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Old 10-22-2012, 09:17 PM   #16
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in your oppinion as a consumer, yeah.
backseat driving is always a pain for the man behind the wheele.
thus must be ignored and classified as noise.

Last edited by gkmotu : 10-22-2012 at 09:20 PM.
 
Old 10-22-2012, 09:23 PM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gkmotu
in your oppinion as a consumer, yeah.
backseat driving is always a pain for the man behind the wheele.
thus must be ignored and classified as noise.


Or the engineering team ignoring the drivers feedback in a race.

anyway, moving on from this.
 
Old 10-23-2012, 10:53 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irwit
Hey man

My point wasn't saying it can only do uninteresting scenes, it was more trying to show something it can do that something else cant. Personally I like trying new renderers and I used to use FR a few years ago and liked some of the features. So if these videos were showing me something cool or different or even just a comparison speed test vs other renderers, I may be more inclined to try it out.
Hey man....that was the purpose of the videos. He puts them right under your nose and instead of watching them, still you complain.

Last edited by AbnRanger : 10-23-2012 at 11:01 AM.
 
Old 10-23-2012, 11:36 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AbnRanger
Hey man....that was the purpose of the videos. He puts them right under your nose and instead of watching them, still you complain.


Well as max user that uses 3rd party renderers, the very specific target market this renderer would be aimed at, this video has not enticed me to look any further into FR GPU. I'm dying to try out Arnold and Deep compositing because they have shown me videos that show something I cant currently do or something I can but better. This one hasn't, this is information that the company trying to sell a new renderer would want to know I think?

Surely the whole point of posting something like this is on a forum is for feedback?
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Old 10-23-2012, 02:47 PM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by irwit
Well as max user that uses 3rd party renderers, the very specific target market this renderer would be aimed at, this video has not enticed me to look any further into FR GPU. I'm dying to try out Arnold and Deep compositing because they have shown me videos that show something I cant currently do or something I can but better. This one hasn't, this is information that the company trying to sell a new renderer would want to know I think?

Surely the whole point of posting something like this is on a forum is for feedback?
You didn't listen (or watch the videos), did you? ALL the videos show not only the new renderer, but the DIFFERENCES.

VRay RT is nice, but it has some major limitations (that I always bump into). The main thing is that in order for it to be as stable as possible, it operates outside of 3ds Max. That means no chance for previewing post effects like Afterburn, FumeFX, or Pyrocluster. No SSS and many others. fR's IR (even on the current R3.5) is more internally integrated, and thus you can preview most anything. There is nothing else for Max that does that.

It also is part of the renderer...not a separate module, like RT. So what you see is indeed what you're going to get. Granted, the IR is still a bit buggy, but this R4 GPU looks very promising. Not only is the preview/IR GPU accelerated, but the renderer itself (actually a GPU/CPU hybrid). Much different than what you have in others.
 
Old 10-23-2012, 03:20 PM   #21
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AbnRanger
You didn't listen (or watch the videos), did you? ALL the videos show not only the new renderer, but the DIFFERENCES.

VRay RT is nice, but it has some major limitations (that I always bump into). The main thing is that in order for it to be as stable as possible, it operates outside of 3ds Max. That means no chance for previewing post effects like Afterburn, FumeFX, or Pyrocluster. No SSS and many others. fR's IR (even on the current R3.5) is more internally integrated, and thus you can preview most anything. There is nothing else for Max that does that.

It also is part of the renderer...not a separate module, like RT. So what you see is indeed what you're going to get. Granted, the IR is still a bit buggy, but this R4 GPU looks very promising. Not only is the preview/IR GPU accelerated, but the renderer itself (actually a GPU/CPU hybrid). Much different than what you have in others.


Ok, fair enough
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Old 10-23-2012, 03:37 PM   #22
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AbnRanger
You didn't listen (or watch the videos), did you? ALL the videos show not only the new renderer, but the DIFFERENCES.
Firstly, calm down - it's just some software.

