Environment: Amsterdam-style street...

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Old 06 June 2003   #1
Environment: Amsterdam-style street...



I am not completey sure if it is done or not. I posted this in the WIP a few weeks ago, trying this new forum out

wire:
http://jonmdesign.net/images/wip/amsterdamwire.jpg


be as harsh as can be


3dsmax5 brazil r/s (NO GI)
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Last edited by JonM : 06 June 2003 at 05:07 PM.
 
Old 06 June 2003   #2
What I see first odd about it is the color combination, there is alot of gray and alot of red, the rest is very faded. I would recomend either increase the color contrast or make it black and white.

( hope this is a "focused critiques" approved post )
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Old 06 June 2003   #3
please edit your post with what software was used. we want to eliminate any questions later down the road asking about what you used

very nice image btw. ( boy that was a quick

there isnt too much that is really wrong with the image but the one thing that strikes me right from the get go is the grass. right now it seems extremely stiff. you might want to add some curvature to it.

the cafe ontbijt building, the bay window ontop looks also a bit to squeeky clean. might want to add some real subtle dirt to it. even if its just done in post at 1-5% opacity.
 
Old 06 June 2003   #4
Hey figure I'll start out saying what I like...it seems the top half is really nice, I thik you got some great detailing going on, but it looses it the closer to the ground we go.

The cafe sign seems just to clean font wise ...and the dirt is a bit to...cg placed. also witt he bump on some pillars it doesnt feel as natural as it could.

I can see you started with some dirt toward the bottom of the buildings and such, which is really nice, but it kind of feels unnatural once again, and I think this is cause its to dark to high, if that makes sense,

Possibly a bit of dof or contrast to the back of the image would be nice to because the detail seems really lost back there... and the trash on the steret feels like it was just set there..not like garbage really if that makes sense. Good image so far tho, I think with a little more attention to the details you can have a really convincing shot here.
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Old 06 June 2003   #5
Nice image. My crits are that the street and the trash are much brighter and cleaner than the buildings, and that very bright plate and cup keep drawing my attention away from the picture.
 
Old 06 June 2003   #6
This is a marvelous image, but not quite beleivable as of yet. I agree with Hexodam about the constrasts, and i would add that the whole thing is too clean. We don't get the history that this part of a old town went through. I would put some oil stains on the street, along with more dirt, especially along the sidewalk. I would also dirty up the walls, near the ground. And perhaps the ambient light is cranked up too high. Hope this will help, you really have a strong one there.
 
Old 06 June 2003   #7
There are a few things I see in the image that may help it out...

First off somemore contrast in the sky would possibly help out the image.. it seems really stark right now.. due to all the white in the image..... Maybe add some different hues into the sky to help that out...

The buildings seem really good.. there are a few things you may try.. one is the blue on the hotel building is extremely saturated.. maybe bring the saturation of the blue down a little..
also on the building to the right of the hotel... the white corner stones that are near the top seems a little too bright... maybe bring the brightness down a touch..

The garbage on the street looks good... one thing that sticks out to me is the whiteness of the curb... I think it would be nice to dirty up that a little more...

Your texturing skills are extremely good...!

One last thing I see is the fisheye of the lens seems a little overboard...
I did a quick PO of your image to show you another possibility of how you can set the lens which I think makes a little more sense for the viewer....




Please keep in mind these are all suggestions which I see may improve your image... I don't know what you have in mind for the image so take these suggestions as you wish or leave them.. It's up to you...

thanx
road
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Old 06 June 2003   #8
ok, the street, it needs displacement/bump, and it needs more colour variation(think chewing gum, and oily darker tones).


the curb is way to light, needs darker tones as well, the sky is not "amsterdamish"(at least not the glowing effect).

I am missing the X
X
X on the "amsterdammertjes"(the poles)

and for some reason the perspective/scale is not correct. the doors seem to small+narrow, and the poles look to large.



other than the things allready stated: nice work so far
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Old 06 June 2003   #9
i was wondering if you made this using a photo as a reference (meaning you copied the things that were on that photo)? cause it would make sense if you did
 
Old 06 June 2003   #10
Road touched on the most critical aspect: The perspective distortion as a result of the fisheye lens! It doesn't work for me, sorry. I like the touchup Road did, it doesn't eliminate the slightly crooked feel to the image, but it DOES eliminate the sense of being seasick!

Also, you need some more detail on the street to make it look closer to scale. The garbage seems a bit large IMO. That discarded cup must hold a gallon of coke! Also, do a dirtmap for the road. Roads have smears of rubber from tires driving over almost the same spots again and again, gum because where there are people there is gum, and oil splotches since most cars seem to leak a little. The oil spots would probably be centered on the driving lanes.

Do you have refs for the grass and vegetation? I only have som refs from Denmark, but i've notived that our variants of grass seem to grow up between the cracks in little dense clumps that spread out like a fan. Your types of grass may be different. In any case, they are a bit static.

