Bradgate Park

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  10 October 2008
Bradgate Park

Hey,

Here are two images I am working on for my course. I have used photo references and I'm trying to push the colours to create a strong vivid impression. I have also mildy attempted to go for an over exposed photo look with the lighting simply because I like the way it looks.

Please share with me how you think I can improve these pieces!

With thanks,

Dan



 
  10 October 2008
Both images suffer from the same issue of echoing.

The first image has the smaller tree echoing the first, and a smaller horizontal green piece echoing a larger, similarly shaped and colored green piece to it's left. All four of these large>small echos are on the same basic visual horizon line... You then compound the problem with a large figure and a smaller figure to the right om the lower RH corner...

The second piece has the shadow (which is far too dark) echoing the shape of the rock, but the greater problem is that of line intersects. Your entire piece "flattens" with all your horizon lines intersecting the right side of the rock, which melds into the horizon, never really rising above any of the horizontal intersects...Makes for a very bland image.

~C
__________________
~ CybrGfx
Never settle for "good enough," until you can honestly say you tried your best.
 
  10 October 2008
Hi CybrGfx
Is there somewhere a definiton of "echoing" in visual concepts?
It's the first time, I'm reading about it and I can't make out the
meaning of it by only looking at this two pictures of fieldscarecrow.
 
  10 October 2008
You may not find direct reference to it as "echoing," although I find the term best describe the visual effect.

In articles of Composition and Design, you will most often find references to it under "repetition," or "pattern," or "rhythm." Usually an "echo" will be a repetitive patterning of line or shape with slight variations.

Sometimes, this echo effect is desired, as repetitions can form their own patterns and visual texture, which can then be utilized to help the visual flow of the work. But most times, they are unintended visual quirks formed subconsciously by the artist, and as such, may hinder the flow and balance of a piece, rather than assist it...

Here are some related links:
http://www.pbase.com/pnd1/rhythm_and_pattern&page=2
http://facweb.cs.depaul.edu/sgrais/..._principles.htm
http://edsitement.neh.gov/printable...plan.asp?id=637

An excellent Visual Example can be found here, with the First Runner Up image, "Winter Cafe." If you read the article analysis, and study the picture, you should have a better concept of "echoing."

Hope this helps some!
~C
__________________
~ CybrGfx
Never settle for "good enough," until you can honestly say you tried your best.

Last edited by CybrGfx : 10 October 2008 at 12:36 PM.
 
  10 October 2008
Ah, ok, I didn't knew this concept, or sometimes unintended and distracting use
of patterns as echoing, but it makes sense.
Thx, for the links.
(sorry for hijacking the thread, fieldscarecrow)
 
  10 October 2008
The question is, can you now see the echoing in these two images more clearly?
Do you better understand (particularly the first image) how these "dual echos" are affecting the visual flow, as well as focal points of the images?

The fact that the human eye is evolution-designed to visually seek contrasts as a matter of survival, is what makes the echo effect desirable in some instances. Once the eye recognizes the patterning effect, particularly when it, too, is repeated, as in the first image with the trees, the viewer may then take more time to carefully study the artwork, seeking to find and identify all the instances of dual-repetition...I've spotted eleven (yes, 11) instances in the tree image, which makes it a great "find it" type of puzzle image, although I'm not sure that was the intent behind it...

Remember that echoing is a form of Repetition, which is a factor of Rhythm, which is what Pattern consists of. While not a major Design factor, it is nonetheless, a contributing principal to Unity, Balance, and Flow.

~C
__________________
~ CybrGfx
Never settle for "good enough," until you can honestly say you tried your best.
 
  10 October 2008
thaaaaaaanks

Thanks for the awesome crit once again CybrGfx!

I hadn't heard of the term echoing in visuals before either

Regarding the things you mentioned which cause my images to suffer, most of them exist in the photos I took for reference, although I did accidently push the contrast too much on the rock. (I tried to lighten it up but I find it really difficult to repaint something once I've textured it and unfortunately I already flattened it! Is it better than before?)

Despite being unintentional I think the echoes have a positive effect in my paintings, I think the reoccurring shapes create consistency and an interesting identity which I've never really given much thought to.

I also think the horizon lines gently lead the eye to the left as they converge into the rock (my focal point).

If it's not too much, could you do a paintover to show me how you would personally re-arrange the composition of my paintings to make them better and less bland? A few arrows and lines would be deeply appreciated!

Many thanks!

PS - No worries Vyse-soa, I'm glad you learned something new too!



Edit: Ahhh I didn't realise you posted again CybrGfx. I did put a little more detail on the bigger tree and a slightly stronger green as an attempt to make it the focal point but I guess it's too subtle to notice.

All the echoes were completely unintended and I'm not sure how many viewers/artists would pick up on them but I think they add an interesting touch. Now that I'm aware of them how do you recommend I prevent them from disrupting the flow of the image and establish a clearer focal point?
 
  10 October 2008
Originally Posted by CybrGfx: The question is, can you now see the echoing in these two images more clearly?
Do you better understand (particularly the first image) how these "dual echos" are affecting the visual flow, as well as focal points of the images?
...


lol, I didn't find the eleven patterns, but after reading about echoing,
exactly this kind of distraction (seeing and comparing patterns) came to mind.
Besides, I think it can give objects a bit of an artificial look, the leefes look like
they were build of lego-blocks.

I like both pictures, but the first, I think, is lacking some interesting sky.

Last edited by Vyse-soa : 10 October 2008 at 03:09 PM.
 
  10 October 2008
All works will have some slight echos, that is the way of the Universe, just look at fractals if you don't believe... The trick when composing, is to either deliberately have and take full advantage of echos to help your composition, or to gently alter them so they are not so obvious...


In the trees image, I played up the duality of the trees a bit more, while slowing down the eye's travel by adjusting the colors on the top part, and adding a bit more sky and highlights to the large tree. This keeps the eye there momentarily, until it travels down the now larger trunk, which rounds the negative space into a subtle swirl incorporating the smaller tree...I then reversed the duality of the two shapes on the distant horizon, again, gently curving back into your picture plane. Minor changes, all in all, yet they change the way the eye travels around the image...


With the rock, I merely brought the focus back to the rock, instead of the eye somewhat sliding off of it and down to the right. By adjusting that shadow shape, the eye slows down a bit, and notices that the marks on the rock resemble runes, almost...Hmmm....I also adjusted your ocean horizon, so that it helps direct the eye back to the rock. Notice how the rock, horizon, and hill all now meet at the top of that giant crevice...Again, little changes, but a somewhat major flow adjustment...

Hope this gives you some ideas!
~C
__________________
~ CybrGfx
Never settle for "good enough," until you can honestly say you tried your best.

Last edited by CybrGfx : 10 October 2008 at 06:09 PM. Reason: kant spel gud 4 eny repliz
 
  10 October 2008
I can't thank you enough for these paint overs!

Such small changes but they make big difference! I've always felt like my art is missing that extra 10% whenever I finish a piece, but with the things I've learned from your examples there's a whole new level of care for my art.

Sure I've got a long way to go, but I can almost honestly say I've tried my best with my current skills rather than just settling for good enough

I've got to rush off to print these for class now. I look forward to learning more from you in the future!

P.S - I'll post my final images later, I feel kinda bad because I just copied all the steps you took in your paintovers because those small decisions really do it for me!
 
  10 October 2008
Don't feel bad. You may have copied the steps, but you didn't just copy the images. The paintovers are to give you ideas. I'm glad they succeeded.

~C
__________________
~ CybrGfx
Never settle for "good enough," until you can honestly say you tried your best.
 
  10 October 2008
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