Canada Or Australia ?

#13

You people are the gretest :thumbsup: so much info so soon…

You allready have a degree in a field related, so you have that going for you. If anything I’d check out the Canadian governments immigration websites and make sure that you qualify. I’d fire off a few emails in their direction if you have any more precise questions.

Well sad to say that as of now I’m not qualified for a PR i need atleast 3 to 4 years of work experience that’s the information i got from the consultancy at my place:sad: . Also the diploma that i recieved in animation gave me a very basic knowledge in the various 3d s/w’s thats all… That’s why i’m lookin into bachelors degree also if necessary

For the record, in my studio I have worked with a number of great people from India who got their education at VFS. If you are thinking immigration will be a problem, currently at my studio Canadians are in the minority.

@twedzel
Can you please let me know how did they qualify for getting a work permit/PR to work in Canada. I wanted to know 'cause most people say that the diploma from VFS isn’t recognized by the Canadian government to give the extra 1yr work permit which is awarded if completed any course from other universities like Shridane. Please correct me if i’m wrong

And it’s really geat to know that the industry is booming there :buttrock: .

If anyone from australia could tell me bout the Masters and Bachelores courses @ Swinburne university i’ll b very thankful.

#14

Now that is scary - Auckland number 5… Christchurch or Wellington maybe but not Auckland :stuck_out_tongue:

I’ve been living in Vancouver for a couple of years and it is a great city. Oppurtunities wise I have just gotten my foot in the door coming out of VFS so fingers crossed it will continue to be good.

There does seem to be a lot of buzz here at the moment.

I have only been in Melborne briefly so I can’t really comment but it did seem like a nice city.

#15

No love for the Aucks. :sad:

Well in the 2007 survey by Mercer it came 17th. My parents just got back from Melbourne, they said it was lovely, but water shortages are seriously taking their affect on quality of life and general appearance on landscapes.

#16

Actually I would much more recommend an fine arts related course and learn 3d on you’re own or after that.

Well even I was thinking 'bout doin tht… it also does help in gettin a PR as the art courses are almost 3yrs long… I was wondering if i’ll b makin the right choise if i took up an arts course, also how is the VFS foundation visual arts course. Should i take up that course and then the 3D animation course or look for a longer degree course in arts @ some other college and then do the 3d animation course @ vfs…

Also please let me know bout which colleges i should look @… I was thinkin Ringling USA but the greencard rule for USA will need me to get a job and manage to have a visa for @lest 10yrs in the USA which i don’t know if it’s possible :sad:. Also please let me know bout australian colleges…

#17

I think first of all you need to decide exactly what you want to do, 3D in general is not a practical goal, you can’t learn everything and be good at all of them, so my suggestion, first decide.

I’m a character animator, so as far as animation, VFS won’t teach you much, only Sheridan has a strong character animation course in canada. in US, there are, Ringling, AAU and CalArts. I don’t think there are any good animation schools down under, althou you can always go for AM.

#18

I wouldn’t say that In the current climate here that going to VFS is going to help you get permanent residence in Canada. However it can help in getting a work visa but you certainly are going to have to put work in with immigration yourself. To get a work visa here at the moment you need to get a job offer. Once you have that you can go to immigration and you will have a pretty good chance. A few people in my class are going down that route.

My understanding is that if a company really wants you they will help you get a work visa. However that is probably going to be pretty rare for entry level positions. So the more of the groundwork you do yourself the better.

If I didn’t at least pretend I hated Auckland I couldn’t really call myself a Cantabrian any more could I :stuck_out_tongue:

#19

I think first of all you need to decide exactly what you want to do, 3D in general is not a practical goal, you can’t learn everything and be good at all of them, so my suggestion, first decide.

Welll deciding is what is driving me crazy.:banghead: … i don’t know how to decide wht i want to do:cry: …

Here’s the thing i enjoyin modeling things and setting things up for an environment or somethin but i dont xactly know how to draw the reference drawings and concept art to begin modeling, but at the sametime i also like animating things and playin around with the models created, and i feel tht drawing the plan for the animation doesn’t require as much detailed drawing as required for modeling, correct me if i’m wrong. Haven’t tried out fluid fx and other particle fx to create sand storms and dust fx so i don’t xactly know wht i’ll b doin there.

i never had any formal training in drawing but can draw to some extent :blush: juz tht i don’t know the techniques and methods to get things proportionate and stuff. tht’s y i’m totally confused bout wht to do cause i know tht traditional drawing is wht is very much required in CG and would love to learn it formally.

