EIM Survey

#1

Hello all,

Just to let everyone know that an official survey about EIM is available for all registered EITG newsletter members. This survey is short but important. Please take a moment to check your mailbox and reply.

Thanks in advance!

#2

I don’t suppose you could add the question.

Would you like EIM to be integrated into EIAS (one app)?

Then i’d be interested in it’s resurrection!

:buttrock:

#3

I sincerely hope EIM is brought back but take the time to really bring it up to date. I think right now anyone who wants to be using it is using it so don’t just re-release it with a couple of added things.

The SDS really needs to be brought up to date in ease of use and functionality.

Don’t scrap ACIS as that is an ‘in’ to much nurbs conversions from other programs.

The layer window and general interface is second to none, the knives, bezier curves and meshing is top flight stuff - truly world class.

Put some resources into EIM and really upgrade the tools - make it easy to use.

I’ve filled out the survey.

#4

I just filled out my survey- and if the powers that be are listening here’s a little explanation.

ACIS is important if you ever need to import-export to CAD (formZ, Autocad, Solidworks, etc.) ACIS is an absolute must- have.

The price of Modeler needs to kept low. ViaCAD is a killer modelling package and a deal at $100. Keep this in mind when pricing.

The “Ubernurbs” feature was unique, because few ACIS modelers can do SDS that can be ACIS objects.

Just my two cents.

Dave

#5

I second that!
Just when I had finally given up hope of ever seeing Modeler revived this comes along.
Very exiting - (I don’t get out enough).
Yes, please, keep it talking to Rhino and the Concepts family to name just two!

#6

Could someone post the questions… I didn’t get the email. :frowning:

#7

I filled out the survey also. I felt the survey lacked a few questions to give a compete answer. Unlike Paul, I never “got” EIM, but I do agree it made very clean models. On the flip side of clean models I found it to be slow, fussy, crash prone with an awkward interface. EIM was the reason I started using Maya. For a long time I modeled in Maya and rendered in EI, long before I ever tried rendering in Maya. EIM still has a few cool tools that I don’t see in Maya but the EIM overall experience for me was not good. If EIAS had an modernized integrated component modeler, I think this would be a big positive for EI. A dusted off standalone version of EIM with a few slight updates would not interest me.

#8

I didn’t receive it, either. I’ve had trouble in the past with the newsletter system: doesn’t seem to remember my subscription (I’ll try again).

So I don’t know what the questions were, but I remember that thread dealing with EIM and its possibilities, from getting to be a better modeler to becoming a rather complete modeling+rendering package.

I am very interested in its future. If the newsletter system fails me, would there be any alternative way of getting the questionnaire and sending my answers back?

#9
  1. Would you be in favor of the return of EIM (Electric Image Modeler)?
    O-Yes, bring back EIM
    O-No, don’t need EIM
    O-I don’t care
  2. If EIM did return would you like it to include the ACIS engine?
    O-Yes, ACIS is needed
    O-No, don’t need ACIS
    O-I don’t care
  3. Would you like to see a lower-cost SDS (subdivision surface) version of EIM without ACIS?
    O-Yes, way cool
    O-No, not needed
    O-I don’t care
  4. If you are a current EIAS user what do you think would be a fair upgrade price to get EIM back with UB code, upgraded ACIS engine, multi-core aware, and a few new features?
    O-No, I will not pay for it. I want it free!
    O-Yes, but only if less the $100
    O-Yes, between $100 and $200
    O-Yes, between $200 and $300
    O-Yes, I would pay more then $300 for EIM
    O-I am not a current EIAS user.
    O-I don’t care
  5. Customers since version 6 didn’t receive EIM with their purchase. Do you believe they should get EIM for the same price as users from 5 and older?
    O-Yes, everyone should just pay the same price
    O-No, new users should pay additional
    O-I don’t care

I think this forum is good for color commentary and to explain your answers in detail.

#10

Sissy!..LOL!

Obviously kidding…if you can tackle Maxwell you can tackle anything:-)

#11

About the multicore thing: at the ViaCAD forums Mr. Olson said Spatial had announced its next ACIS iteration would feature multithreading.

Also regarding ACIS: as important as it is for translating SATs and SABs to FACT, the real question regarding including it or not is: would another engine, be it licensed or newly-made, make EIM work better while keeping all its current features and adding new ones? Would it keep on being a solids/surfaces/SDS parametric modeler?

#12

I guess I should have used stronger language to get it to behave. :wink:

LOL, you haven’t even rendered with it and you almost know more than I do about it.

#13

Well, I would suspect that Brad is attempting to determine how to best distribute the EIM pieces of the code if EITG were to resurrect EIM. We also need to be asking ourselves what is the best use of these technologies for the given limitations of Animator, the marketing implications, and the money required to bring EIM back from the dead.

