Abussive crits forum :)

#1

I am always trying to better my skills as I’m sure we all are however different people take things diffrentlly when it comes to crits! which is understandable

It is also why I want to propose a new forum ! However it would be pretty harsh for some, which would also keep it focused only to those extremely searching for honest helpful crits even at the expense of getting a lil peeved !

What I’m proposing is a cant take the heat get out of the kitchen crit forum you post what you think is your finished work or a wip for others to basically slam ! not by saying hey you suck or this model looks like sh-- but by saying along these lines !

acceptable :

your hands suck on this model heres why and heres what id do to fix them !!

acceptable :

the model is looking good but the shoulder SUCK take a look at them again try to fix this by doing this or that

unecptable:

you suck.

this looks like crap etc.

basiclyyou would get pretty torn up but the person criting would have to provide some help and a explantion why they think what they do

I think this forum would benefit anyone seeking to be a pro or get feed back to help them . There have been a few times someone has really ripped my models the initial feeling is like if YOU lol but then I look again at it and think you know that person had some points and then I work to fix them ! I’m sure I’m not the only one that feels this way and I’m sure everyone likes to hear there model looks good but what I want is to know how to make it look better ! by whatever means necessary

It would be kinda like a bad neighborhood I guess don’t go in expecting a pat on the back or fluffy stuff expect to be told what the hell you suck at and need to fix ! it would keep the forum serious and helpful ! It would probably not be the most popular fourm but one of the most beneficial to artist on the web that want to know where they stand skill wise and how to better themselves

a few side notes because someone thinks it doesn’t look good you wouldn’t have to fix it but you may have to think about it ! and thats the key

ill post a poll to see what you all think ! there would be a discl

#2

Originally posted by cerreto
[acceptable :

your hands suck on this model heres why and heres what id do to fix them !!

acceptable :
the model is looking good but the shoulder SSUCK take a look at them again try to fix this by doing this or that

unecptable:
you suck.

this looks like crap etc.

I don’t know. The above are pretty much the rules that I try and follow when I respond with a crit. As we all know most posts are usually just wows, awesome, and cool responces. (I’m guilty as well) While those are fine and dandy a crit has to have reasoning behind it. “I hate it because…” I really don’t think we need a seperate section for hard crits. A properly done crit already has this built in.

From a few threads recently I believe people get upset when the crit violates the above rule. The “I hate it” with no explaination. That doesn’t do anyone any good.

On the plus side a section such as this would hopefully filter out the wow, awesome, and poo responces, leaving just constructive crits.

#3

Fanboys posting “wow cool” comments make browsing any thread containing anything remotely interesting a real drag, but I doubt you could open a “harsh crits” forum without it degenerating into a flame fest. The same people who insist on flooding the crits section with such gems as "amazing work!!! You are my hero!!! would no doubt poison the Harsh Crits section with nothing but thoughtless insults.

Couldn’t we just ask for/ enforce a morotorium on fanboy comments?

#4

Instead of referring to it as an “abbusive” or “hostile” crit, I propose the term “CONSTRUCTIVE Criticism” be used.

Ever since my art school days I am a firm believer in the constructive crit - after all, you’re never going to learn if everyone sugar coats your work when It really needs some harshly objective criticism, however, it should always be backed up with constructive comments on what, how, and why to improve.

Otherwise, It’s just an open excuse for threads to take a downward spiral to FLAMEZONE.

#5

yeah thats the genereal idea people dont have to say you hands suck and you need to fix them by doing this but the point is to get focused hard honest crits with a understanding thats what its there for crits !

#6

also, in addition to

cceptable :
a
your hands suck on this model heres why and heres what id do to fix them !!

acceptable :
the model is looking good but the shoulder SSUCK take a look at them again try to fix this by doing this or that

unecptable:
you suck.

this looks like crap etc.

no ooh’s, ah’s and wow’s allowed in this forum, if you enter this forum, you leave all rights to be crowned king & god behind . . . so to speak . . .

this is for constructive critisism not for gettin a fangroup :wink:

I for one think this might work for real if everyone is honest and true . . .

#7

I think its a good idea. Sometimes I see way to many ‘cools’ and hardly anything of substance. Many times on many projects I have wanted someplace where I could post and get feedback just like what is described above, but came up short with ‘wow thats great!’

What I am saying is that when I post something for crits I dont want a ‘Wow thats great!’ responce, I know its a good model/texture/animation but what I want to know is what I could do to make it even better.

I also think that with this community, one where its members are out to do the common goal of improving their skill or showing off their skill and respect eachother, it would be benificial to the boards and its members to have a place of constructive crits. I respect each of you because of your talents as an artist and would love more then ‘thats cool.’

Lets give it a shot!

#8

Well said Equinoxx. This could be a good idea. If I just want to get to the point and get some constructive bashing this could be good. Now that I thought about it for a little longer… I think this could be a great idea. People that have sensitive hearts can steer clear, and people like me and cerreto and whoever wants a specific model or whatever torn to shreads (constructively) can do so without all the
CERRETO!! CERRETO!! CERRETO!! CERRETO!! CERRETO!! CERRETO!! CERRETO!! CERRETO!! CERRETO!! CERRETO!! CERRETO!!
Just get to the point help me get good stuff.

plus, whats the worst that could happen if this thread started… it might not be popular :slight_smile:

#9

Yup, this is a good idea. Nuff said.