Secondly, I've watched the video posted and can't see a single thing that distances it from the current competition. I'm not saying there aren't things in fR4 GPU that iray or V-ray RT can't do, but from the video posted (which we are discussing) it's not doing anything to separate itself from the real-time previews currently being used in production by Max users
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Old 10-23-2012, 03:40 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AJ
Firstly, calm down - it's just some software.

Secondly, I've watched the video posted and can't see a single thing that distances it from the current competition. I'm not saying there aren't things in fR4 GPU that iray or V-ray RT can't do, but from the video posted (which we are discussing) it's not doing anything to separate itself from the real-time previews currently being used in production by Max users
The capitalized words are for emphasis, not shouting.
 
Old 10-23-2012, 03:42 PM   #24
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double post...sorry.

Last edited by AbnRanger : 10-23-2012 at 04:10 PM.
 
Old 10-23-2012, 04:06 PM   #25
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Hey I didn't want to stir up so much fights about believing what is better or not. I showed several things you can not do in iRay IT JUST DOES NOT WORK what we can do right now (even with our prototype software).

I would like to add to this discussion that the single idea a renderer is better than the other and for that I will chose, is highly unrealistic. Many things have to bee seen on a larger scale. Lets take IES lights for example some renderers (you know which one) do not even support 3ds Max IES lights! They have their own IES lights - have you ever wondered why a developer chose to do so ?
The same is true for physical camera. Some developers chose to not make it a standard camera. Ever wondered why they did it ?
There is a reason behind every single bit of software feature out there - no one randomly codes stuff. There is purpose and a plan behind all of the things you see. The 2 simple examples shown above explain that as a developer you can choose not to be compatible with your target platform and introduce your independent and isolated tools in a software package (3ds Max).
Does this mean it is bad ? No - for sure not. It just means you have restrictions in using it (you can not use all materials and atmospheircs). As it seems many users do not care about this which is also totally fine.

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Old 10-23-2012, 04:09 PM   #26
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There is a major difference. With RT, I know from experience, you have at least a few seconds delay while it loads the scene. This one is instant...period. It's much faster overall, from what I can tell. And again, the major distinction is that it is tightly integrated, so that most anything you can render (including volumetric effects, post effects, SSS, etc) with finalRender or even Scanline....you can see near realtime previews. All shaders/materials. That's BIG. Why? Cause no other renderer, native or 3rd party offers that capability in 3ds Max.

What's more is you get a full-featured volumetric shading engine (comparable to Afterburn) included, along with fRScatter (similar to VRay Scatter), and an Ocean object and Material feature.

You currently have this Interactive Rendering in fR3.5, but it's not GPU accelerated, thus not as fast/instantaneous, and it is still a bit buggy (been told it is due to known Max limitations). If you have ever seen Ligthwave's VPR, and how well integrated it is....fR 3.5 is a good comparison. fR 4 looks so much faster. Preview and Rendering. I'm pretty stoked about it.
 
Old 10-23-2012, 04:25 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AbnRanger
You didn't listen (or watch the videos), did you? ALL the videos show not only the new renderer, but the DIFFERENCES.

VRay RT is nice, but it has some major limitations (that I always bump into). The main thing is that in order for it to be as stable as possible, it operates outside of 3ds Max. That means no chance for previewing post effects like Afterburn, FumeFX, or Pyrocluster. No SSS and many others. fR's IR (even on the current R3.5) is more internally integrated, and thus you can preview most anything. There is nothing else for Max that does that.

It also is part of the renderer...not a separate module, like RT. So what you see is indeed what you're going to get. Granted, the IR is still a bit buggy, but this R4 GPU looks very promising. Not only is the preview/IR GPU accelerated, but the renderer itself (actually a GPU/CPU hybrid). Much different than what you have in others.



Right, I've just re-watched the video in question and none of your points about being more integrated, closer to final render, etc are mentioned in that particular video, ie the one that this thread is talking about and the one I watched and made my points on. So a bit unfair to try and make out that I've not watched the video in question.

Cheers anyway for adding some info on why this renderer is different to Iray, RT, will be more inclined to keep an eye on progress
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Old 10-23-2012, 04:25 PM   #28
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