Heres the thing i like to model some creatures, environments, etc in 3d from my imagination and make them animation ready and also for rendering stills like many images on this site… wht shud i learn to do this and get a job… and wht will i b called modeler, concept artist, etc… Let me know wht i shud b lookin forward to learnin in the course i must choose

Right now all i’m good @ is C++ programming and various other computer hardware/software/network and other technical stuff as i’ve completed my bachelor’s degree in computer engineering… i joined tht hopeing to make it to the gaming industry someday designing characters and environments for games/movies but little did i know then tht i need to major in arts.:cry:

Please help me decide and point me in the right direction… And selecting the place is very important to me because i need to make a living in the country i’ll b entering to study now so gettin a work permit/PR is very important to me. :sad: I’ve got nothin to return to my place again… I’ll b investin almost all my money to shift to a new country so i don’t want to make any costly mistake. Let me know if a bachelores in any traditional arts is wht i shud do or some course in VFS, i’m open to canada australia or the US.

Thank u for reading this long post… :blush: i’m sorry but i didn’t know where else to go for answers…

#20

You might ask Siju / Thomasphoenix for advice regarding what to study, since he formerly ran an animation school in India (Chennai, I believe) - and is a regular poster here:

      [http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=200&t=296477&highlight=thomasphoenix](http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=200&t=296477&highlight=thomasphoenix)
    
    CGP: [http://thomasphoenix.cgsociety.org/gallery/480672/](http://thomasphoenix.cgsociety.org/gallery/480672/)
      
      Great traditional draughtsman with a great deal of 3D / animation skill as well. Also you might inquire with anandpg (Bangalore):
      
      [http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=200&t=409148&highlight=anandpg](http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?f=200&t=409148&highlight=anandpg)
    
    CGP (Nudity): [http://anandpg.cgsociety.org/gallery/](http://anandpg.cgsociety.org/gallery/)
      
      Also someone in India with a great deal of skill in both areas. Both guys are really friendly. Good luck. :)
  
  With respect to drawing, there are plenty of free resources online as well as resources like DVDs to get you started - if you're committed, you won't have to pay that much to learn how to draw. I don't know that online stuff can completely replace drawing directly from a model - but you can definitely get started and learn a lot without having to take a live class.

Regarding your original question - from everything I've heard, there's very little in Aus with respect to animation / 3D education. So if you have the choice between somewhere in Aus and VFS in Canada, based on reputation alone I would recommend VFS. That being said, if you are looking at the US, then places like Ringling are longer term courses - VFS is only 1 year and a lot of money. Ringling is a lot of money, but you'll have more time to develop your skills (including your traditional skills).

In the US I think your best bets are places like Ringling, AAU, Cal Arts (Cal Arts being very difficult to get into). You might also look into Gnomon, but there is less opportunity to develop your traditional skills there, which you might have more opportunity to do at a school like Ringling or AAU. Gnomon also only offers a certificate program and cannot grant you a degree - which may be necessary for some visa purposes, but I don’t know. These are just my opinions, you should investigate each of the schools you are interested in individually. This forum has a ton of information on individual schools:

ART SCHOOLS & EDUCATION
http://www.conceptart.org/forums/forumdisplay.php?f=15

#21

Australia would be great if it wasnt for the huge bugs! :smiley:

That and pretty much everything in the ocean kills you.

#22

I’d love to help you out, but unfortunantly I don’t work with them any more. I know one of them had work experience before coming here. Now that I think about it, I do work another guy from India who just got his Canadian citizenship. I can ask him what process he went through.

You are right though, the government does not recognise a certificate the same as a diploma or degree. However the education can still go towards getting your work permit. Ultimately, befor getting a work permit you need a job offer. Which is not gauranteed by attending school. So moving here to go to school in a hopes of getting work and working your way to landed immigrant status is a bit of a gamble. But once you get a decent education and make yourself employable, doors could open for you in all sorts of places. So it may not be the gamble you think it is. I’d say hedge your bets by going to the school that you think will provide you with what you need. The CG industry is well known for its transient work force.

