AMD Radeon ProRender render engine

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  1 Week Ago
Hey everyone, I'm new here and hoping someone could answer a question for me. I'm looking to build a new machine for rendering still images in C4D. I'm trying to figure out if CPU rendering is faster, or if GPU rendering is the way to go. So far, my machine is spec'd with AMD's Threadripper 1950x and dual 1080ti's (not in SLI). Does anyone know if CPU or GPU rendering would be faster with this build?

If CPU rendering is faster, I'll drop down to a single GPU, whereas, if GPU rendering is faster, I can get a lower spec'd CPU.

Any info would be greatly appreciated!
 
  1 Week Ago
Thats an almost impossible to answer question unless youve picked a render engine. Is it currently worth investing in multiple GPUs for pro render? not yet, is it worth it for Octane or similar?, maybe. It depends how you need to work and what you make. For example if you need to use render farms for bigger jobs, that will immediately limit your choices, cpu renderers are currently much simpler as far as farms go. Do you intend to render everything on one single local machine?

Theres also the question of how much you like to cheat. Personally I cheat in every render; ie. I place lights inside models to pretend their glowing materials are making light. I fake GI, I fake AO, I use sky reflections not geometry reflections.... I do all of this to get sub-10 second render times when making motion graphics. Currently, no gpu engine is generally capable of cheating to the same extent as CPU renderers, thus they wont give you a clean and usable rendered frame in 10 seconds. they will however give you fast GI renders, but by fast, I mean only taking 10 minutes for a frame. If you're making architectural walkthroughs, 2 GPUS won't be enough and you might struggle to find a farm to render on.
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  1 Week Ago
Thanks for the info. I create interior renders of business and retail spaces. I'm not that new to 3D, but I have never really taken the time to look into the details of the render engine and how to optimize it.

I'd be rendering on one local machine, possibly 3 machines over our local render farm and they'd all be still, single images that currently take around 30-60 minutes per render.
 
  1 Week Ago
Originally Posted by imashination: I fake GI, I fake AO, I use sky reflections not geometry reflections....
Off-topic, but can you please elaborate how you do this in C4D or provide me a link where I can read more about faking GI, AO and sky reflections?

Thanks so much,
Tobi
 
  1 Week Ago
Originally Posted by imashination: Thats an almost impossible to answer question unless youve picked a render engine. Is it currently worth investing in multiple GPUs for pro render? not yet, is it worth it for Octane or similar?, maybe. It depends how you need to work and what you make. For example if you need to use render farms for bigger jobs, that will immediately limit your choices, cpu renderers are currently much simpler as far as farms go. Do you intend to render everything on one single local machine?

Theres also the question of how much you like to cheat. Personally I cheat in every render; ie. I place lights inside models to pretend their glowing materials are making light. I fake GI, I fake AO, I use sky reflections not geometry reflections.... I do all of this to get sub-10 second render times when making motion graphics. Currently, no gpu engine is generally capable of cheating to the same extent as CPU renderers, thus they wont give you a clean and usable rendered frame in 10 seconds. they will however give you fast GI renders, but by fast, I mean only taking 10 minutes for a frame. If you're making architectural walkthroughs, 2 GPUS won't be enough and you might struggle to find a farm to render on.

Hi Matthew - these techniques that you useto speed up C4d's CPU rendering - do you cover them in the video tutorial available for purchase on your website?
 
  1 Week Ago
I downloaded the trial version of V19 to test ProRender's performance in C4d. A simple plane, bevelled box, and a 3k HDRi placed as a sky object (no other lamps) rendered at 1280x720 takes 4~5 minutes to render 500 samples on my 1080GTX. Even at that level of samples it still looks noisy.

The identical scene in Blender ProRender takes around 30~40 seconds for a visually noise-free result. I made sure to mirror ProRender render settings between Blender and C4d as much as I could. Blender was set to "High", and those settings I copied to C4d's ProRender settings.

I checked the device settings in the ProRender render settings, and C4d seems to be identifying and using the 1080.
The very slow render time doesn't seem to be correct, though. Anyone here know what might be going on?
 
