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  09 September 2010
Originally Posted by imashination: Because im tired of reading allegations and insinuations about things ive never said. Im sure youd be every bit as defensive if it were directed at you.


so much for the 60 pounds to get DOF. yet YOU accused me of making up numbers to try to build some straw man case... you are the delusional one. my first replies were to others that you came in responding to - i don't recall personally attacking you once - yet that is all you can seem to reply about.

i have a friend like you and we talk politics at times - he stoops to pointing out misspellings or missing commas and conveniently avoids the many points in the conversation where he loses - just like you - looking for any side step away from the topic at hand.

you are a joke mash - it's really funny i was thinking the same thing this morning about you being the new DARF. ironic.

someday you will cut the apron strings to maxon (or have them cut for you) and you will realize there is a whole world out there. until then your new name is uncle rico - living in the past with small things you consider your glory days... "ahh i remember packing manuals" what a laugh... try to linger and spread the mystique that is "the mash" as long as you can. the best memories your life has to offer. and oooh your like a famous person to some... hushed whispers as he enters the bar "he packed manuals at maxon" ha!

if you look back - YOU came into this and attacked me first -multiple times. that typical blind spot that self absorbed people like you have - and if you look back i apologized for making a stupid comment multiple times that started this, and for even possibly misreading my reply that i felt was insensitive to the reasons a person had for not upgrading - none of that was toward you at all - you seem to miss those things - and since then you've been imagining all these assaults on your person - i've only just responded to your attacks. and i've tried to be as civil as i could try to be until now - see how you like it.

so funny too you make some comment about imaginary attacks on your ethics - i remember a guy just like you - he was in the middle of ripping some guy on this very forum a few years back - all about ethics yet in another forum he was bragging about buying a G5 and deciding he did not want it so he purposely damaged the internal heat sensor so he could return it as defective... what an ethical guy he was... could you imagine being like that guy? no you are nothing like him, are you? - though that guy is delusional too as he only sees things from one side - the side that benefits him alone.

maxon should thank god each day for you - i bet they would have failed years ago without your magical insights and skills. keep those manual packing dreams alive!

see now this is just fun, now i see why you act this way - see you later uncle rico,

dann
__________________
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Dann Stubbs - dann@darkskydigital.com
http://www.RenderKing.com Value Priced C4D, VRAY, Cycles4D Render Farm
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  09 September 2010
Originally Posted by imashination: Because im tired of reading allegations and insinuations about things ive never said. Im sure youd be every bit as defensive if it were directed at you.


OK I hear you.

Without a doubt, Matthew Oneill and Dann Stubbs are 2 invaluable players in service to those of us who make a living using C4D. I'm sure one (or even each of you) will need the other in some way at some point if you havent already.

When people are feeling that their needs or POV are not valid, it creates anger.
Couple that with an upgrade price that is higher than seen in past relases and the state of the economy in some parts of the world and you get this thread.

I think we all want the same things: affordable products that help us do our job better (as everyone does no matter what the product). I understand Dann's initital comments questioning the neccesity of some of the new features. Features that seem to apply more to the photoreal arena in 3d production. Photoreal has become more attainable to more people, but its not always the desired result depending on the job.


My feelings, despite all the great features is that 12 still doesnt feel like a .0 release.
I can also recognise that all of the additions in 12 will fit into my workflow in some way at some time or another.

Anyway not sure what my point is. I guess it would just be nice if we could all respect each other's opinions here and try to be more like Srek. But alas, this is the internet...
 
  09 September 2010
Originally Posted by Joseppi: As a longtime Cinema user, it's sad to see the long history of community here fraying under the strain of this topic. I won't be able to upgrade for the foreseeable future, but I will be using what I do have to the fullest, and still hope to learn and contribute, even if I'm not on the latest release.

What perhaps is an underlying source of stress, we (truly, the global "we") have is the economic stress of the last few years. It has not been a boom time for a while, with talk of companies, countries, and household budgets having to make cuts or do with less. Perhaps many of us know people dealing with job loss or the specter of job loss. There has been stress and uncertainty for an extended period of time. There are some signs of improvement, which is encouraging, but I think the financial stress for many, even low-grade, and faded into "routine" is a factor in the "upgrade price" subject.

I'm affected by all these events like everyone, and the results may not be how I would prefer, but it pains me to see so many people who have all done and contributed so much to each other over the years in the situation where they are adversaries.

