Grand Space Opera 3D Entry: David Marsh


The texture for Dr Joyce.


Rendering of Dr Zoe Joyce. Dr Joyce is the heroine of my Grand Space Opera and porvides the mandatory love interest for the main character Kane.


The first rendring of the three characters together, lit with a blue light from the right and red from the left. My next mission is to create an upper torso for each of them. C&C most welcome.



I have followed your progress for a while, mainly because of your texturing skills, as mine sucks. Never really worked with textures, just played around with modelling. Anyway, “Bull” and “Kane” are great models. Your last model though is wrong somehow…Well modelled, but wrong…(?)
Maybe you intended her to look this way, but on your first sketch she looks pretty, so I think not. If you do intend her to look, well, “special”, please ignore the following.

I have studied her for ten minutes now and here is some opinions;

  1. Her forehead is like a mans; The two big bumps in the scull that men has behind the eyebrowses is allmost not existing on a female scull. Sculls in real world is very different from one another though, but maybe size them down a little…Which lead me to the next;
  2. Now, this word I don´t know in english: The place where the hair meets the forehead(?)…
    This line, from one ear to the other moving over the forehead, is a little too regular. In this small angled front shot of the face, the hair disappears to quick behind the bone at the eyebrowse(See previous opinion:)). Also maybe define the hairs a little more at this border.
  3. The width of the eyes is a little big. When you generally talks about proportions in a human face, you say that the distance between the eyes should be around an “eye-width”.
    That you have done…but because of her eyes width, her eyes are also a little too apart from one another.
  4. Her lips is so nice, but big, and therefore her chin looks smaller than it really is…Maybe make her chin a little bigger. Maybe the whole jaw. I´m not sure, but something doesn´t quite fitt there.

I do hope you use this as it is meant; An opinion. My opinion. As I can´t put a finger on your skills, this is just a matter of taste.:slight_smile:

Keep on this great entry, as mine sucks(just really don´t have the time for this challenge).


I like that stylized, or maybe even over-stylized look you got here, and textures are quite nice, but i have to agree with Kragh, female has some problems. Mainly with forehead and ‘hair’ - the top of the head is way too high. It works for male characters, but feels wrong for a female.


Great work! Excellent quality. :slight_smile:

I find the female’s faces to be a little weird. I think it is her eyes, they are too big.

But great work :slight_smile:


Thanks for the feedback, it is, as I expected, mainly focused around the female character. I could tell that something wasn’t right with her but just couldn’t see for looking - i’m sure you guys get that when you’ve spent so long on something.

Kragh - now that’s what I call C&C, cheers man. I’ll try out each of your suggestions and see how that helps the final model as she is most definately not supposed to look ‘special’ :slight_smile: Hahaha.

I think the reason she looks a bit manly in some areas is becasue I took the decision to develop her from the model of one of the male characters thinking i’d save time. With hindsight I have probably spent longer tweaking that mesh that I would have spent building a new one from scratch in a purely female mould. Nevermind, i’m sure i’ll get there.

I think the word you’re looking for is hair line. I’ll give that some attenttion too as admitadely the hair as a whole was something of an afterthough to stop her looking bald.

Thanks for your input, it’s hugely appreciated.

azazel - Part of the problem is trying to get her to fit the stylised look of the other characters. This is definately suited more to a male face so maybe she just becomes more of a traditional beauty and done with whether she fits in with the guys or not. I see where you are coming from, her head is way too high and she does appear to have some sort of mad affro as opposed to the tightly pulled back pony tail I was intending.

AirbORn - Thanks for you comments, I’ll definately try making the eyes smaller and possibly closer together.

Cheers guys and keep up the good work yourselves.


Like the others, there is something that bothers me a little about the female. Hairline, like you said, and I think the eyes are a bit far apart. I like that they’re so large, though. I don’t think every single female character needs to be idealized to the point you often see. there are some strange looking people, in reality. :slight_smile: I especially like the degree to which you break from reality. I think you have a unique style the is fun to look at.

Good work.



Your modeling is unusallly fast.

As far as the human figures, they seem great for us in your final composition,… although I would say that maybe the female has a face with FAR to much pertubations to be considered a “typical” female head. Frankly she seems rather unatureally butch. She could do with a little bit of relaxation of her facial creases.

And on that matter, it would almost seem that all three figures are truelly topographiclly related. Not for anything but I think your purposes would be far better served if you took the time to model each face from sctrach.

At the final resolution of the cgtalk challenge of +2000 pixels their similarities will be hard to hide.


OK, i’ve considered everyones advice and this is what i’ve come up with. She’s clearly a lot less stylised now but definately looking prettier and far less butch. Thanks to everyone who offered their honest critique - it was invaluable. What do you guys think about her now?


Crusty_Butt - cheers man, i’ve made quite a few chages to the model as you can see but am slightly concerened that I have broken too far away from the stylised look of the male characters. It is true that I have succumbed more to the idealised look that people expect. It does seem that if a female character is anything less than the very embodiment of beauty, she is considered incorrect - although having said that I think that there were definate errors in my previous efforts that needed to be sorted out.