  1 Week Ago
Originally Posted by hvanderwegen: I downloaded the trial version of V19 to test ProRender's performance in C4d. A simple plane, bevelled box, and a 3k HDRi placed as a sky object (no other lamps) rendered at 1280x720 takes 4~5 minutes to render 500 samples on my 1080GTX. Even at that level of samples it still looks noisy.

The identical scene in Blender ProRender takes around 30~40 seconds for a visually noise-free result. I made sure to mirror ProRender render settings between Blender and C4d as much as I could. Blender was set to "High", and those settings I copied to C4d's ProRender settings.

I checked the device settings in the ProRender render settings, and C4d seems to be identifying and using the 1080.
The very slow render time doesn't seem to be correct, though. Anyone here know what might be going on?


this should take seconds to render, me thinks theres something wrong with the scene file. if you can PM me a download link for the file i can have a look for you
 
  1 Week Ago
i have exactly the same experience. 5 minutes for a cube on a plane with an hdri. still some noise left.
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  1 Week Ago
I must say I haven't had the time to really use Pro render, and I might not even use it right, but my experience is similar: lightning fast preview, but very long to resolve all the noise.

I only have a single GT680 though, this is probably the issue.

In the meantimen until I get a better gpu, I get final images quicker with tweaked settings in standard renderer and cpu. Or if I can get away with it... Hardware renderer FTW!

About that, what would be the minimum GPU you should get to actually take advantage of GPU speed over a normal current gen i7 or Ryzen CPU ?
 
  1 Week Ago
to clarify: 5 min on my macbook pro with a radeon pro 460 card, around 2.30 min on my mac pro with two amd fire pro D700 cards. still a little bit of noise visible. physical renders the same scene with qmc in 1 minute 10 sec to roughly the same amount of remaining grain.
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  1 Week Ago
without a scene file its difficult to see what the problem is.
but one thing that could be the reason for the long wait for noiseless renders is if you are using the standard material, either aplied or the default where the colour channel is active. Prorender really does not like the colour channel and should never be used with prorender. with prorender a reflectance diffused base layer should be used as the "colour" channel, that should give quicker results.
also have a read through my colleagues excellent post on prorender tips and tricks

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthr...?f=47&t=1465681
 
  1 Week Ago
ah, ok... i did not know that... changed the materials, but still 2 minutes on the mac pro for a fairly noisy result.

left pretty much everything at default settings, there can't be much room for mistakes, since it's just a disc, a cube and a sky object with an hdri. i also made sure both cards are used in the settings. here's the file:https://we.tl/sLEIw1ysQR
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Last edited by everfresh : 1 Week Ago at 01:04 PM.
 
  1 Week Ago
Originally Posted by theglenster: without a scene file its difficult to see what the problem is.
but one thing that could be the reason for the long wait for noiseless renders is if you are using the standard material, either aplied or the default where the colour channel is active. Prorender really does not like the colour channel and should never be used with prorender. with prorender a reflectance diffused base layer should be used as the "colour" channel, that should give quicker results.
also have a read through my colleagues excellent post on prorender tips and tricks

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthr...?f=47&t=1465681

Thanks, I changed the material to a PBR one, just like you suggest. Instead of 21k samples per second, I now get around 29.

But it STILL takes over four minutes to render a simple rounded cube with a plane and a 3k HDRi sky object, no lights and 500 samples. Compared, Blender's ProRender implementation is by FAR faster, and with 50 iterations as good as noiseless (visually). With 500 samples in C4d it is still very noisy.

So what is going on? Why is ProRender in Blender so much faster and able to generate noiseless renders of the same scene in 40 seconds? Is C4d not taking advantage of the GPU at all? (Note: I am using the demo version to test ProRender here - perhaps it doesn't work properly with GPU rendering?)

Also strange: the same 16K HDRi renders just fine in Blender's ProRender, but C4d's ProRender throws an error (tried two from HDRi Haven).

GTX1080 8GB, 48GB RAM, i7 920@3.6ghz.
 
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