Tachyon Render - Realtime Renderer for C4D

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  03 March 2016
Originally Posted by rsquires: I think you have hit upon a very valid point. I do have Pixelberg and was excited about it, but it has laid dormant simply because rather than being an extension of C4D it does feel like you have to start from scratch texture wise. Here's where I would bring Substance Painter into the mix for texturing which is what I do now with Element 3D. I like Element because my workflow now incorporates this and I use textures in Element 3D having set up proxies or standins inside cinema prior to exporting my models. You can tell from the model used in the brief example of this new renderer that it's sort of what the workflow will have to be. A set of pre made materials then that work natively with it would be useful to get new users started. Also you have to take into account that C4D's material system is not designed for near realtime playback unless you bake your shaders into assets.



I too purchased Pixelberg...but haven't done anything more than knock around on it one afternoon.

Tachyon would need to have a feature a rich complement of materials right from the start...and the material system needs to be intuitive...or it will be running uphill to get out of the gate.

My hunch is that another compromise users would have to go without when using Tachyon will be parametric shaders like noise and gradient shaders.
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  03 March 2016
Originally Posted by IceCaveMan: My hunch is that another compromise users would have to go without when using Tachyon will be parametric shaders like noise and gradient shaders.


These are trade offs I'm OK with if I can leverage the speed to get more 3d work in my company. :-)
 
  03 March 2016
This is very good!
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  03 March 2016
Originally Posted by Blinny: I might be conflating some other component but isn't C4D's native viewport running on OpenGL? IOW, it's not fair to say all OGL engines are the same / have the same kinds of limitations?

While this is true, that C4D is ogl, you are may have missed my statement about pbr workflows.
If an engine follows a more or less standardized workflow you inherit the pros and cons of that workflow.
In the case of pbr viewports you must work with pbr materials, which include a special shader to properly read the materials.

While C4D has an ogl viewport it is not following this display method and does not have a shader to use the materials in such a workflow. This means you need to use a dedicated shader.

Just because ogl is used does not mean it is the same across the board, but if a specific workflow is used, then it is.
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  1 Week Ago
Found this old thread, thought I'd post an update I found on Vimeo.

Tachyon Render is now "U-Render". They have more demos up:

Area light shading:




Transparency
 
  1 Week Ago
Looking back through the thread, I saw questions about displacement. Looks like they will have that covered, too:


 
  1 Week Ago
Originally Posted by IceCaveMan: It's very important to understand what this product is trying to do...and what it isn't trying to do.

If you read the interview Martin Weber is quite clear about it. He's building a product for *speed*....for real-time or near real-time response.

Tachyon will hopefully rival next-gen game engines or Element 3D. He explicitly states that they are building the 'renderer' on OpenGL. He compares his ambitions to what can be done in Unreal 4. He never compares Tachyon to VRAY (he's a well-known c4d VRAY user, btw) or other elite 3rd party renderers.

That being the case we aren't talking pure 'rendering' as much as a displaying/presenting technology. There is no such thing in this world as multi-light bounce, and certainly not full global illumination.

He does tout 'global illumination' but you can be pretty certain it will be a single-light-bounce implementation where objects reflect an environmental HDRI object. Again...just compare it to Element 3D in this regard.

If you look closely when he brings up a Terminal window you'll see the command, "Print VRAM" That tells you a lot....it's not doing raytracing like we think about. It's relying on what you can get with OpenGL: shadows, shading, light reflections....maybe environmental reflections.

Just like Element3d you won't enjoy inter-object reflections. It's results are not far removed from what you are getting in the advanced viewports with Modo 901, Maya 2015 and in the latest iteration of 3DCoat.

I think it can be an exciting product--one that I'd be interested in purchasing. But let's not place it in the same conversation with Octane, Arnold, or VRAY. Except in limited cases, it won't be able to achieve that kind of high-end quality.

Also of note. At the end of the video he toggled on 'HQ' (a high quality setting). That increased the AA smoothing and appeared to add a glow post effect. With those effects enabled it was churning out 820x460 frames at 5 seconds each. (watch the video closely)

Look people. There is no such thing as a free lunch. There is no Santa Claus or Render Fairy. This is no monster product that will give us instant renders *and* feature elite quality. It doesn't exist.

But if they can really deliver, Tachyon might have a wonderful role in rapid client visualizations, story telling, conceptualizations, training animations. A clever 3d artists might be able to make a tv commercial--but that will be more the exception.
But being they are going the "deferred" rendering route, does that not suggest they can then do screen space tech like screen space reflections which gives you inter-object reflectivity?
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  1 Week Ago
Contacted them about it and they confirmed that screen space reflections are already implemented but working out some issues with it. Long story short at some point there will be inter-object reflectivity.
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  1 Week Ago
Wow this is looking like an impressive piece of kit. Thanks for posting those videos Chris.
 
  1 Week Ago
Looks very interesting, but they might be a little late...

With Maxon certainly pushing its viewport further (who knows what's R20 or 21 will look like. Blender's eevee is already very impressive), and AMD introducing real-time raytracing in ProRender, it will not leave a big gap for them.

If they based their renderer on OpenGL, that means they can't leverage DXR/RTX tech either and Nvidia's powerful hardware and denoisers.

I would totally have bought it when Element 3D V2 came out, as I was thrilled with the speed/quality tradeoff, but found the AE workflow cumbersome.

But now? By the time it's finished, I'm afraid we'll have quite a few alternatives on the horizon...
 
  1 Week Ago
Originally Posted by EricM: Looks very interesting, but they might be a little late...

But now? By the time it's finished, I'm afraid we'll have quite a few alternatives on the horizon...



Agreed. they really need to get a V1.0 out the door. Back when I saw what it could do, it impressed me, but it has been years now and their latest video shows area lights, so they have effectively gone from a position of having a great useful opengl renderer, to now having to play catch up with features that c4d's viewport has.
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  1 Week Ago
URender actually had a demo station in Maxon's booth at NAB this year.
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  23 Hours Ago
Really a great realtime renderer. It looks like it can compete with EEVEE without any problems. We will see.
I am curious if it will ever has a publish support to webGL ?
 
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