here expect us to be different. At the risk of sounding abrasive, I really don’t care how other websites received the work - they’re not us and we’re not them.
I really can’t get my head around why people take such offence to the suggestion that their work could be improved. I really love photography and am quite a keen hobby photographer myself - I’ve submitted a couple of photos to online galleries but every one of them has been rejected and I’ve never, ever, ever complained about it, or felt hurt by it. Because I respect every site’s right to accept or reject work based on their standards.
Furthermore, I find it strange that you’re quoting all these sites where you’ve been receiving all this praise, yet for some reason this isn’t sufficient. If the work has already been accepted and praised elsewhere, why is it such an affront that one website didn’t accept the work? How am I denying you exposure when the image has, by all accounts, already received ample exposure elsewhere?
I guess I am just finding it hard to see why you’re so upset.
Hi Leigh.
Honestly, the image is NOT mine-as i said at the first post i made,
i thought the image and the artist behind it deserved better then they got from the jury and CGSOCIETY
this the reason behind the post
I mentioned the other sites to give you perspective. Often it is difficult to go outside our heads and perspective gives us different points of view that put our own decision in different light
btw. you did not suggest the work can be improved but that it failed to meet the lowest standard of exceptable work for this forum. The difference is HUGE.
The message that the artist receives makes the improvement part of the equation very explicit. I wrote the rejection message very carefully so that it would be something encouraging as opposed to discouraging.
I remember finishing a piece a long time ago (a trailer for my band’s new album, a sort of mechanical butterfly ending up in the album’s cover) thinking, “hey, this time I’m getting front page!”. I had good hopes as the wip was getting a lot of attention. Then I got if finished, made a thread with the final piece, I think I had one or two answers, nothing happened. I really did not understand, but let it go.
Now I look back, and even when I believe it still looks ok, it was no way frontpage material.
I don’t know where all this sensitivity to how the admins are wording the answers is comming lately, but there is plenty of it for sure.
I personally don’t find the piece that great, and even when I’ve seen work with that quality in the galeries before, I think they’re trying to raise that bar (and I think that’s a good thing).
Since you want to press the issue.
Though I dont think the image is bad, I do see clearly where it could have fallen below that fuzzy yay-nay threshold of acceptability.
Personally I see nothing spectacular about this image let alone creative or aesthetic.
The armor design is mediocre at best. The feet look like they are attached to the wrong legs.
The blood(?) looks like watercolor stains and smudges. The cross insignia looks like smudged wet paint (being the same color as the blood[?]) on the left and right.
The composition and lighting are unimpressive and weak. The character is being overwhelmed, as a focal visual element, by the dominating textural contrasts of the wall, and that odd contrived apparition-like shadow emanating from the characters foot.
The textures make the character look like a toy.
The stenciled wings are a bit of a nice touch.
I really dont think most people that find this image mediocre at best, and are not shocked by its gallery rejection, would bother to add a negative comment to all the fanfare, simply out of lack of interest or motivation to do so.
I really dont place a lot of emphasis on the mass opinion of quality judging by a large pool of 3d cg artisan/crafters constituted by the disproportionately large amount of amature-to-averge folk compared to the minute number of stellar artists making up the pool. A thousand votes on a truly stellar piece of work reflects a pretty reliable indicator of real quality. Whereas quality judging, from this same pool, on a piece of work that is truly only slightly above average, rapidly free-falls off a cliff into la la land.
Thats my honkin 2 cents worth.
There was a big thread about this some time ago: http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=2&t=955043
I don’t personally think the image is good enough to be in the showcase section of this forum. That’s my subjective point of view. I am not going to dissect what I think is wrong with it but sometimes you have to accept that not everyone is going to have the same opinion as you and it’s CGSociety’s right to deem an image not good enough for their showcase section. I don’t always agree with their choices, but I believe they are artists with opinions and have the right to say what they like or don’t like.
You’re bringing this up as if this image is the holy grail (excuse the pun) of 3D imagery. That it’s black and white, that someone who doesn’t think is good must be absolutely wrong and that’s the end of it. To me it’s the that it’s simply not good enough to be with the other artwork in the showcase section.
The modern crusader has been done before, and much better IMO. That’s not a judgement on the artist and his other work. Just my opinion about this particular piece and I feel CG Society has every right to choose not to highlight it.
Yeah I don’t see what is here to be so upset about. The image is not that high of quality compared to what is out there these days. Maybe in 2000 this image would of been amazing, right now it is very mediocre.
I think this post will pretty much cover it all.
http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpost.php?p=6867619&postcount=98
Hej Veljko, good to see you here, I personally liked Milivoj’s artwork but maybe he should be the one to resolve it with mods.
I’we had similar issue with my latest personal artwork, but Leigh was kind enough to explain me very politely all the reasons why it was rejected.
I’we heard some similar comments from many artists around, and you also had your own observations, so I invested a bit more time, it turns out quite easier to read, and it was accepted.
Yet I didn’t received any award so far ( except evermotion front page and nice comments from few comic book fans ), and not some high recognition anywhere around, so yes it hurts after so many hours I’we spent, but that’s life and we learn even from our fails.
I’m also glad that he received so many other rewards, he should be proud to himself.
Best regards, and i believe he could resolve this one.
[left][color=white][font=Arial]Well I know I will not get a straight answer on this but just got to add that I was rejected. I wonder if I was not to say a word about all this… would it have been accepted? I know I have posted about this in other places and I am sure mods have seen it. Check out my cg port to see the added breakdowns and extra images. Sure their is some stuff that is not perfect. Meh tis life. I know by posting here, about this it is a cause and effect situation that was obviously devised even if the people say it was not. A coincidence like this is funny. and do as you wish with my acount. Thanks for the awesome people here. Not angry just disapointed I wished this community did not go this way.
[/left]
[left]
[/left]
[left]I wont post again ever. Because this to me confirms that something is wrong here.[/left]
[left] [/left]
[/font][/color]
Sorry Rogelio, but your post doesn’t make a smidge of sense.
I don’t mean in its content, I mean in its form.
Particularly this
[color=white] I know by posting here, about this it is a cause and effect situation that was obviously devised even if the people say it was not. A coincidence like this is funny.
truly makes none.
And the image at the bottom?
Is that your work and you wonder why it wasn’t accepted? It’s not a terrible piece, and it does tick the “finished work” checkbox, but that’s about it. You might want to take a stronger piece than that to argue gallery admission, because it’s generally a rather below-par image.
[/color]
I think this is an issue about consistancy, not about the quality of people’s work per se. I dont want to post examples, but go look at some of the work that was acepted in the last week or so, and some of it is WAY worse than some of the stuff here that’s been rejected. It just needs to be a little more consistant.
How sad that non-artistic criteria play some role in judging the work sent here.
Even more sad that one can catch a polite suggestion to modify the image in order to make it more “politically correct”.
Censorship has never done any good to art.
Also, one may notice that no new images have been added to Choice and 3D stills galleries since many days till yesterday (I’ve not yet checked for today), and there’s a lot of good material lookable around.
What’s happening? People stop sending? Evaluating requires weeks?
It’s not the crusade inspired imagery that prevented the image to reach the gallery, and there’s been a fair bit of more biased content making it through because it was artistical and/or technically on par.
In short: Read the mods and admin posts again, it doesn’t.