Keep at it, i think this could be a really good piece. Actually, it IS really good now, but it could become brilliant with some more work!

L.
 
Old 06 June 2003   #11
I really like this image. I agree that the top half looks best and that the curb is too bright. I disagree with the suggestion to put more contrast in the sky. The sky is probaply the best feature of the image as it is typical to Amsterdam. I also think that it is the sky that makes the top half so good. Especially the top half of the hotel is very convincing. What I don't get though are the long hard shadows. They don't seem to fit with the cloudy sky. These cloudy Dutch skies cause very diffuse shadows. I'd try a GI render just to compare. GI is just the thing for these cloudy skies that seem to emit diffuse light from all over. I also think the buildings would then (in a GI rig) cast more shadow onto the street, which is a lot more realistic since you have such an obvious backlit scene. It will colour the street a bit darker, which will take away the 'too bright a street' situation.

Did you model this after a real location?

Indeed, a very impressive render!
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Old 06 June 2003   #12
Very nice image.

I would focus on a lot of the things that other people have already pointed out, so I won't go into those. Regarding the grass, somehow it just doesn't look natural. While it looks too stiff, the thing that bothers me with it is the way the grass is grouped. I would expect it to be more than just 2-3 big tall blades of grass. I would more likely expect it to have a lot more blades of various size, angle, bend, etc. Maybe have each blade kind of sticking out as if sprouting from near the middle of the clump of grass. _\|/_ <- something like that, only not that exaggerated.


Also, one thing that really needs work I believe is the inside of the cafe. It just doesn't look real. It almost looks as if you just threw a couple of objects in there to take up space. I am not familiar with Amsterdam at all, but I would expect there to be more paintings and things of the nature inside of a cafe. Maybe a board outside the cafe listing the specials of the day. Maybe even add some people on the inside of the cafe, or someone opening the door to enter the cafe.

Also, not sure how you could fix it, or if it really needs fixing or not, but the curtains on the second floor of the building to the left of the cafe just seem too flat to me. Looks too much like a texture that's been applied to a flat surface.

One thing I would really love to see is to add some motion, some movement to the image. Not anything like cars with motion blur going by or anything, but just some form of activity. There's bikes parked outside, and they make me think there should be at least a few other people out and about. Also, it appears to be the middle of the day, which would again make me expect there to be more people around and about.

Anyway, I hope this post can help out in anyway, you really have a good image going.
 
Old 06 June 2003   #13
Hey. I agree that the street looks too clean. More tire smudges, oil spills, random dirt/mud from the rain being tracked in. The top window of the Cafe Building is too clean as well.

Now, I did notice something else, and hopefully I get the picture to attach correctly. It appears that on the columns of the middle building (The outer structure) have the same exact texture on it, just sized slightly different. I'd suggest doing another seperate texture for the other side, simply because the wear and tear on a building's structure will not "instance" the other side.

Very good picture in my opinion though. I think with some of the suggestions above, that this could turn out to be an extremely well done piece.

G.


EDIT: Alright, so I had to attach the image. "Sorry". It shows a closer look at what I was talking about with the repeating texture. Sorry again.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg amsterdambig_crit.jpg (16.8 KB, 112 views)
 
Old 06 June 2003   #14
Very, very nice image

Just a few facts from someone who spends halve of his time in Amsterdam:
* Amsterdam is a lot dirtier, your pic is too clean. Specialy the pavement and the lower parts of the buildings (where are the grafity tags?)
* Those "amsterdammertjes" in front of the buildings should be dark red instead of black (the xxx has already been mentioned).
* You need more bikes or other stuff to block the way of passing pedestrians

Other things have allready been said. I definitely agree on the "more activity" crit. Amsterdam is a crowdy and busy place.

cheers, Jeroen
 
Old 06 June 2003   #15
Hey Jon,

Good picture you got here. I think you and everyone else on here realizes that this has a lot potential to go far.

Here's a few things I would pay attention to:

1. Everyone on here has said the street is too clean. That needs to be addressed. The same goes for the window up on top. Think of yellow stains created from rainwater running down the side of the building and collecting at the corner of the panes.

2. Also the cobblestone texture is either stretching or suffering from some sorta weird radial blur, especially towards the left of the image. Might just be the pattern, but something's not quite right about it.

3. Okay, everyone knows that you never drink every last drop out of a soda in a cup. There's always a little bit left. Even if does have a lid on it, the beverage (ala melted ice, whatnot) will leak out and create a stain on the sidewalk. Those paper wax cups give out sooner or later. That would add a lot to the image. My thing is if the objects inadverdently draws the viewer eyes to it, make it tell a story.

All in all, great pic. Just adding a little here and there would make it fantastic. Hope to see you make some changes and post an update soon, Jon.

peace,

Lu
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Last edited by ntmonkey : 06 June 2003 at 10:23 PM.
 
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