ptex workflow

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  06 June 2013
ptex workflow

some ptex workflow insides from Craig...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ElVbyLyD_ts
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  06 June 2013
so ptex looks really interesting, but when i import from mudbox to 3dsmax the .ptx diffuse is empty.

does this work with mental ray yet? is there a way to get this to work?
 
  06 June 2013
no native ptex support for mental ray in max... but there is a plugin for... think its called stripes...

in max you have to use vray...
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Last edited by oglu : 06 June 2013 at 09:25 AM.
 
  06 June 2013
that's what i suspected. what a bummer. thanks for the response though!
 
  06 June 2013
Really? That is wild. I would have thought you could turn it on in Max as well since it is something that is not really immediate in Maya also. You have to jump through some hoops.

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthread.php?t=1045919

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=etpX2BNnrxo&feature=player_detailpage

There is one limitation though which is only displacement mapping no bump mapping.
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Last edited by cineartist : 06 June 2013 at 06:53 PM.
 
  06 June 2013
[QUOTE=cineartist]Really? That is wild. I would have thought you could turn it on in Max as well since it is something that is not really immediate in Maya also. You have to jump through some hoops.

yeah ... it does sound crazy doesn't it? maybe it's an "a Autodesk let's keep this only in Maya thing for now" type-of-thing.

either way ptex looks fantastic and i'd love to use it asap.
 
  06 June 2013
Yeah, I think it is just a Max thing and it is not implemented yet.

http://forums.autodesk.com/t5/Commu...LP/td-p/4290620

But also there is nothing stopping you from painting with Ptex. As a workflow across applications it still is not as smooth yet anyway. And you can generate a UV map in mubox to use for exporting. The only thing is you will not be able to paint on it in something like PhotoShop. If you want to do that you can paint with Ptex and use a nice UV unrap from max or Zbrush to use for exporting that will allow for touch ups in Photoshop.
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  06 June 2013
Thanks for this information, guys.

When Mud first got Ptex I thought Ptex support for Maya, Max and (hopefully) Softimage (yeah, right) would be right around the corner, but I guess not...

I've tried Ptex in Maya, rendering with Viewport 2.0, with less than ideal results, even though it supposedly supports it. That was quite a while ago, with Mud 2012 and Maya 2012. Haven't tried since, as I've effectively written off ptex for the time being and haven't felt like going to the effort.
Softimage still needs UV maps and textures though, so for me Ptex isn't completely useful until Softimage gets it...

Last edited by twosheds : 06 June 2013 at 01:46 AM.
 
  06 June 2013
You can use Ptex with Vray for Softimage:

http://www.chaosgroup.com/en/2/vray...e_features.html

And Max:

http://www.chaosgroup.com/en/2/vray_features.html

Though I have not tried either.
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  06 June 2013
Originally Posted by cineartist: You can use Ptex with Vray for Softimage:

http://www.chaosgroup.com/en/2/vray...e_features.html


Oh right.
I guess I should have added Vray isn't in my budget.

Well I'm still needing UV mapped and textured objects for the most part anyway, though it would be nice to be able to avoid that from time to time.

I'm not a 3ds max user.
 
  06 June 2013
Yeah. I agree it would be nice. I think when Ptex was created it was being used primarily with Renderman. So the pipeline outside of that is slow to develop.

This is one of the many reasons I have phased Softimage out of my pipeline. I love that program and I wanted it to be the central app for me. I am comfortable working in it. But the reality is that Maya has had a much stronger user base in more pipelines for longer. It just made more sense to me to switch because things move to Maya much faster. And it is no surprise that the Open Subdiv project is centered around a Maya pipeline. It is a sad thing for Softimage. There are so many great things about that program, that it was very hard for me to choose. But for me, and what I wanted to do, it became every apparent that resistance was futile.
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  06 June 2013
Originally Posted by cineartist: Yeah. I agree it would be nice. I think when Ptex was created it was being used primarily with Renderman. So the pipeline outside of that is slow to develop.

This is one of the many reasons I have phased Softimage out of my pipeline. I love that program and I wanted it to be the central app for me. I am comfortable working in it. But the reality is that Maya has had a much stronger user base in more pipelines for longer. It just made more sense to me to switch because things move to Maya much faster. And it is no surprise that the Open Subdiv project is centered around a Maya pipeline. It is a sad thing for Softimage. There are so many great things about that program, that it was very hard for me to choose. But for me, and what I wanted to do, it became every apparent that resistance was futile.