#10

I’m not sure it’s a good idea : if I want to be harsh with somebody, I will be harsh (I didn’t say I’d be irrespectful). If what I see is a newbie work, I won’t be too harsh about the details --> my critics will focus on the people skills.

I don’t see the need. I didn’t say it was a bad idea !

#11

I’m not sure if a whole new forum is in order. It might be a good idea, but it seems like it could degrade very quickly into just name calling or something. When a lot of people post their work they often add something like “be gentle,” or “be harsh” and more often than not that affects the kinds of responses they get. I think that maybe we can just encourage people to add something like that to their post, and maybe try and discourage the oohs and ahhs. (Although IMO I think that they are important, too, as they can be inspiring.)
Anyway, there was a post not to long ago that suggested separate WIP and Finished Project forums. If that was the case then the finished project Forum could recieve the oohs and ahhs that many people are looking for, and the WIP could get all the criticizm and suggestions that most people post for.
My 2 pennies.

EDIT
This thread
/EDIT

EDIT #2
Duh…You guys are one step ahead of me, aren’t you? There already seems to be a new WIP forum. That’s what I get for browsing top to bottom.
/EDIT #2

#12

Much as ‘constuctive’ crits are very useful and ‘fanboy’ ones arguably not,some of the so called ‘constructive’ crits of late have just been ego wanking by the supposed commentator and some of the ‘fanboy’ ones well meant words of encouragement and acknowledgement. Drawing a line betweeen where constuctive means psychosis and fanboy means dubious idolisation is pretty difficult and can or should it be drawn by anyone other than attempting to encourage common sense in some kind of way? :slight_smile:

#13

I remember back during my days at Sheridan College no one pandered me. I always got a straight opinion out of my proffesors. They never sugarcoated it nor did they talk down to me. Through the college’s Darwinistic approach, I have come to really really appreciate constructive crit, and have matured as an artist due to the crits.

I think a separate forum for this type of crit is essential, because some people cannot take negative feedback EVEN when it is accompanied with justification.

Constructive crits are a real part of the workplace and they should be a real part of cyberspace too. As for the flaming issue…this industry is small enough that you are bound to run into people you meet online in some aspect of your professional career. Anyone who flames just ends up blacklisting themselves. I think 98% of us are mature enough to handle real crits.

There are many proffesionals here that would love to give and recieve crits, but fear that their opinions would only be drowned out by useless dribblings of “oh that’s so cooool!” or " you are a modeling god!". Countless times I have wanted to see what certain people say about work here at cgtalk and I have to wade through the inane fanboy responses and drooling. More often than not, I find I have to go to www.highend3d.com forums just to get a straight opinion. I find the forums over there very straight and mature.

We all post to better ourselves and get real peer to peer feedback. With a forum for “STRAIGHT CRITS”, the feedback would finally hold some substance.

Peace.

#14

Well, I agree with Gilgamesh about some stuff, but I guess I just thought of maybe having a forum where posting oooh’s and ahh’s is banned. Like if you say, your my hero and that’s it, then one of the admins will change your avatar to a really embarrasing image :smiley:

I have no problem with all the ooohs and ahhs I just would like a forum where we could get to the point sometimes… I guess. :slight_smile:

[edit] well said capt. llama [/edit]

#15

Very good idea. Maybe it would be better to have two sections, one for Profressionals and one for Students. Similar to what Highend3D does with their forum.

Just an idea. :smiley:

#16

People that post images in the Harsh Critisism forum will have a different expectation. If you really like your reflective ball and checker floor you probably wont post it there. :slight_smile:

Sure, sounds good, I like it.

Mike

#17

WOW Wow this is the best thread ever. I just made it my desktop! right click save as…

Personally, I think this kind of response is just as damaging as an overly abusive crit.
If we are trying to improve then only suggestions and examples can help. Not, butt kissing or mud slinging.

$.02

#18

Originally posted by sigma
[B]Very good idea. Maybe it would be better to have two sections, one for Profressionals and one for Students. Similar to what Highend3D does with their forum.

Just an idea. :smiley: [/B]

Ahh, ya beat me :slight_smile:

could be a good idea

#19

i dont want to give the wrong impression im not saying that comenting people is bad ! at all basicly what a few people have said sums it up like benlama and mike if you post in the 3 d forum its suposed to be a crit forum but its rare that i ever get help by creating a new forum for crits and hard opinions it would give people that are just looking for help and opinions on what to wrk on im not saying they should get bashed so to speak just that it would be crucialy honest opinions

like mike said if you dont want it dont post in there i agree but would be cool for those looking for such help

#20

Yeah…I think a new kind of forum would be the only way to make it work properly.
I don’t think just saying “Stop giving unhelpful comments like “I LOVE YOU!!!” and, JIMMY JIMMY JIMMY JIMMY JIMMY JIMMY JIMMY JIMMY JIMMY JIMMY JIMMY!” would do anything…people will still do that.
I like the idea of a ‘professionals’ section, where people can honestly give good advice and help others to become better modelers/designers. Anyhow, just my opinion. Thanks.

-aaron