Blendshaping AFTER painting weights? Possible?

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  03 March 2006
Blendshaping AFTER painting weights? Possible?

Hey people...i seem to be using this forum alot these few days cheers to u guys for all the help.

Heres the NEW problem. Working on another character. this guys low poly isnt exactly low poly but anyway he has been binded to bones. weights painted. textured. etc.

Now i need to add blendshapes to do lipsync and facial expression. so what i did was select the faces in the area required(all in the head), then i went to "edit polygon -> extract" followed by "polygon -> seperate" followed by duplicating the head afew times...then connected the blendshapes. after that i put the original head back, combined and merged verts. So right now ive got one single poly mesh with blendshapes reshaping just the head which is good. but i cant seem to reapply the weights anymore :( when i unbinded i made sure the keep history option for unbind was on. So Shouldnt it work?

Ive also tried keeping the head seperate from the body and tried binding that way. didnt work either. all the information for the painted weights are lost. IM really against the whole idea of REPAINTING weights...i hate weight painting so much now

Another attempt i tried an import export skin weights script think maybe mayas buillt in one blows. Sadly...not working

ive got the team working on the scenes that dont need this character right now but i need this guy going in a hurry. PLEASEEEeee help people thank you so much in advance
 
  03 March 2006
I don't think you can smoothbind a model, then cut it up and expect it to keep all the smoothbound information. Or export the skin weights, cut it up and then reapply.

I think you would just duplicate the whole body mesh, (making sure its in its bind pose) and then create the facial blendshapes from that. I'm pretty sure this is the only way to do blendshapes, as they have to have the same number of verts.

Now i would like to be proved wrong on this, as i've always throught it must take up alot of computer resources to have to copy the whole body mesh, then all's you want to do is setup facial blendshapes, so if there is another method i've completely missed then someone please tell me

Hez
 
  03 March 2006
the export weights option, i've never been a huge supporter of that, it never works right and it has to make a lot of maps. I would just duplicate the whole mesh and then just adjust the face. I know it seems like it would slow the scene down to have that many meshes in the scene, but remember that when you are completely done, you can delete the meshes and the blends will still be there. That is how I would do it. Also, don't forget to change the input orders on the mesh so that the blends are before the skin, or you will make the skin "not work".
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  03 March 2006
Buy the Hyper-realistic Rigging DVD from Alias, where they show how to rig this beast character. They show how to cleanly seperate a character´s face from the body and sew the stuff together after applying the blend shapes. I took a look at it and there should be some threads about the DVD´s methods on www.highend3d.com, but I guess the best thing is to get the DVD somewhere cheap. They had it as a download for Alias silver membership, so maybe there is a way to get it as a cheap student download.

Good luck man,

Chris
 
  03 March 2006
thanks guys since i had three models i did threee different approaches. for the first bugger, since his weights werent painted yet...i seperated his head, made blendshapes and reattached the head but i didnt merge it together...i just painted the weights so it held together at the neck. after alot of fighting and struggling...it works YAY!!!

second character...thanks to the advice of dichotomy... i just duplicated the whole bugger and made blend shapes that way. since he had his weights painted...i did it that way instead cause exporting weights just blows. I also had a struggle but managed to somehow work it YAY!!!

dichotomy's advice on Also, "don't forget to change the input orders on the mesh so that the blends are before the skin, or you will make the skin "not work" GREAT ADVICE!!! and i used the membership to remove the unwanted parts (that tool itself took me awhile to understand aswell :P im pretty bad at this whole rigging process...nothing really seems certain for me still after all this practice.

for the third character i somehow if i am not wrong...extracted the head, made blendshapes and SOMEHOW reconnected the head to the body back into a single mesh and it worked.

Anyway thanks guys so very much for all the help all this while. see you around when i get the project done.
 
  03 March 2006
dunkelzahn, I got that DVD through the Silver Membership but i didn't see the bit you mentioned. I've only scanned through it and looked at specific bits, not watched it as a whole so could have easily missed it. What section is it it?

Also, the silver membership DVD's, are they the same as the bought ones, or are they only extracts, as some of them seemed to be abit vague on sections, as if they missed something out.

Cheers

Hez
 
  04 April 2006
Originally Posted by Hezza: dunkelzahn, I got that DVD through the Silver Membership but i didn't see the bit you mentioned. I've only scanned through it and looked at specific bits, not watched it as a whole so could have easily missed it. What section is it it?

Also, the silver membership DVD's, are they the same as the bought ones, or are they only extracts, as some of them seemed to be abit vague on sections, as if they missed something out.

Cheers

Hez


Some of the downloadable DVDs are the same as the retail, but there are also some Downloads that are just a shitty preview of the retails! As a matter of fact this happened with the Toon Series and the Hyperreal Series. So you definately have to buy the DVD to get the real info you need!
 
  04 April 2006
Dirty buggers at Alias, dishing out only parts of the DVD´s. I didn´t know that yet, but I only downloaded them on a montly base to build up a library for the agency I´m working for (just in case, my superiors think I can stomp out complete projects on a daily base), so I haven´t had a proper look at them yet.
 
  04 April 2006
For painting weights, use David Waldens "skinningTools" Script, downloadable from his website here.

For transferring, saving, importing/exporting weights, use Michael Comets saveWeights tool from here.

As for blendshapes, there is no need to go through the trouble to disconnect/seperate the head from the body and all of that huge hassle you are going though. Just do a blendshape on the whole solid model. The blendshape node only contains info when a points position is changed, so you do not save any memory or RAM by going the way you are doing it. (In fact, your way is very likely slower due to the way I suspect you have set it up)

Once the blendShape has been applied, you can delete the targets to free up the extra space.

I hope this helps you out a bit. Painting weights isn't too bad once you get comfortable with it, as long as the model has good topology.

Mike R
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  04 April 2006
You also may want to check out my cSmartBlend plugin I have for sale at www.cometdigital.com It lets you apply blendshapes to say a chopped off head of the character and put that into the full body rig/mesh.... even if the points don't exactly line up etc...
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  04 April 2006
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