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Old 03 March 2014   #61
Originally Posted by branskyj: That was epic, mate. We can't stop laughing here in the office.
Have a great day.


LOL

The way I see it goes like this:

"No Skin Enhancement" BOOM

"No Unwrap Enhancement" BOOM

"No Morpher Enhancement" BOOM

And finally Moe stands up and say: "But now you have the Undo icon..." BOOM!

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Old 03 March 2014   #62
Smile

Originally Posted by Hooch: LOL

The way I see it goes like this:

"No Skin Enhancement" BOOM

"No Unwrap Enhancement" BOOM

"No Morpher Enhancement" BOOM

And finally Moe stands up and say: "But now you have the Undo icon..." BOOM!



...and Larry in the background is playing the world's smallest violin.
 
Old 03 March 2014   #63
Yesterday, if you were a Maya user and saw it's new feature list, you were feeling a little bit like this guy.....

 
Old 03 March 2014   #64
....and if you were a 3ds Max user, you're feeling more like this guy:

 
Old 03 March 2014   #65
Aw Snap! That gif is awesome
d@mn..I am peeing on myself now..... hahahahahahahahahah

The Lightwave user goes!
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Old 03 March 2014   #66
Hi Eddie

Originally Posted by EPerlberg: ...
Using the hashtag #maxmadness, twitter the software development steps you would recommend. Not features, thats what UserVoice is for. Im talking role reversal; you have the keys, steps you would take if you ran the candy store.
...


OK. This is your game and you made the rules. I'll play.

(I don't do Twitter, so I'll take the keys to the candy store and tell you what I'd do right here

1. Get rid of the 12 month development cycle and go back to 18 months - or better yet, 2 years. In fact, since I'm now dictator of the Candy Store, I'd dump the fixed cycle model and simply tell Max users "the next version will be done when it's done".

2. Of course, this is completely incompatible with the subscription model so that would be dumped too.

3. That means re-instatement of the price discounted upgrade-by-upgrade option. When you chopped this (or will chop it, come February 2015) it signalled a lack of faith in your own abilities to entice customers to pay for each upgrade based on the quality of the upgrade. Thus you must coerce customers into paying for upgrades under the threat of loss of rights to upgrade discounts. No one likes being coerced. The checks you receive each year from returning subscription customers are written grudgingly by people who feel strong-armed into purchasing something they don't feel is value for money. (You've made your own customers your adversaries, tsk tsk.)

4. Cut 3ds Max Design loose and make it its own package, with its own management, its own R & D goals, its own programming staff, its own budget, and its own revenue centre. That's right, it needs to be a software package in its own right - in fact, I'd rename it "AUTOviz" and cast it free to evolve wherever its market leads it. Why? Because that would make 3ds Max Original free to evolve where it needs to go, too. At the moment, Max Original's R & D direction is heavily weighted by a management that asks this question: "would this proposed new feature be useful to Arch Viz too?" If the answer is yes, then it's bumped up the list, if not, then the idea gets marked down. (In the last few years, I can only think of 2 VFX/Entertainment-exclusive features have made it over this hurdle: GPoly and Mass FX). Hence, even the few new tools that actually are useful to VFX/Entertainment (such as quad-chamfer, nested layers, States) are only there because they share a usefulness with the Arch Viz customer.

5. Publish a road map of future Max development. Yes, I know you're choking on your coffee and spluttering something about publicly held companies being held liable for misdirecting the market place, but that's only a danger if you actually mislead people. My solution: don't mislead people. Tell people what you're going to do, then do it.

TC
 
Old 03 March 2014   #67
Originally Posted by timothyc: OK. This is your game and you made the rules. I'll play.

(I don't do Twitter, so I'll take the keys to the candy store and tell you what I'd do right here

1. Get rid of the 12 month development cycle and go back to 18 months - or better yet, 2 years. In fact, since I'm now dictator of the Candy Store, I'd dump the fixed cycle model and simply tell Max users "the next version will be done when it's done".

2. Of course, this is completely incompatible with the subscription model so that would be dumped too.

3. That means re-instatement of the price discounted upgrade-by-upgrade option. When you chopped this (or will chop it, come February 2015) it signalled a lack of faith in your own abilities to entice customers to pay for each upgrade based on the quality of the upgrade. Thus you must coerce customers into paying for upgrades under the threat of loss of rights to upgrade discounts. No one likes being coerced. The checks you receive each year from returning subscription customers are written grudgingly by people who feel strong-armed into purchasing something they don't feel is value for money. (You've made your own customers your adversaries, tsk tsk.)

4. Cut 3ds Max Design loose and make it its own package, with its own management, its own R & D goals, its own programming staff, its own budget, and its own revenue centre. That's right, it needs to be a software package in its own right - in fact, I'd rename it "AUTOviz" and cast it free to evolve wherever its market leads it. Why? Because that would make 3ds Max Original free to evolve where it needs to go, too. At the moment, Max Original's R & D direction is heavily weighted by a management that asks this question: "would this proposed new feature be useful to Arch Viz too?" If the answer is yes, then it's bumped up the list, if not, then the idea gets marked down. (In the last few years, I can only think of 2 VFX/Entertainment-exclusive features have made it over this hurdle: GPoly and Mass FX). Hence, even the few new tools that actually are useful to VFX/Entertainment (such as quad-chamfer, nested layers, States) are only there because they share a usefulness with the Arch Viz customer.

5. Publish a road map of future Max development. Yes, I know you're choking on your coffee and spluttering something about publicly held companies being held liable for misdirecting the market place, but that's only a danger if you actually mislead people. My solution: don't mislead people. Tell people what you're going to do, then do it.

TC
Pretty solid points....but the talking heads above Eddie don't understand this. They mistakenly assume a big drop in sales = not forceful enough. Their numbers have been dropping every since they adopted these coercive practices and yet they are just that damn stupid to blame it all on.....TRANSITION. Transition to (high cost) rentals and subscription only, eh? Sure, Autodesk. that's the reason. It couldn't have anything to do with your giving the user shiite-sammiches for the past 3 or so years, now could it?
 
Old 03 March 2014   #68
6. re-write your documentation or at least re-organize it better. it's almost seems like it was made to be read from start to finish. it takes me awhile to find anything i search for. There also needs some serious work on the maxscript side. Maybe include a user uploaded bank of open source scripts, or open it up for people to write some tutorials.

(*note some of that might be in there already, but navigating it is kinda hard )
 
Old 03 March 2014   #69
Originally Posted by LegatoBluesummers: its pretty weird that the skin weighting tools are so hard to use. looking at bones pro, man you would think they could implement something like that a long time ago. my last character took me two days to weight, vertex by vertex. i've seen about 10 tutorials on it and read the documentation. its just clunky as hell.


It has'nt been touched since ages, thus it looks somehow hard to use ( which in reality it' isnt, it just misses some recent developments ). This is a blind spot in the whole Max development i surely don't understand. Morpher is the same story: Was great at it's time, but never got touched again. Almost like there's an order in place "Don't dare to step into character animation tools development, as that is Maya land ")
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Old 03 March 2014   #70
As far as upgrades go---just on the old subscription and upgrade pricing you would have to wait 3+ years to save money by upgrading. Most people are not going to wait that long between versions, especially if a release has something they want (*hint hint* Autodesk) Current pricing of subscription and upgrades would increase that to something like 5+ years. Of course in some cases you would wait to upgrade because of compatibility, but with good releases subscription makes sense.
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Old 03 March 2014   #71
Originally Posted by timothyc: 4. Cut 3ds Max Design loose and make it its own package, with its own management, its own R & D goals, its own programming staff, its own budget, and its own revenue centre. That's right, it needs to be a software package in its own right - in fact, I'd rename it "AUTOviz" and cast it free to evolve wherever its market leads it. Why? Because that would make 3ds Max Original free to evolve where it needs to go, too. At the moment, Max Original's R & D direction is heavily weighted by a management that asks this question: "would this proposed new feature be useful to Arch Viz too?" If the answer is yes, then it's bumped up the list, if not, then the idea gets marked down. (In the last few years, I can only think of 2 VFX/Entertainment-exclusive features have made it over this hurdle: GPoly and Mass FX). Hence, even the few new tools that actually are useful to VFX/Entertainment (such as quad-chamfer, nested layers, States) are only there because they share a usefulness with the Arch Viz customer.


This is glaringly obvious, and splitting Max/Max Design, at the time, was possibly one of the most idiotic, nonsensical 'business decisions' I have ever encountered. it made(makes) absolutely zero sense to ANY of the users. Sheer lunacy..... "You sir, may have the keys...."


Originally Posted by timothyc: 5. Publish a road map of future Max development. Yes, I know you're choking on your coffee and spluttering something about publicly held companies being held liable for misdirecting the market place, but that's only a danger if you actually mislead people. My solution: don't mislead people. Tell people what you're going to do, then do it.


NEVER going to happen. We got a bittersweet hint of it with the whole XBR carrott-on-a-stick bullshite, but apart from the yes-men, sweet nothings promises, we are met with smoke and mirrors.
No offence to Eddie Perlberg, he's reading from a script and is the latest scapegoat in the firing line since before Ken.

No amount of Adesk 'power-talk-business-speak' can ever amend for the fact that this release is piss poor, and more so in the face of the Maya release, and the SI axing.

I watched the Maya sneak peek videos and felt extremely queasy(and let's be honest, jealous.) I mean, the amount of strong features implemented this year, in comparison to Max is, frankly, an utter disgrace and a real slap in the face of long-term, loyal users of Max.
I have to say that this is the first time I have ever seriously considered migrating from Max since I began the love affair with R4. Aand if it wasn't for the wonderful 3rd-party developers and scripters in our community, I probably would have long ago.(that and the fact that only recently has Maya's interface and layout not made me want to put my head in a bucket and spill my innards)

Disgusted......

Last edited by musashidan : 03 March 2014 at 09:25 AM.
 
Old 03 March 2014   #72
Originally Posted by darthviper107: As far as upgrades go---just on the old subscription and upgrade pricing you would have to wait 3+ years to save money by upgrading. Most people are not going to wait that long between versions, especially if a release has something they want (*hint hint* Autodesk) Current pricing of subscription and upgrades would increase that to something like 5+ years. Of course in some cases you would wait to upgrade because of compatibility, but with good releases subscription makes sense.


considering those timespans, a jump from 3ds Max 2009 to 3ds Max 2014 would'nt have been a too bad thing IMHO. Completley doable...
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Old 03 March 2014   #73
Originally Posted by spacefrog: It has'nt been touched since ages, thus it looks somehow hard to use ( which in reality it' isnt, it just misses some recent developments ). This is a blind spot in the whole Max development i surely don't understand. Morpher is the same story: Was great at it's time, but never got touched again. Almost like there's an order in place "Don't dare to step into character animation tools development, as that is Maya land ")

That's a general "strategy" from AD: Buy something, put it in max and never touch it again...
 
Old 03 March 2014   #74
This version is fraud. I dont know the international laws, but in Germany, this business practice is prohibited.

So Kelly and Masterzap, for what takes their money? Why is there no power of you.
What is better in mental ray? Bug Fix, Update, new Options? Nothing, absolutly nothing, only iray with Render Elements, thats all. And you will take money? For what? For looking in the Air, jumping in the pool or dancing in the rain. I wait of 3dsmax2016, 3dsmax2015 is a fraud.
 
Old 03 March 2014   #75
Originally Posted by thorsten hartmann: What is better in mental ray? Bug Fix, Update, new Options? Nothing, absolutly nothing, only iray with Render Elements, thats all. And you will take money? For what? For looking in the Air, jumping in the pool or dancing in the rain. I wait of 3dsmax2016, 3dsmax2015 is a fraud.


Don't forget MR now plays nice with activeshade.....years after Modo has had a brilliant IR, fully integrated.

Why do you suppose Vray is so popular with MR being essentially free?

The usual Adesk, spoilt child approach: buy the shiniest toys, throw them in a corner and don't play with them again..........and don't let anyone else play with them either.
 
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