First off, we have to consider Animator’s age and limitations. Is it possible to shoehorn a full fledged modeler into Animator’s framework? Probably not, especially if its ASICs based. Now a decent SDS/polygonal modeler in Animator could be possible since Animator “speaks” polygon… but realistically, if everything is coming from existing EIM code, getting it to work inside Animator may be more trouble than its worth and I would guess it would be considerably more expensive to modify Animator than to continue to use a separate application. My guess for internal modeling solutions inside of Animator, plugins are going to be your best bet.

The logical alternative is to sell a SDS/Poly modeler from existing EIM code that talks directly to the existing Animator and then strip out the ASIC’s engine from EIM and create a brand new application based on a modern architecture, new interface, and so forth. Essentially you’re following the Modo paradigm. If this new ASIC’s solids modeler is equipped with ties into Camera you can already be a step ahead. Then add back in SDS and Poly tools, animation tools, ensure its open architecture, and you’re ready to premeire a new unified EIAS to the masses. At this point the original Animator would be somewhere around v10 and ready to be decommissioned or sold as a low cost entry level solution.

I believe it would be a mistake, at this point, to try and bring everything back from the dead all at once. EIM is good, but has its flaws and there’s plenty that could be done to ensure a better product. I’d say take the best of the SDS/Poly modeling tools, add in a super strong UV editor and a link into Animator and sell it as a part of the EIAS “system”. Then create a good ASICs modeler, a highend application, sold separately, that eventually becomes the new flagship product.

#14

EIM is fabulous when it works.

But the fussy rounding and freaky non-planar squiggles I get at sharp corners when knifing drive me crazy.

A fixed, more forgiving EIM with improved SDS would be my dream modeler and I’d pay pretty much for it.

I also agree with Brian on the Modo approach…

There’s so much potential just waiting to be tapped.

Jim Mulcahy

#15

I think everyone knows how I feel… but if not, I use the EIM sds daily for work, I find them highly useful, even after so many years. My feeling is that bringing an SDS package would be a strong first step, and something EITG could build on…

Cj

#16

I feel difficult to answer the survey question, it seems it doesn’t cover a lot of aspect,
here are some of my humble opinion…

  • There is so many good modeler out there (and cheap), do we need EITG to spend their valuable time and money to bring back EIM or built another new one…?
  • I would like to see a “modeler editor” built inside EIAS, so we can modify the modeler down to the vertex level, instead of another new modeler
  • I would like EI to import any model with UV flawlessly, o2f is nice, but it doesn’t have PC version, as far as I know…

if EITG decide to bring back modeler

  • SDS is a must
  • integrate UV tools - no point we have a modeler without UV tools (built model in EIM, export to some other package, assign UV, save as obj, convert with o2f, sounds weird)

Loon

#17

If EIM doesn’t have a unique advantage over many of the other modelers out there like ViaCAD, Modo, Silo, FormZ, etc, then don’t bother bringing it back and use those resources elsewhere.

Now – if EIM could be integrated into EIAS, then that would be worth paying for.

  • John O.
#18

I personally think it has a unique advantage…I just spent the last 3 weeks importing ACIS CAD data into EIM and having it output perfect .fac meshes time after time.

There is no other modeler which will do this as effectively - EIM’s mesher for EI is very capable and in that regard is unique - for me anyway.

#19

I know many people loved it, however, I absolutely loathed EIM. I’ve never come closer to heaving a brick through my screen than while fighting with that software.

The features that people have mentioned they loved, like meshing .sat data, or sculpting UberNURBS, fine. Build a seperate program that meshes NURBS files. Build a program for SDS modeling with NURBS.

For anything else, just look at MoI. Much better snapping, better displays, better interface (less complicated tool selection and use), better construction inferences, better filleting, better surface blending, better everything!

MoI is the program that EIM should have been.

Probably Brian’s idea to retool EIM into the new EIAS with integrated modeler would be best, but if it killed EIAS by making it too user unfriendly, that would not be good.

#20

Paul -
I probably should have clarified my last statement -->“Unique Advantage” for the general 3d user who may be looking at EAIS as a low cost 3d package. I know you have done wonderful things w/ EIM (and EIAS) and still have a special place for it in your heart and toolset.

I tried to love EIM back in the day, but I got tired of the abuse (similar to FormZ – always complaining when I made the slightest error). 3d is only a hobby for me now, but I bought ViaCAD not too long ago. How could I resist at $99 and it just kicks butt and doesn’t complain. Give it some absurb geometry and throw a fillet at it … boom… done – just keeps ticking. Not perfect by any stretch of the imagination, but unless EIM can match what I can do with ViaCAD or if its integrated into EAIS, I just don’t see myself spending extra money on it. Just my opinion though.