CGTalk > Main > General Discussion
Login register
Thread Closed share thread « Previous Thread | Next Thread »
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 11-26-2006, 02:58 PM   #31
everlite
Expert
 
everlite's Avatar
portfolio
David Edwards
Professional Matte painter & concept Artist
Freelance DMP / 3d Generalist
Vancouver, Canada
 
Join Date: Apr 2004
Posts: 2,694
Send a message via Yahoo to everlite

Cheers Jedi-Juice for the link, not seen that one.

I think Infinite is great example of something that adds to the realism factor, post production artifacts.

Taking the below image as an example. (I'm guessing this the 3d version and not the real person :-) Understanding the effects of photographic artifacts such as grain, blur and plates shifts all add to create a perfect image, again the imperfections are what lifts this image even further. Notice the green channel around the edge of the skin has been blurred, this a phenomenon we often see in images, something we often over look and at first might not notice, but our brain still reads such effects, the heavy grain and noise, the low contrast all work really well.

 
Old 11-26-2006, 03:11 PM   #32
mech7
Lord of the posts
Chris
Where, Namibia
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 1,588
I think that as it comes to still we are not that far off from making realistic human's but i have never seen any animation which looks realistic especially with these photorealistic human's
__________________
plz click me you know you want to :) http://mech7.net
 
Old 11-26-2006, 03:19 PM   #33
Womball
Good Show!
 
Womball's Avatar
portfolio
Nathan Stromwasser
Bum
Speedsculpt r us
Wilmington, USA
 
Join Date: Sep 2005
Posts: 2,750
Send a message via AIM to Womball Send a message via MSN to Womball Send a message via Yahoo to Womball
You may have to link that image. It may offend people if they are at the office. Very impressive nonetheless, I had been following that thread.
 
Old 11-26-2006, 03:52 PM   #34
P_T
Wing Chun Veteran
 
P_T's Avatar
David Wu
Model
Sydney, Australia
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,545
What do you think about her then?
__________________
Check out my pretties!
 
Old 11-26-2006, 09:50 PM   #35
ThePhotographer
Guest
 
Posts: n/a




everlite and all you others,

I'm by no means a 3D expert - far from that ! If this is 3D, it actually looks quite real. Only thing that I notice is some sort of dark outlining of the girl.

As a photographer there is nevertheless one thing that I would like to point out : there's a difference between looking real and looking like a photo.

I have noticed a lot of things in 3D images which are concidered very bad in photography. Too much grain, too much vertical lines falling to the left and the right. It's like making 3D realistic is too repeat the errors of photography whereas a photographer would try to avoid those things ....

The color noise in the hair of the girl above is a big no-no in photography - I'd not even try to sell a photo like that to a customer ....

As some others already said, why would you want to do something in 3D when you could perhaps do it better with a camera ? Why not try to make something different with 3D ?
 
Old 11-27-2006, 12:05 AM   #36
Ransom
Frequenter
 
Ransom's Avatar
portfolio
Jordan Service
USA
 
Join Date: Oct 2003
Posts: 202
can you post the wire mesh of these fotos, They are absolutely amazing. I would say if I wasnt told that they werent real i would of never of guessed it. Also Even with modern photographs there is most of the time touching up in PS to make the models skin and lighting even better. .... So even photographs do not look real any more....
__________________
The killer of the no reply thread !
 
Old 11-27-2006, 01:11 AM   #37
Stahlberg
Lord of the posts
 
Stahlberg's Avatar
CGSociety Member
portfolio
Steven Stahlberg
Lead Artist
Streamline Studios
Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,601

P_T, that's obviously a real girl that has been blurred.

Infinities girl is amazing, the smoothness of the feet and hands are the main remaining tell-tale that it's not real.

.
 
Old 11-27-2006, 01:43 AM   #38
P_T
Wing Chun Veteran
 
P_T's Avatar
David Wu
Model
Sydney, Australia
 
Join Date: Dec 2002
Posts: 2,545
Quote:
Originally Posted by Stahlberg
P_T, that's obviously a real girl that has been blurred.
Actually...

She's a doll... a VERY expensive life-size doll from what I've heard.

This begs the question, what does that doll have that makes her so life-like when she seem to have no blood flowing under her smooth hairless rubber/plastic skin.

Sorry if it's slightly off-topic but I figure the thread title didn't mention CG.
__________________
Check out my pretties!
 
Old 11-27-2006, 03:32 AM   #39
thepineman
tracks90
 
thepineman's Avatar
portfolio
Manny Pineda
Visualizer
Amodoria
Dubai, United Arab Emirates
 
Join Date: Feb 2006
Posts: 693
Quote:
So do you think as yet we have recreated a perfect human in 3d?


most the details of humans in 3D like skin, movement can now be recreated by good texturing and mocap but there is just one more detail that is very difficult to mimic and that is the feeling of a person in 3D when you look deep in their eyes.

For me the eyes is indeed the Window of the Soul. And since we are all very familiar with peoples eyes and we can easily tell if its real or just plain CG.

just look and stare at your girlfriends eyes and see theres a big difference compared to a CG image or animation. when you stare at a persons eyes you can feel their feelings in some way and that theres more to just what we physically see. And this is difficult to copy in CG. when we look at a CG eyes it looks empty.

Now, i think its possible to solve this problem with the use of the real eyes combined with good camera tracking software that was done in the Davey Jones scenes.

So, i think the reason why its still look unreal is because theres really no life and soul to a CG object something only real and live person can have.
 
Old 11-27-2006, 05:03 AM   #40
shy-guy
CG geek
 
shy-guy's Avatar
portfolio
Daniel Castillo S.
Graphic Designer
Maracaibo, Venezuela
 
Join Date: Feb 2005
Posts: 970
Quote:
Originally posted by thepineman
Now, i think its possible to solve this problem with the use of the real eyes combined with good camera tracking software that was done in the Davey Jones scenes.