Yeah I agree completely. I think ICE is the only thing keeping Softimage alive these days...

From what I understand, Maya became as huge as it is, not because it was so much better than everything else, but due to its innate ability to be easily used as a shell for custom scripting.

Maya has been slowly becoming more intuitive in recent years, but a number of things in it still really put me off, such as the hypershade, for one.
As a complete program, Softimage, IMO has far more going for it. Maya is very powerful indeed, but so is Softimage, although Softimage is actually even fun to use, where Maya is all too frequently an exercise in aggravation.

I'm glad though that AD doesn't forget to include Mudbox integration with Softimage.
 
  06 June 2013
Yeah I think logical is the word that comes to mind with Softimage. In many ways I wish I had more reason to go there for my needs, but time and time again the things I want to do are easier and more catered to character animation workflow in Maya. As much as I love Siflex on ICE and even with the most recent - and long over due - painting of attributes, hands down nCloth is much better for character work in its tool set. And even hair - true there are killer tools in ICE for this - I have to say that for character animation work, you can not beat nHair in my opinion.

And once I started adding it all up. Better integration with Mudbox, working with MotionBuilder and HIK rigs and the list just started growing.

For me though I do love Maya. I actually prefer working in it lately the more I learn of it. And it was not nearly as painful as I thought to get my head around rendering. I had it well figured out in Softimage but even that is more user friendly to me in Maya.

Where the two programs fall away from each other for me is when you start to dig under the hood. Softimage is very easy when you learn the basics of ICE. Whereas in Maya, the inputs and outputs and transform groups that get created automatically and just a ton of very complicated and difficult to wrangle - and understand - stuff under the hood is where my eyes gloss over. But that is merely because I have not fully learned it all yet.

Most of the interface I find intuitive and artist friendly and it leaves that stuff underneath unless I really need to take a look at it. Same in Softimage too. But I think the ICE environment and the shading nodes are so much easier to grasp.

And then just the awesome potential of ICE modeling and Lagoa....

As an FX tool, it is right up there with Houdni. Though many would argue Houdni leaves it in the dust.... ah no pun intended....

Anyways..... It really would be nice to see AD push the devs to integrate Softimage into pipelines much more than it has,
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  06 June 2013
Unfortunately, Softimage has become like the red-headed stepchild of Autodesk; for now they have to continue supporting it, and even nurturing it to a minimal degree, but they don't have to love it.

Well I've seen the writing on the wall for a few years now and am prepared to accept the inevitable. Fortunately I can continue with Softimage until I have no choice but to switch forever to Maya.
The day I make that decision is going to be a sad one indeed.

But back on topic - it really surprises me that ptex isn't fully supported in all apps using mental ray by now. I don't mean workarounds, plugins, scripts, or registry hacks, I mean full native, production-ready support. It actually almost seems ridiculous to me that they mention Mudbox's ptex painting as a feature, when their products Mudbox is used most with can't even use it without a great deal of help.

Last edited by twosheds : 06 June 2013 at 03:47 PM.
 
  06 June 2013
Regarding Softimage I don't think it entirely falls in the hands of Autodesk. Softimage has its own legacy, and up until recently their own development team. It is an interesting dynamic to own software and try and influence development yet allow developers to have their own sway with the software they have nurtured for so long. It is a very delicate route to travel.

If there is any mistake it is more along the management team who through some kind of misguided fantasy and a few marketing hooks believe that somehow all of this is coming together seamlessly. It isn't. And some of the developers even seem quite out of touch with reality. I was quite amazed when Joel mentioned at the last "meet the experts" event for MotionBuilder in response to a question regarding SI workflow with Motion Builder that "oh yeah there's a send to MotionBuilder in Softimage..." Ah.... go look at that video if you don't believe me. I even posted a thread on it here.

If the development team for MotionBuider is that far out of touch with reality.... man.... something is amiss.

All I can say is, I want what he's been smoking.

And then to segue onto topic here. Yes, it is a management fantasy and a marketing hook. Same thing here with Ptex. Yes. Mudbox has it. And of course it is used with pipelines that support it. Renderman, Vray, and a very questionable "support" in Mental Ray as it exists in Maya.

I am not so sure I can blame them for promoting it. And it is a work in progress we will see some very nice things from this and the Open Sudiv in the future. But it is a large project.

All of that aside it is still a feature that is useful within Mudbox regardless.
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