Your computer engineering and programming can make you very valuble in our industry, especially when combined with some artistic skills. As for being one of the dudes who desgins creatures etc, those roles usually go to more hard core designer types. They are glory position for sure, but with a programming background you can position yourself to be extremely valuble to a studio. People who can write good production tools that artists can use intuitively are worth their weight in gold.

http://www.cic.gc.ca/English/index.html

#23

Actually Sheep, it’s not just the big ones you need to watch out for… like this critter I caught in my backyard, there’s still a few more of these spiders there. You just gotta watch out where you put your limbs, like your shoes for instance, specially after a rainy day, there might be one of these critters taking refuge in it.

But like I said, other than that, Australia is all right. :smiley:

#24

If you are looking for pr then you need to work at least for one year to get a solid chance of acceptance. (don’t want to spend all that money and be rejected, and the application is expensive). As for getting work visas, most places in Vancouver are relatively small therefore would be less inclined to go through the visa process or wait for you to get it for a couple of months, as most positions need to be filled fast in small shops, especial entry level ones.

#25

Although it’s New Zealand where even the leading production company is named for a giant bug…

-jeremy

#26

Bah don’t let a few dozen deadly creatures scare you away…

Nothing wakes you up more in the morning then putting on shoes and praying that a spider has decided to call it home…

#27

Thanx a lot Rebeccak for ur info :bowdown: and lettin me know bout other indian members here. I’ll PM them right away.

Now that I think about it, I do work another guy from India who just got his Canadian citizenship. I can ask him what process he went through.

@twedzel
I’d highly appricate it if u could do tht for me…:bounce:

Australia would be great if it wasnt for the huge bugs! :smiley:

Actually Sheep, it’s not just the big ones you need to watch out for… like this critter I caught in my backyard, there’s still a few more of these spiders there. You just gotta watch out where you put your limbs, like your shoes for instance, specially after a rainy day, there might be one of these critters taking refuge in it.

Man if u guy’s r scaryin me away frm Australia ur doin a good work :eek:

With respect to drawing, there are plenty of free resources online as well as resources like DVDs to get you started - if you’re committed, you won’t have to pay that much to learn how to draw. I don’t know that online stuff can completely replace drawing directly from a model - but you can definitely get started and learn a lot without having to take a live class.

Well I’v already started takin internet classes and purchased a couple of dvd’s from gnomon workshop. Well most of wht i’ve learnt is from their dvd’s and a couple from digital tutors. And thinking bout it i thought of joining a locat art school so tht i may get some live training so someone could @least guide me in the right direction if i’m doing somethin wrong. :blush:

from everything I’ve heard, there’s very little in Aus with respect to animation / 3D education. So if you have the choice between somewhere in Aus and VFS in Canada, based on reputation alone I would recommend VFS. That being said, if you are looking at the US, then places like Ringling are longer term courses - VFS is only 1 year and a lot of money. Ringling is a lot of money, but you’ll have more time to develop your skills (including your traditional skills).

In the US I think your best bets are places like Ringling, AAU, Cal Arts (Cal Arts being very difficult to get into). You might also look into Gnomon, but there is less opportunity to develop your traditional skills there, which you might have more opportunity to do at a school like Ringling or AAU.

Well from all tht i’v heard looks like there isn’t much hope for me in Australia :sad: , guess there isn’t much work available there and for the available ones i guess they’ll prefer to hire local’s and people who are already PR’s, please correct me if i’m wrong.

Your computer engineering and programming can make you very valuble in our industry, especially when combined with some artistic skills. As for being one of the dudes who desgins creatures etc, those roles usually go to more hard core designer types. They are glory position for sure, but with a programming background you can position yourself to be extremely valuble to a studio. People who can write good production tools that artists can use intuitively are worth their weight in gold.

This sounds intresting… wht exactly will i b doin as a programmer with some artistic skills.:curious:
Also will @ some point in my life i b able to shift to being a designer, and will i @least have the time to do somethin creative n bring out image tht i can post in this site n stuff or will i end up being juz another programmer in a company who has no time to do nethin else :hmm: .

Well what ever it is i will b starting to build my career by studin a course abroad so please also let me know wht kinda course shu i b lookin @. BTW does neone know if the MS in Digital Imaging and Designis a good course to go for doin tht techinical programmer jobs…

#28

I was in Sydey recently and due to the drought and high fuel costs, food prices are also pricey ie ~$5-$10AUD/kg of chicken. Rents are up there too $300-$1000AUD/week… but the views!

From what I gathered of the CG industry in oz, although fairly healthy is not big enough to support a great deal of artists, even though the government is encouraging skilled immigration. The australian government also does not offer the steep incentives that NZ, Canada, more recently England and Central Europe has for film/cg production.