I really wish everyone the best, and hopefully a stabilizing and improvement to global finances. People here are passionate and talented, and everyone is trying to make their way the best they can. I don't think many of us could have went through the last year or two without being affected on some level by job loss or economic developments, and I would hope we can appreciate maybe colleagues of years might be a bit frayed, and we can take it easy on each other. Nobody is going to brag about they just got canned, or are worried about a late round of layoffs, but these are still trying times. For what may be unspoken personal concerns, I still see the talent, knowledge and spirit of community that has been a part of the C4D community for so long...

Thank you to so many that have been a part of making being a C4D user a great experience.

Sincerely,
Joe


That was eloquently said, Joe. In the best of all worlds, we would all upgrade, because we like this platform. Reality, though, stinks. Having missed a couple of releases, some of us are at the point we'd have to just re-purchase the whole package. If we weren't so attached to Cinema, looking for a less expensive alternative wouldn't upset us so much. Well... all the money, time, and pounding head on desk invested probably has something to do with it, too.

After a week or so getting used to the idea that, if you don't have a corporate pocket to pick, you're probably out the door, it's not so bad. I've selected a replacement, and am busy converting projects to cross-platform files, and sighing a lot. A few household repairs to take care of before the next big purchase, and hoping 2011 is a bit kinder.

The Cinema forums around the web have been a pleasure to frequent. Though I'll probably pop in out of habit, from time to time. Hey, I still poke my nose in Bryce places to see what's up.
__________________
"Then we're stupid, and we'll die." (Pris)
 
  09 September 2010
Originally Posted by JoelD: Without a doubt, Matthew Oneill and Dann Stubbs are 2 invaluable players in service to those of us who make a living using C4D. I'm sure one (or even each of you) will need the other in some way at some point if you havent already.


Here here, indeed this is true. It's sad to see this thread containing so much personal bickering between highly respected members here. It makes me think of that scene in The Life of Brian by Monty Python when the 2 groups of rebels start fighting each under under the palace. Someone shouts 'Brothers, we should be struggling together' someone else replies 'We are!'

At the risk of sounding like a hippie, can't we all just take a step back and try and treat each other with more respect.? There can be no winners here and I hate to think what impression someone new to Cinema gets when they come to this forum and reads this thread.

Cheers,
Brian
 
  09 September 2010
Quote: so much for the 60 pounds to get DOF. yet YOU accused me of making up numbers to try to build some straw man case...


http://www.frischluft.com/order/index.php
Lenscare, photoshop, $89 dollars, current exchange rate = 59.

No need any comeback, youve said everything.
__________________
Matthew O'Neill
www.3dfluff.com

Last edited by imashination : 09 September 2010 at 05:19 PM.
 
  09 September 2010
I have a feeling that Team Stubbs vs Team Oneill won't be as popular as Team Coco vs Team Leno or Team Jacob vs Team Edward...then again, this could be the next CG Challenge.
 
  09 September 2010
Why debate the point, and let it derail into minutia? Those who can afford to upgrade will, and those who can't will find out there are alternatives that ain't half bad. The price is set, the product is out, and you can express your view with your checkbook.

As one of the token females here, I'm sternly recommending handshakes, and a bevy.
__________________
"Then we're stupid, and we'll die." (Pris)
 
  09 September 2010
Originally Posted by imashination: http://vimeo.com/8200251


Alex's Roman's masterwork is timeless and an inspiration for all times for all of us and one that should be the highest art for simulation anywhere and anytime.
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digitecture.org
Design|Energy|Computation


 
  09 September 2010
__________________

 
  09 September 2010
Originally Posted by imashination: http://www.frischluft.com/order/index.php
Lenscare, photoshop, $89 dollars, current exchange rate = 59.

No need any comeback, youve said everything.


Good thing you did an edit. Either way, strawman, Dann was talking about Lenscare $199 for After Effects...not photoshop.

http://forums.cgsociety.org/showpos...8&postcount=585

Last edited by eworc : 09 September 2010 at 05:28 PM. Reason: added link
 
  09 September 2010
Originally Posted by imashination: http://www.frischluft.com/order/index.php
Lenscare, photoshop, $89 dollars, current exchange rate = 59.

No need any comeback, youve said everything.

Doesn't exist for the Mac, so it's a no-go.

And it doesn't do too well behind some glass or in reflections, like any other post-DoF...
Same player, try again !

Sorry, i was just joking and pointing out that this kind of solution is far from ideal, but forgive me, i'm already out...


Cheers,
Laurent aka Tartiflette

Last edited by Tartiflette : 09 September 2010 at 05:30 PM.
 
  09 September 2010
Originally Posted by Tartiflette: Doesn't exist for the Mac, so it's a no-go.


Its ok, I sabotaged it and sent it back.
__________________
Matthew O'Neill
www.3dfluff.com
 
  09 September 2010
Way to go, congrats.
 
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