So, i think the reason why its still look unreal is because theres really no life and soul to a CG object something only real and live person can have.

Davey Jones eyes weren´t real as i understand; all of him is 100% cg; in the davey jones thread the guys who worked on him explained more or less how they did it.

Btw, the image everlite posted, is it a 3d rendering or a doll, or a real girl? Everyone says something diferent. If its not a real girl... whatever it may be its amazing.

If its a doll... it would be creepy as hell to have that thing near you .
__________________
"All my past mistakes and wasted days i wouldn´t have it any other way"

My Youtube Channel


3d Gallery: "Mega Man X"
 
Old 11-27-2006, 05:41 AM   #41
Stahlberg
Lord of the posts
 
Stahlberg's Avatar
CGSociety Member
portfolio
Steven Stahlberg
Lead Artist
Streamline Studios
Kuala Lumpur, Malaysia
 
Join Date: Jan 2002
Posts: 4,601

Quote:
theres more to just what we physically see.

Respectfully, but that's logically impossible. So you mean that photos and film/videos of real people are somehow magically imbued with some kind of spiritual essence that cg renderings lack?

No, obviously, when we talk about photographs, it ALL comes down to what we physically see, and nothing more. We just haven't got to the stage yet where the technology can render animal tissues 100% realistically. (In fact most renderers can't render ANYTHING 100% realistically yet.) Nor can most artists mimic realistic shape down to the millimeter tolerances required.
See the doll posted by P_T above. It seems I was correct in stating she was real, not cg. The biggest give-away wasn't her body though, it was the dress.

.
 
Old 11-27-2006, 06:56 AM   #42
jeremybirn
Jeremy Birn
 
jeremybirn's Avatar
Jeremy Birn
Lighting Artist
Pixar Animation Studios
Berkeley,
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,664
Quote:
Making a realistic human, why is this still impossible?


I don't really agree with the question. I don't agree that making realistic humans is impossible, because we are fooled by realistic digital human models in many, many movies. The list of difficulties posted in this thread may start to explain why humans are some of the trickiest things to do right, or why movies tend to cut to digital doubles sparingly and use editing to try to focus you on the real actors immediately before and after the shots with the digital doubles, but still, there they are, realistic human figures that fool the audience.

-jeremy
__________________
Jeremy Birn
Author, Digital Lighting & Rendering, 3rd Edition
 
Old 11-27-2006, 07:28 AM   #43
Michael5188
another mime
 
Michael5188's Avatar
portfolio
Michael Sime
animator/rigger
NYC, USA
 
Join Date: May 2003
Posts: 2,763
Quote:
Originally Posted by jeremybirn
I don't really agree with the question. I don't agree that making realistic humans is impossible, because we are fooled by realistic digital human models in many, many movies. The list of difficulties posted in this thread may start to explain why humans are some of the trickiest things to do right, or why movies tend to cut to digital doubles sparingly and use editing to try to focus you on the real actors immediately before and after the shots with the digital doubles, but still, there they are, realistic human figures that fool the audience.

-jeremy


Ha, I used to think digital doubles were obvious and couldn't be done well. Then on DVD extra features on some movies, I found that most of the time they were used I didn't even know. Guess I only noticed them when it was done poorly, hence my doubting the effectiveness of them.

Infinite's girl is amazing, but I think her legs and feet look false. But again, this is cause I know it's cg and am looking for problems. Honestly, it could be a photo, and I would still think the feet looked wrong, but we accept things in photos as true that we wouldn't in any man made image.
__________________
-Michael

www.MichaelSime.com
 
Old 11-27-2006, 02:04 PM   #44
jeremybirn
Jeremy Birn
 
jeremybirn's Avatar
Jeremy Birn
Lighting Artist
Pixar Animation Studios
Berkeley,
 
Join Date: Feb 2003
Posts: 4,664
Quote:
Originally Posted by thepineman
For me the eyes is indeed the Window of the Soul. And since we are all very familiar with peoples eyes and we can easily tell if its real or just plain CG.

just look and stare at your girlfriends eyes and see theres a big difference compared to a CG image or animation. when you stare at a persons eyes you can feel their feelings in some way and that theres more to just what we physically see. And this is difficult to copy in CG. when we look at a CG eyes it looks empty.

Now, i think its possible to solve this problem with the use of the real eyes combined with good camera tracking software that was done in the Davey Jones scenes.


If they looked like "real eyes" to you, that shows that folks at ILM did a good job animating and rendering those "windows of the soul." Davey Jones, including his eyes, was 100% CG throughout Pirates of the Carribean II. There was no compositing of "real eyes" into him, only careful animation studying the real actor's performance as reference. There was a good thread right here on cgtalk where people who worked on that animation came and posted about this, too.

-jeremy
__________________
Jeremy Birn
Author, Digital Lighting & Rendering, 3rd Edition
 
Old 11-27-2006, 02:11 PM   #45
ThirdEye
PinealGlandOptics
 
ThirdEye's Avatar
CGSociety Member
Alberto Blasi
Architect & Graphic Designer
Milan, Italy
 
Join Date: Jun 2002
Posts: 10,241

Quote:
Originally Posted by shy-guy
Btw, the image everlite posted, is it a 3d rendering or a doll, or a real girl? Everyone says something diferent. If its not a real girl... whatever it may be its amazing


The one posted by everlite is CG, the one posted by P_T is a doll
__________________
www.albertoblasi.com | architect & graphic designer
 
Thread Closed share thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
CGSociety
Society of Digital Artists
www.cgsociety.org

Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2006,
Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Minimize Ads
Forum Jump
Miscellaneous

All times are GMT. The time now is 10:15 PM.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.