Autodesk axes MotionBuilder standard

#51

What I was talking about is the decision takes a couple years, not the actual training or moving over. People like using what they know and most people can’t and don’t just make split decisions on going out and paying another 2k-7k per node when you just bought Maya or whatever your currently on only 2 years ago.

Also depending the work you do and how much in house staff you have, many people are busy with current projects. Not everyone has a month to take off and jump to another package. With your current package you know what works and what doesn’t and your much more efficient at it. Moving to a new package, while the initial learning doesn’t take much time, its all that other stuff inbetween that slows you down. Speed and knowing what buttons to push and which ones will bug out on you is just a matter of time. This is why when XSI and Maya first came out, it took 2-3 versions before most of the old Soft3d and Alias PA people moved over.

#52

MB 6 standard is still currently being supported by Autodesk for installation onto a different computer.

#53

I’m not so sure :wink: Alias have done some nasty things to Complete customers in the past and I wouldn’t put it past other companies like Autodesk to do the same. Obviously there’d be a huge amount of resentment towards Autodesk if they did axe Complete… so many smaller studios using it, yeah there’d be suicide bombings at local resellers.

Sux to hear about the licence prices here in NZ :frowning:

the best thing that could happen IMO, that would keep Autodesk’s users happy, is if they continue both product lines as they are for 2 years tops, while developing a super-cool >>> 64bit <<< 3D app which combined the best of both packages, kinda like Alias did with Maya coming from PowerAnimator/Dynamation (was that the Wavefront app…?). then maya AND max could fade into 32bit obscurity, as they should by 2008. I think XSI is technically superior to both products in a lot of ways… i just can’t stand that interface.

Autodesk might want to try properly integrating a renderer into the next-gen product, hopefully some flavour of 64bit MR. Alias never quite got there with MR, and their native renderer seriously sucked. One good thing about the Maya’s product coming to an end is seeing the back of that renderer :slight_smile:

#54

StudioTools is a NICHE tool…

In a typical design place they will have 1 seat of Studio for 3 seats of Solidworks or similar CAD system.

In the Automotive world Studio is used mainly as a conceptual design tool, GM and a few other use it for A-Class but particulary every other company uses icem.

All the big automotive companies have direct deals with Alias/Autodesk so you can bet they ain’t paying that full price tag either.

Studio falls into industrial design / automotive…

Maya falls into more markets then i can list its not a niche tool anymore which was what the $2k complete stratergy was aimed at doing.

#55

Heh, you’re fooling yourself.

There’s ALOT more money in Studio Tools than in Maya. In fact, some consider Studio Tool’s ability to import directly from Solid Works the primary reason Autodesk bought Alias (Solid Works competes directly with Autodesk Inventor).

#56

Still, Studio tools is a very minor actor in the CAD market. the estimation of 1 studio tools for 3 solidworks is imho very optimistic. All small to medium companies wont even consider it when choosing their CAD package.

and the fact inventor failed to attract customers is due to lack of Autodesk giving what their customers wanted in time. Now they have switched it is too late.

Solidworks, Pro/E and Catia (the latter mostly in europa) have now such a stronghold of key customers that were previously in autodesk hands, that there is very little chance Autodesk will return to the former glory of Autocad times. Other actors like Missler Topsolid are ahead too in specialized markets.

To make things worse for studio tools, Solidworks change its format at each release (1 per year) and its mother company (Dassault systemes) is also the editor of Catia which is a more direct competitor of ST in Automotive and Aerospace industries. So i wont bet the hability of ST to read native SW format is here to stay.

#57

Alas, I have to agree on all these points.
Given the route taken, seems to me that this is bound to be a case of “forcing hands” in the future. Of course, one of the side-effects will be to force peoples hands into dumping MB all together. Which is a shame as it IS a good package, just greedily marketed. :frowning:

#58

better that AD’s “Character Studio”

#59

In all honesty, couldn’t say as never used it. All I can say is it is very flexible and a doddle to use. Must be, I can use it! :stuck_out_tongue: :wink:

#60

Can A:M handle motion capture data? MB can handle a variety of system and receive input in many ways that other apps can’t.

-mummey

It sure can, and it animates like a dream. It is easy, and I mean very easy to use and in some cases just as powerful as Maya and Motionbuilder.
Easy to animate with, captures motion if you want it, has hair, cloth and at a cheap price that any artist can afford. What more could you want? I think if it wanted to it could beat Maya except one thing…

Big difference between A:M and Motionbuilder. You can take a scene from maya and bring it into motionbuilder. Then take that scene and bring it into xsi and then back into maya. A:M is pretty stuck into itself. Which is the most idiotic thing. If they just opened up a little bit and followed standards just a little bit, then they’d probally be a megarich company. A:M is lightyears ahead in animation then any other application, just can’t exchange the data and the renderer is dead slow.

-Nichod

Nichod hit it on the head. It does not work well with others. They believe everyman is an island or something. It’s a nice island, but I hate modelling in splines, it is tooo sloooowwww!! What takes me 4 hours to model in A:M takes me 20 minutes in Zbrush, Wings, Modo, Hexagon 3d, Wings3d, etc. If you are using A:M you do not have options like with all the other programs. You pretty much just have to use A:M for everything!! That is the only reason I left this wonderful program. I don’t want to model in it, it wastes my time. Great program but don’t tell them to put polygons or a converter in their program or they’ll get mad and tell you to go to MAYA or something. (Personal experience, learn from my mistakes, don’t ask or complain about wanting to model in another program and better import options, splines are the only way for them.)

