Capcom Character Rigging/Shoulders?


#1

Hi All,

i’ve been creating and creating Game characters for 7 years usually using 3dsmax CS but have never managed to achieve the kind of results seen in titles such as capcoms, granted alot of there games are heavily character based beatem ups etc so they really need to make there characters near flawless. but have a look at the gallery at this link http://www.crim.jp/index2.html
see how the shoulder never crumbles like so many titles. this area is usually the biggest problem. but also how do they do the hair? dynamically updated bones in code? gravity weighted verts?

any help from anyone in the know or the people who created these kinda results would be great.

Thanks
Col


#2

For shoudlers try to mimic real muscles which are in this area (find some reference on the web or buy an anatomy book). Use bones with expressions which allows them to stretch when you pull ik end effector (so bones stretch like real muscles). I can’t give you Max specific instruction right now unfortunately.

CS is really basic stuff, you can’t go too far with it.


#3

take a look at the work that 5 guys (and one girl) did in brasil for one of the biggest TV channels in america TV GLOBO, (3 month period)

it was all 3dsmax and CS4, stretchy bones and springs controllers.

it does the job, and its pretty basic, but in the hands of a open minded artist is a very powerful tool.

http://www.seagullsfly.art.br/

(the main page is a dumb 4MB flash movie…)

http://www.seagullsfly.art.br/videos/vinheta%20-%20globeleza.zip 10MB qt SPOT

http://www.seagullsfly.art.br/videos/making%20of%20-%20globeleza.zip 25 MB qt MAKING off

hope you figure out the rest…


#4

Hi, Thanks for the great replies, that making of movie was exactly what i need for cheap shoulder bones. problem is i can’t mimic it in max at all! granted i’m usinf cs3.4 and max 5 (i’m sure there are some toys in 6 that may make this easier.
-i tried it with normal bones.
-first i tried simply linking the shoulder bone to the upper arm bone
-then turning off hierarchy in the x axis
-this worked fins until it came to rotating in the Y, all of a sudden the shoulder bone would sweep around in it’s Z axis.

i then tried using comet wire connect script, a simple single wire connector.
i got exactly the same effect.

is there a way of making a bone follow another in only 2 axis?

Thanks
Col


#5

to make a “muscle bone” attach to a biped;

make a couple of point helpers… or your favorite helper obj, and place them were the muscle will be attach. (example; if you want to make a bicep you place one piont in the upper arm (humerus) and the other close to the begining of the lower arm (radius).

then parent each point to of the bone that you want to attach to… (i hope you understand…)

next create a bone that start in one of the helpers and ends in the other.

now position constrain the bones to the points and put a look at constrain in the long one… this to make the long bone “look” in his X axis to the point that the tip bone is position constrain… :smiley: (note: my natal tonge is castellano… español, spanish you know…)

well now is almost done, is you want the muscle bone to keep its vomule you must, uncheck the freeze length and check squash has the stretch behevior in the obj properties of the bone tools floater.

attach is an quick test that use the muscles bones… max 6 no biped just a bunch of bones and helpers, sorry… hope its helps you…


#6

Hi, Thanks for the reply but thats not really the part i wanted to copy, but will use it if it can, thanks.

i can’t seem to attach things to my message here so here is a link to a sample test file of what i mean. (max 5, cs 3.4)

http://homepage.ntlworld.com/colinmorrison/CGtalk/Shoulder_test.zip

basically frames 75 to 85 are the important part, the arm twists along itself and you’ll see the shoulder bone doesn’t twist, which is what i want, but also you will see suring the other motions the look at constraint twists at certain angles, i have tried up nodes, changing the look at angle etc but somewhere in this motion it will flip. if u could see what you think i can do to solve this it would be a great help,

thanks again

Col


#7

if I understand you… this will resolve your problem… the up node keep the “world” of the look at spining with the arm; that eliminates the fliping…

if you want an specific rotation to occur, you may try out reactor rotation to stablish the rotations you want…

or ask for and scripted solution in the 3dsmax forum… i m not a script man nor a TD… :stuck_out_tongue:

hope this help you out


#8

Thanks,

That sure solves the flipping problem but now the Shoulder bone follows the arm on the rotation between frame 75 to 85, the idea is to skin the shoulder to the shoulder bone and the upper arm to the upper arm bone, so when it twists the shoulder stays still.

thanks alot.
col


#9

the web site of Kees Rijnen contains a pdf tutorial about the shoulder twist… is an advenced eye opener, i mean, is not a step by sted tutorial, but it explains enough of the math behind the twisting and non fliping shoulder setup

http://www.keesrijnen.com/

see ya


#10

wow … that’s a nice tutorial … but I don’t know anything about maxScript, so I don’t gat it :] so does any one know where I could find somthing that could help me deel with this tutorial ?


#11

Well … i did this little script that sorta helps, I was talking with colin77 when we found a tutorial about the twist on the upper arm, it was a faff to do everytime so i did this little script …

www.BliMation.com/tmp/maketwister.ms

I haven’t tested it loads, but it work on the biped stuff I’ve been doing

its very simple (no ui tho’) just select the upperarm object and run the script, it will create two boxes that you use when skinning, I’m not the best scripter in the world and those that are will prolly laugh at this attempt, but i did it in 5 minutes and it served its immediate purpose for me, if you like it and its useful, great! i helped someone :slight_smile:

let me know what you think and if you wanna rewrite it better with a ui n stuff great!

use at your own risk though :smiley:


#12

I don’t think you really need to know maxscript to read the tutorial on my site.

That said, it is a little complicated and the tutorial is not really a step by step guide. Rather i tried to give you an idea of how you could solve the twisting problem, but you’ll need to use your imagination a little to come up with the final solution. (I guess that’s my excuse for not properly writting a tutorial :wink:

I’m currently using a modified version of what i mention in the tutorial and it never flips around. (www.puppetshop.com has it build-in, but needs some minor tweaks)

-Kees


#13

thx :thumbsup: the script works fine, but how can I change the spin factor of the “Bip01 R UpperArmtwist01” (lets say that I wold like to make that box to take less rotation from the children)


#14

simply adjust the weights of the ‘_upnode’ an make it edge more towards the clavicle than the upper arm …

does that help?


#15

sure thing … exacly what I’ve wonted to do … thx :applause:


#16

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