CGTalk > WIP > WIP/Critique: 2D
Login register
Thread Closed share thread « Previous Thread | Next Thread »
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 10-25-2012, 01:33 PM   #16
Lunatique
Pragmatic Dreamer
 
Lunatique's Avatar
CGTalk Forum Leader
portfolio
Robert Chang
Artist|Writer|Composer
Photographer|Director
Lincoln, USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 8,726

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZombieMariachis
Lunatiqu: I like showing people these two images from notable illustrators Rockwell and Elvgren. They convey the point perfectly!


I'm not sure if simply showing these examples help, because the real problem lies in the fact that inexperienced artists have this misinformed idea that they are supposed to be able to achieve that level of realism, naturalness, expressiveness, likeness, and accuracy by working solely out of their heads. At some point, they got brainwashed by the ignorant masses regurgitating the false notion that the only artistic integrity in existence is if you do everything out of your head, regardless of the level of realism you're trying to achieve. They don't know (because no one told them or taught them properly) that once an artist attempts past a specific level of realism and, they MUST use references (be it photos or observing real life such as plein air painting or using models), otherwise, you will hit a ceiling and cannot get beyond it, until you use references. This is true no matter how experience, advanced, or talented you are, but it is precisely this point they don't understand and get brainwashed on. These misinformed people go around deriding any artwork that looks like it used references, and they go and make personal attacks on artists who use references as part of their workflow.

That, is the real tragedy.
 
Old 10-26-2012, 01:05 AM   #17
ZombieMariachis
Frequenter
 
ZombieMariachis's Avatar
portfolio
Josh Hass
JoshHass.com
Owasso, USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2012
Posts: 161
"I'm not sure if simply showing these examples help, because the real problem lies in the fact that inexperienced artists have this misinformed idea that they are supposed to be able to achieve that level of realism, naturalness, expressiveness, likeness, and accuracy by working solely out of their heads."

Lol! That's precisely why I show people those images. It shows them that not even Rockwell could achieve those things without reference.
__________________
JoshHass.com
 
Old 10-26-2012, 02:14 AM   #18
vicmonty
jokey joke maker
 
vicmonty's Avatar
portfolio
Victor Montoyaamaya
X-ray tech
Norfolk, USA
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 358
Send a message via AIM to vicmonty Send a message via Yahoo to vicmonty
This is very helpful. Thank you for posting.
__________________
Love,
Monty

Anatomy SB
Tumblr
Deviant Art
 
Old 10-26-2012, 09:03 AM   #19
Lunatique
Pragmatic Dreamer
 
Lunatique's Avatar
CGTalk Forum Leader
portfolio
Robert Chang
Artist|Writer|Composer
Photographer|Director
Lincoln, USA
 
Join Date: Mar 2002
Posts: 8,726

Quote:
Originally Posted by ZombieMariachis
"I'm not sure if simply showing these examples help, because the real problem lies in the fact that inexperienced artists have this misinformed idea that they are supposed to be able to achieve that level of realism, naturalness, expressiveness, likeness, and accuracy by working solely out of their heads."

Lol! That's precisely why I show people those images. It shows them that not even Rockwell could achieve those things without reference.


The scary thing is, some of them are so misguided and so brainwashed, that they would actually lose respect for Rockwell and Elvgren because they used references. They are not experienced or wise enough to know where the threshold for a human being's ability to depict that level of realism begins and ends.
 
Old 10-26-2012, 01:17 PM   #20
vicmonty
jokey joke maker
 
vicmonty's Avatar
portfolio
Victor Montoyaamaya
X-ray tech
Norfolk, USA
 
Join Date: Jun 2006
Posts: 358
Send a message via AIM to vicmonty Send a message via Yahoo to vicmonty
As I beginner, I remember when I thought reference should be minimized if used at all. Then after reading about the process that other succesful artist use, I realized that they all include reference!

Funny because even when I speak to a non artitistic person, they somehow have a friend or a relative who can draw without any reference. This is after they've seen my anatomical studies and the reference photos. I smile. "yea they must be awesome".

That's what I love about this place.

Now to learn to use reference photos effectively in my work flow will be my next feat!
__________________
Love,
Monty

Anatomy SB
Tumblr
Deviant Art
 
Old 10-29-2012, 03:49 PM   #21
rownd
In a blanket fort
 
rownd's Avatar
portfolio
Jim Rownd
illustrator
Rochester, USA
 
Join Date: Sep 2006
Posts: 366
First rule I was taught was your only as good as your reference. This is why a lot of illustrators are pretty good photographers. This doesn't mean you should copy it. Rockwell and Elvgren are excellent examples of how to use reference. Also just because it's a photo doesn't make it right. Example: the artist doing the violinist. All that foreshortening... your asking for trouble.

little side note.
I watched this dvd on Frank Frazetta talking about how he doesn't use any reference. I think he was messing with the interviewer? Anatomy is just to complicated.


Also nice illustration! I liked the thumbnail that was more vertical. Sort of gave it this feeling of a grand kings thrown. I do understand you would have lost focus on what you wanted to achieve.
 
Old 10-29-2012, 03:49 PM   #22
CGTalk Moderation
Lord of the posts
CGTalk Forum Leader
 
Join Date: Sep 2003
Posts: 1,066,481
Thread automatically closed

This thread has been automatically closed as it remained inactive for 12 months. If you wish to continue the discussion, please create a new thread in the appropriate forum.
__________________
CGTalk Policy/Legalities
Note that as CGTalk Members, you agree to the terms and conditions of using this website.
 
Thread Closed share thread


Thread Tools Search this Thread
Search this Thread:

Advanced Search
Display Modes

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
CGSociety
Society of Digital Artists
www.cgsociety.org

Powered by vBulletin
Copyright 2000 - 2006,
Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Minimize Ads
Forum Jump
Miscellaneous

All times are GMT. The time now is 06:59 PM.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2016, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.