This problem is only my perception though, I think there is a weakness in modelling, but once modelled in splines, splines are great to animate with. That is where A:M shines. In the world of Animation, but unfortunately is it no also MODEL MASTER, it is Animation Master, but once you get to the animation part it is a breeze. But don’t go in expecting to model in silo zbrush wings 3d, etc and move it to A:M. It just won’t happen that way. But if you want a powerful program, don’t mind modelling in splines, then this one is as powerful, in my opinion to Maya.

#61
#62

Here’s part of the quote from Autodesk:
"Discontinuing the MotionBuilder Standard product was not intended to alienate the MotionBuilder user base. Rather, the intent was to align a product configuration that’s sustainable and provides focused resources to develop new, innovative and exciting additions to the MotionBuilder product.

“With this change, we are extending a migration program to existing MotionBuilder Standard users who wish to upgrade to MotionBuilder 7.5. The program will be open to all users of MotionBuilder Standard versions 5, 5.5, 6 and 7. The cost of this migration program is $1995 and includes one year of Platinum Membership (a $695 value) which qualifies you for upgrades of the product at no charge. Platinum Membership provides you with a number of services, including Hotline support, access to training materials and Interactive Training Sessions. This migration program will run until August 18, 2006.”

I’m not sure if that will attract many MB Standard users. It still costs multiples of times the price of what it used to be before Autodesk acquired it.

BTW… how long has it taken to get some kind of official word from Autodesk? If I had delayed posting this thread until an official Autodesk announcement, it would have been weeks.

It seems Autodesk has only bothered announced something after users became outraged.

#63

Wow what a great deal they are offering. That floors me when I see it, they act as if they are being so generous.

You know what if your going to be an evil greedy company just say so. I mean dang at least let people know what you are doing and that you don’t care what they think.

We want more money, here is our crappy deal, hey it’s better than 4 grand so be happy with it.

Yes they knew they were going to alienate the Standard user’s, it wasn’t their intent to do so, their intent was to make as much money they can before they die, but hey your poor and if you can’t buy it who cares. We just wanted to make more $$$. It’s not personal just business.

We at Autodesk like money, it’s plain and simple. We do not care if we take CG out of the hands of common people. It should be only for big studios who can pay us a lot of money the first time.

Just be aware all, let’s hope the big bad Boogie Desk keeps away from your beloved software.

Adobe Photoshop 4,000 oh wait but you can update it for 1,995

Zbrush what a wonderful tool it’s worth 7,000 but act now and you can get it for 4,000

Silo 3d where slashing prices, get an update for only 1,000 dollars that’s a saving of 2,000 dollars off the retail price of 3,000
Here at Autodesk we are slashing prices. Won’t you be glad when we buy all the software companies.

It almost sounds better if Microsoft bought all the companies instead of them. Well that’s cool, I don’t like any of their products, MB excluded. I’ve always hated their business model and prices. I just hope they stay away from the products I use. I feel for some of you who got stuck with them after the buyout.

For MB users, you do have a “Messiah”

#64

Quoted for Agreement… You basically just said everything I was thinking. Thanks for saving me the typing :cool:

#65

Just bought Motion Builder 7.5 as we want to do motion capture and Autodesk now only sell it with maintainence which puts another £455 on!!

#66

Oh gosh… until now i was gathering monney to by Maya complete… but since Alias has been bought by a rather Mac non-friendly Autodesk… I wonder if I’m not gonna turn to C4D…

#67

You never have to buy maintainence, sales people like to make it sound like you do. Its a good idea though because then you get the upgrades with it (pays for itself).

#68

Right now (an for the near future) Autodesk is running off of the pre sale-development of both Maya and Max. I seriously doubt anything significant will change for the worse with these products in that time. Also, Autodesk is not Mac non-friendly per se. They do make products that work on Mac’s. They do not make a version of Max that does. However, with the dual boot stuff that has just been announced, technically any win app will now have a Mac version. The AME Max forum has already stated they ran Max8 on a Mac running windows. I don’t see anything that would scare me from purchasing either Max or Maya at this point. The worse case scenerio (given the fact that Autodesk will not alienate either group of user) will be a single future product that will seamlessly fit into either products pipeline as a replacement for both. In which case everyone wins.

However, if you are not in a hurry to purchase, I would wait a little longer this year and see what kind of deals Autodesk may have up their sleeves. I can’t imagine them not giving some kind of deal with an aquisition like this.

#69

Thanks for your hint.
Well… I’ve been working so far on Pixels3D a Mac only 3D app wich helped me much to go into Maya learning. At the Multimedia school i followed last year, C4D and Maya where both well represented. I will wait a little because i can still do a lot with the actual (since 4 years) gathered material on compositing and adding funny stuff with Apple’s FC and Motion. But I attend to finish a project where a higher 3D creation is desired… and Maya would just be THE app to use for it! So it’s a little painfull waiting going on…

#70

The fact is that you still have to run Windows.