Waza_R, - I think you’ve answered your own question there :slight_smile: The fact that they are topographically related is the exact reason that I have been able to knock these guys out so fast.

If you look at my concept sketch you’ll see that the chacters are not going to dominate the entire image so hopefully their similarites won’t be to much of an issue, although I see what you are saying. I have plenty more work to do to get everything I plan for this complete, but if time allows I might well re-visit the characters with an eye to making them more unique.

Thanks for your C&C on the female character, I read your post this morning after working on her last night. Hopefully the updated head addresses some of your issues.

Your comments are much appreciated.


Your characters rock! :bounce: Really, nothing to say from my side.

Want more!


She’s looking much better now.

I’d really like to know your approach to modeling the head. Do you have screen shots of your modeling at different stages, or do you have a favorite tutorial? I can get a good basic shape modeled pretty quickly, but when I start pulling the facial features foreward something always goes terribly wrong. :slight_smile:

Keep up the good work.



The woman looks better this way. Especially the front view is stunning. And I can see her “stylized”.
Quite a time to post here so, also the white male character looks awsome!:bounce:

:slight_smile: Give us more ! :slight_smile:


I really like the characters in your concept sketch rather than the ones in 3D expect maybe that black guy cause he looks pretty damn good. I guess the guy in the middle is cool too because of stylization.

I wish though that the girl in the concept sketch was more like that though… I think it brings down the image a lot…

The lips for her seem very flat. The top one is okay I guess but the bottom one I think should be a lot more like the sketch. Where instead of it going like such a big dip in the middle is that you have those two nice dips and how it goes up in the middle area. I think my char has that in my WIP it seems to work better than having the bee sting look… Gives the character more of an attuide.

Also on the cheek part in the sketch you have this beautiful flow down to the chin. and in 3d you got this crease of doom.

I think it has to do a lot with that cheek area. The eyes look great and the nose although stylized from the sketch works.

Maybe also bring up the pink above the eye how its in the sketch O.o?

Hope this helps…

Really nice texture job and shader work :smiley:

Edit: oh yah one more thing … why did u remove the purple lips ;_;


Hi again.

Miss Zoe is much better now. I have tried to imagine her with hair (Pony tale sounds great:)) and it seems to work. I dont think you have made compromizes with your style, she fits the male figures very well. Like “Bull” and “Kane”, she has her own special characteristica(This is a word in danish, hope it makes sence in english…). I think her eys has more depth than your 2 male models, fine work. I tend to agree about the flat lips, not completely though, cause in profile they don´t look flat at all. Maybe a lightning issue, I don´t know. Not really relevant anyway, overall great model, congrat.:thumbsup:

Think I´ll have to leave this challenge myself, can’t find the time I need. Maybe I´ll join them in the 2D section, much better at drawing (And faster:)).

Good luck with your projekt!


Crusty_Butt - I havn’t got any tutorial reference although but I’ll dig out some progressive renders of one of the characters so you can have a good laugh… I mean look! :slight_smile: They tend to go through some pretty freaky transitional phases (as seen with the female head) but hopefully that’ll give you some pointers as to my techniques.

Xero - You make some very intersting points there. Firstly the ‘crease of doom’ will soon be cast into the chasm of eternal fire, so fear not. I left it in there for a really good reason that i have completely forgotten :slight_smile:

Secondly, you are right, the concpet sketch does have a certain something that is missing from the 3d model. I’ll definately try her out with the purple lips and will also have a play with the shape of the lips themselves. Thanks for pointing that out.

Kragh - Glad you’re liking her, i’m definately on the right track now. I’ll try out a render with her together with the other characters as it’ll be interesting to see how she fits in.

As i said in yor thread, stick with the 3d comp you’ve made good progress so far it’d be a shame to chuck it.

Thank you to everyone else who’s commented, always appreciated.


Sandra Bullock.

Not bad. Vast improvment. Keep up the good work.


Best Reply -EVER-:

Firstly the ‘crease of doom’ will soon be cast into the chasm of eternal fire, so fear not.



Your faces are amazing. You have an excellent knowledge of anatomy. I understand you work with poly, and I wonder if you have used spline modeling for some faces. Do you re-use the same model and change some characteristics, or do you create from scratch each time? I notice that your male model’s faces are very similar… is that intentional? However you look at it, they’re awesome… sincere best wishes in this competition!

You sent me a post recently and commented positively about the hair on one of my models. I am currently modeling a guy with a beard. It is a high poly model and I am shooting for realism. Therefore, I cannot make the hair through the map. Do you know of other ways to do it without using plugins, because I don’t have Shag-Hair…

Anyway - good luck with Space Opera… I’ll be keeping an eye on this thread! And I look forward to comments from others on my Space Opera thread, too.