Canada has many more studios but the glut of students entering the market makes the competition pretty tight.

#29

You’re welcome. :slight_smile:

Well I’v already started takin internet classes and purchased a couple of dvd’s from gnomon workshop. Well most of wht i’ve learnt is from their dvd’s and a couple from digital tutors. And thinking bout it i thought of joining a locat art school so tht i may get some live training so someone could @least guide me in the right direction if i’m doing somethin wrong. :blush:

Oh, I think that’s great. I would never discourage anyone from taking a live class, it’s best. :slight_smile: Best of luck in making your choice, I’m sure it’s a lot to think about.

#30

My coworker came over as a skilled worker. He needed a degree a minimum of four years work experience in his field and $10000 Canadian in his bank account. He’s says that the paper work can take four years to complete, fortunately you can use those four years against the work experience that you need. Probably isn’t much help to you.

As for programming in a studio environment, that can mean many things from working as a TD and being involved hands on in production to programming and scripting proprietary tools and programs for the artists to use. The artistic experience can help you in getting into the mindset of the artists as they use your tools. You will understand production needs so much better. If you are good enough artistically then you can be multi functional working creatively and scripting tools for yourself and other artists. It really depends where you work and the role you can find for yourself. If the later is the case the doors are wide open for you, programmers/artists are a very rare commoditiy. Being just a prorammer or TD is nothing to snub your nose at though, those guys can earn big bucks in a studio.

#31

My coworker came over as a skilled worker. He needed a degree a minimum of four years work experience in his field and $10000 Canadian in his bank account. He’s says that the paper work can take four years to complete, fortunately you can use those four years against the work experience that you need. Probably isn’t much help to you.

Thanx for the info, ofcourse it’s of help to me @least now i know wht i’ll b needing. Also did ur coworker add the 4yr xperience while in Canada or did he already have that eperience before he left India??

As for programming in a studio environment, that can mean many things from working as a TD and being involved hands on in production to programming and scripting proprietary tools and programs for the artists to use. The artistic experience can help you in getting into the mindset of the artists as they use your tools. You will understand production needs so much better. If you are good enough artistically then you can be multi functional working creatively and scripting tools for yourself and other artists. It really depends where you work and the role you can find for yourself. If the later is the case the doors are wide open for you, programmers/artists are a very rare commoditiy. Being just a prorammer or TD is nothing to snub your nose at though, those guys can earn big bucks in a studio.

Well wht course and programming languages do i need to learn to b qualified for scripting tools. Also will there b place in the industry for a person with good programming skills and ability to learn new programming languages very quickly, has a great imagination and is workin on his artistic skills to bring:blush: out the imagination to life, and is also very good with many kinda trouble shootin with the OS and hardware… :sad:

anyway’s THANK U :bowdown: people i’ve planned to either move to Canada or the US now… one step of decision is done.

Now i want to know if its better to do a 1yr animation n vfx course in VFS or do a 3yr or so art and animation degree course in colleges like Ringling, CalArts… ect… (cause the fee is almost the same, livin xpences not included) please know tht i’m still in the process of building a career in CG and so my drawin skills r still only building up which i’m workin on right now… I also found out the while in VFS they advice us not to work on part time jobs, this could mean things will get a bit more costly for me…:sad:

Thanx once again for all the information u’ve given me…

#32

Well, your living expenses will be more for a 3 year program vs. a 1 year program - but in a 3 year program you will have that much more time to develop friends and social networks as well as allow your work to grow at an organic pace. However, living expenses are a big factor, and you may not be able to afford the luxury of a 3 year school / living expenses for that long, and that’s a personal decision you must make.

If it were me I’d go for the 3 year program, just because for myself I know I can only take on board so much information at once and process it to any effective degree. You may be entirely different however and thrive under a ton of pressure at a 1 year course. It’s totally a personal decision. Good luck!

Bottom line is that you need to apply to several schools because the likelihood is that Cal Arts won’t accept you (it’s highly competitive) potentially ruling out 1 of the 3 places you’ve mentioned. Apply to at least 4 schools and maybe 5 if you can afford to do so. A lot of the time, fate is the deciding factor in these things. You may or may not get into the top school of your choice, so you need to have several schools in mind.

Now before you ask which schools those might be, I suggest reading the Sticky thread on the schools topic. :wink: