Which New iMac Pro Do I Get?

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  12 December 2017
Originally Posted by Blinny: OK..... and what was your experience when there were no eGPUs attached and you were running very heavy scenes? Were you still unable to slow the viewport down, no matter how you attempted to interact with it or change settings? 

im not sure what you mean. by "viewport", do you mean opengl, or prorender?
 
  12 December 2017
Originally Posted by theglenster: err its a HUGE selling point.

it seems that everyone but you is concerned about the noise a workstation makes. litterally every single jounalist i spoke to wanted to know about the noise, everyone i work with wants to know about the noise and people here are asking about the noise. even apple themselves wanted to see me put the imac pro under stress to see what it sounds like.
and yes in fact i DO sleep next to my workstation at home because i live in the middle of frankfurt where the rents are INSANE. so yeah, noise IS a make or break issure for many people. and even when working in an office and the machine next to you sounds like a 747 reading for take off is going to drive everyone single person in that office crazy!

Noise is indeed a huge factor. The stress caused by a loud workstation should not be underestimated. I ordered a thread-ripper, with water-cooling(just have to go pick it up now). I have no idea if it will be silent or not. if it is not, it will be disaster. I hope that it is as silent, but I have no idea yet.  My soon to be retired pc workstation, is pretty much silent, and that is how i like it.  I also have  a mac pro trashcan, and some fairly recent imacs, all of which are virtually silent, until they get asked to do something. In that respect, my experience is that a mac can be quite loud, if you ask it to do something stressful. A pc can be loud for sure, but at least you have choices, in terms of performance, housing, and cooling.
 
  12 December 2017
It'll be interesting to see how it holds up to multi-hour renders on the long term.
 
  12 December 2017
Originally Posted by theglenster: im not sure what you mean. by "viewport", do you mean opengl, or prorender?

Both / whatever you were testing and trying to "pressure test" as it were. My question boils down to, did the excellent performance you saw with very complex scenes (including interacting with said scenes) require one or more eGPUs to be connected? Based on additional stuff I've read today I'm guessing the answer is "yes," that the whole point of your testing was related to the new eGPU support more than the iMac itself.
 
  12 December 2017
Interesting to ponder what a well equipped iMac Pro would cost when you stack in the cost of system and extra options...then also factor in an expansion chassis and external GPU
 
  12 December 2017
Originally Posted by Blinny: Both / whatever you were testing and trying to "pressure test" as it were. My question boils down to, did the excellent performance you saw with very complex scenes (including interacting with said scenes) require one or more eGPUs to be connected? Based on additional stuff I've read today I'm guessing the answer is "yes," that the whole point of your testing was related to the new eGPU support more than the iMac itself.

the imac pro was definetly the center of the show and the eGPU stuff was intended to show that the imac pros GPU rendering capability can be expanded. using the eGPU does not mean you can render more data, it means that you can render the data that fits on one card quicker. the scaling was an almost very impressive linear. meaning if the imac pro with no eGPU took 5 mins to render something with prorender then pluging in a eGPU mean the render time will half. the only speed up you will see in the viewport is when using prorender and pluging in more and more eGPUs. 
its a very easy way of throwing render power at a scene as and when is needed. 
with this new imac pro sat on your desk and 4 eGPUs stacked up next to it you have a VERY powerfull workstation, and it looks pretty cool too
 
  12 December 2017
Originally Posted by theglenster: that would be myself and a collegue  it was a closed door private press event for 15 of the nets biggest influencial tech sites, and buzzfeed.




where did you hear this? i was one of the first people on the planet to play with this machine, and trust me, this is a VERY quiet machine. 

i spent 1.5 days demoing c4d on the 10core 64 vega imac pro in new york for the press event your reading about. i tried litterally everything to get the cooling for the GPU and CPU going but could not. nothing. not a peep. using prorender i rendered a piece of cad data with 10 millions polys and 6 thousand objects in the viewport and with plenty of interactive navigation and the only sound came from the eGPUs. even a scene using evey possible PBR effact would not make a sound.

the number one topic of conversation between myself and the journolist present was noise. and we heard nothing.

i can honestly say, as a windows user who thinks macs are a waste of time for 3d work, this machine has changed my mind.
the new imac pro IS a 3d workstaion and will make alot of people very happy.

and if this is what apple can do to an imac, its not hard to imagine what the new mac pro will be like. 
That is excellent info. I am hanging out for the new Mac Pro
 
  12 December 2017
Hey Glen… you obviously have some good experience in this and you mentioned a hypothetical 4x eGPU setup on the iMac Pro… I'm wondering if such a setup would currently be possible on these new iMacs, and if so what external boxes would one require?

Ta!
 
  12 December 2017
Originally Posted by IceCaveMan: Intel Xeon's have not improved much in performance over the past five years. 12 of the old cores will be comparable to the 8 cores in the new iMacPro for rendering. Though viewport speed would be 30% faster in R19 with an IMacPro...I think that could change in R20 as we may see multi-threaded viewport. If that happens viewport performance won't be a major consideration.

As for GPU - the more important component - IMO, a new top of the line Nvidia GPU will best what is in the new iMacPro. The MacOS supports Nvidia drivers for the latest 1080, 1080TI, etc. You also have PCI slots left over for 1 or 2 smaller cards. (Probably just one if you put a big card in.)

I have two big PC here but also my old MacPro. I'll test a 1080 inside the MacPro and report back my findings.

Note: Redshift and Octane currently require Nvidia.
I have this setup now.  I still have my original 2009 MacPro, updated the firmware to a 2010, upgraded the CPUs from 8-core 2.26 to 12-core 3.46, and installed a 1080ti.  It works perfectly.  The 2009 (before I upgraded the RAM to 1333) has a GeekBench CPU score of 2,977 single and 24,462 multi.  The GPU CUDA test came in at 247,943.  This compares to my 2013 6-core MacPro CPU scores of 3,758 single and 17,724 multicore (obviously no CUDA score.)

This will hold me over until the new MacPro comes out.  I assume that I will be able to run NVidia cards in it without hooking them up externally.  I am not a fan of hooking things up externally since this has not been a good experience with my 2013 MacPro.  Half my desk is covered with external drives, and too many unnecessary power cords under my desk.  The old 2009 MacPro has all my drives internally, with just one power cord!

Mark
 
  12 December 2017
Is the 1080Ti running on internal power only? Also, what OS are you on? I'm on a GTX980Ti and wondering if that might be a nice little interim upgrade.
 
  12 December 2017
Originally Posted by Darth Mole: Is the 1080Ti running on internal power only? Also, what OS are you on? I'm on a GTX980Ti and wondering if that might be a nice little interim upgrade.
Yes, I am running it on the internal power.  I thought about tapping power from the SATA power, but this worked.  It does have both a 6-pin AND 8-pin power connectors, but a quick search on Amazon found the correct 8-pin cable.  I replaced a 970 which just had two six pins.

Upgrading from the 970 doubled the speed, plus gives me 11GB of RAM.  If I remember, I think the 1080ti draws the same power as your 980ti.

My OS is 10.13.1 and will be updating to 10.13.2 tomorrow night once I finish a project.  Getting 10.13 on a 2009 was made possible by updating the firmware from 4.1 to 5.1 with a simple program.

Mark
 
  12 December 2017
Originally Posted by Benek: Hey Glen… you obviously have some good experience in this and you mentioned a hypothetical 4x eGPU setup on the iMac Pro… I'm wondering if such a setup would currently be possible on these new iMacs, and if so what external boxes would one require?

Ta!

i know for a fact two eGPUs rendering at the same time is possible is because ive seen it with my own eyes. like you say, im saying 4 is hypothetical, please dont take my word for it, as ive not yet seen it butalso have not heard of anything stopping it. 
any eGPU box compatible with apple would work. 
 
  12 December 2017
Thanks Glen… For me personally, knowing that I could attach a couple of eGPUs to the iMac Pro now makes it a serious option for my overdue upgrade.
 
  12 December 2017
Originally Posted by IceCaveMan: If someone wants to stay Mac and is interested in...
-The best performance
-The most flexibility
-The greatest convenience
-Sublime value

Here's what to do...

Buy the old cheese-grater MacPro. Used. You heard me right. Please follow the logic.

-You can run 12-core, 24-thread MacPro and have slots to play with. CPU speed 3,200 GHz
-Put a Nvidia Titan or 1080TI inside and a second nice GPU to drive your monitors
-Add a $50 USB III card
-Load RAM
-Buy TWO Premium 30-40" monitors
-Invest in Redshift or Octane

Such a machine will rival the 8-Core iMac Pro in CPU performance and ***beat** it in GPU performance--and you will have Nvidia CUDA, which is critical for most GPU-based 3d renderers (Octane, RedShift). You'll have double the screen real estate with the flexibility of moving the monitors around or pairing them w/different computers down the road. You can even replace or migrate your GPU investments.

Those were the last real Pro machines and they are TANKS. They work and work and reliably work some more.

But I know. Not as sexy as a new Apple.

I'm actually in the process of doing this upgrade. My current Mac Pro is a 2009 4, 1 model, 2x2.26 Quad core, 16GB Ram, stock 512mb video card. Upgrading to 3.46GHz 12 Core X5690, 64Gb Ram,  Nvidia GTX 1080i, USB 3.0 PCI card. I already have my boot system on a 1TB PCI SSD.

Will post my thoughts and any benchmarks in the new year if anyone would like to know more about the upgrade and C4D performance.
 
  12 December 2017
Originally Posted by vel0city: I'm actually in the process of doing this upgrade. My current Mac Pro is a 2009 4, 1 model, 2x2.26 Quad core, 16GB Ram, stock 512mb video card. Upgrading to 3.46GHz 12 Core X5690, 64Gb Ram,  Nvidia GTX 1080i, USB 3.0 PCI card. I already have my boot system on a 1TB PCI SSD.

Will post my thoughts and any benchmarks in the new year if anyone would like to know more about the upgrade and C4D performance.
I did the same thing to my 2009 about a month ago.  You will be very happy with the performance.  Make sure you upgrade the firmware to 5.1 FIRST before you add the new processors.  Are your new processors delidded? Mine were not and used some brass washers to raise the heat sinks.  But you have to be VERY careful tightening them on.  Let me know if you need any help, was not very difficult.  Once upgraded, you can install High Sierra and run the Pascal cards.  I installed a 1080ti as well.

Mark
 
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