Hierarchy display in Timeline begone..

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Old 07 July 2013   #16
Howdy,
Originally Posted by LucentDreams: ...Preferences are always a hard one in terms of whether they are stored with the project or the user...

A "Use My Defaults" checkbox in the preferences sure would be a nice option for passing files back and forth.

Adios,
Cactus Dan
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Old 07 July 2013   #17
I'm not a Maya user but personally I think C4D has a very functional timeline. It's one area where a lot of thought went into it and it was revised several times across updates. Always room for improvement, of course....
 
Old 07 July 2013   #18
Originally Posted by LucentDreams: The day that you can modify tangents without selecting the key first in Maya, come talk to me about which one requires more clicks.


The Moved Nearest Picked Keys tool can do this, since at least Maya 2011 (possibly it's older that that, I don't know). Ok, you have to select all the keys first by dragging around them but then you can move from key to key and tweak the tangents of each one with just one MMB click each time. In C4D it always takes two clicks, one to select the key so that the tangents are visible and one to click-drag move that tangent. If you select a bunch of keys then you can't adjust the tangets individually. So for me this is actually another example of where C4D needs more clicks..

Cheers,
Brian
 
Old 07 July 2013   #19
Originally Posted by AdamT: I'm not a Maya user but personally I think C4D has a very functional timeline. It's one area where a lot of thought went into it and it was revised several times across updates. Always room for improvement, of course....


I would agree when it comes to the Key Editor, I find it better than the Dopesheet in Maya in a lot of ways. The FCurve editor not so much though. Maybe it is familiarity as others have suggested here, but I did start in C4D first before I ever tried animating in Maya so I do think I have a reasonably balanced view. For me Mayas Curve tools are a lot deeper and more flexible. Autotangents work properly, I can scale curves interactively with the scale tool, we have non-weighted tangents (none in C4D), more snapping options, ability to filter individual tracks (say for example all the Rot X curves for all selected objects), normalized curve display etc etc..

I could go on and give a long list of individual features I think work better (or don't even exist in C4Ds Curve editor) but that's getting off my original point -which was that I'd really like a way to disable Hierarchy display of keys in the editor all the time, even with Auto mode on.

Cheers,
Brian

Last edited by Horganovski : 07 July 2013 at 05:06 PM.
 
Old 07 July 2013   #20
Originally Posted by Horganovski: In C4D it always takes two clicks, one to select the key so that the tangents are visible and one to click-drag move that tangent. If you select a bunch of keys then you can't adjust the tangets individually. So for me this is actually another example of where C4D needs more clicks..

Use the "F-Curves>show all tangents" toggle for this, and poof, no more keyframe selection needed
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Old 07 July 2013   #21
Originally Posted by fluffouille: Use the "F-Curves>show all tangents" toggle for this, and poof, no more keyframe selection needed


Cool! That then works pretty much the same as Move Nearest Keys tool then (apart from making the initial selection). Hey this thread is turning out to be pretty educational.

Cheers,
Brian
 
Old 07 July 2013   #22
Yea, i'm glad you started this thread. We're about to start animating a couple of character projects and of the 4 animators only 2 know C4D and the other 2 are Maya people and i need to make it as painless as possible.

A simple little thing like not to see the position and rotation folders in the timeline is hidden under preferences is a little crazy. i really would have thought that it would be under view and like hide folder layer or something not Show Vector Track. But at least now i know!

And hopefully we won't run into too much problems not having a Euler Filter command in C4D. i know it help save me hours of work in Maya once i got out of stepped mode. We'll see how it goes over the next couple of months. And for me i know i will miss an AutoTangent script or plugin using C4D. And Brian i want to says thanks for the scripts that you have written to help with characters in C4D.

So if there are any other cool links,script or videos that people have to help maya people transition into the c4d timeline/graph area, please post them.
 
Old 07 July 2013   #23
Originally Posted by smuzzler: And hopefully we won't run into too much problems not having a Euler Filter command in C4D.


I know a Euler filter is nice and all and I would love to have it, but it takes one key to fix Euler flips. You simply copy your "flipped" key to be the frame after your last key, and then do an inbetween for it. Then the interpolation from this in between and the next key will be clean.

Yes, it'd be nice to have, but it's not that hard to get around it.
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Old 07 July 2013   #24
Originally Posted by Horganovski: The Moved Nearest Picked Keys tool can do this, since at least Maya 2011 (possibly it's older that that, I don't know). Ok, you have to select all the keys first by dragging around them but then you can move from key to key and tweak the tangents of each one with just one MMB click each time. In C4D it always takes two clicks, one to select the key so that the tangents are visible and one to click-drag move that tangent. If you select a bunch of keys then you can't adjust the tangents individually. So for me this is actually another example of where C4D needs more clicks..

Cheers,
Brian


err you need to select your key to see its tangent? Sounds like your using a weird pref on, sadly I don;t have c4d gere to check what that pref would be right now.

Why go from moving individual keys to selecting all to use a special tool to move a tangent without selecting the tangent? I can move a key and then adjust a tangent on another key without ever having to explicitly select.

I do agree about multi select moving all tangents being a little dumb. It's pretty rare you want that. That said you also don't select multiple keys as much because you don't have Maya's work around that you just mentioned



edit:and apparently I need to read the rest of the thread before commenting as sebastian clearly answered the pref thing. I'll go back to my corner now.
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Old 07 July 2013   #25
Originally Posted by xfon5168: I know a Euler filter is nice and all and I would love to have it, but it takes one key to fix Euler flips. You simply copy your "flipped" key to be the frame after your last key, and then do an inbetween for it. Then the interpolation from this in between and the next key will be clean.

Yes, it'd be nice to have, but it's not that hard to get around it.

Er.. I'm confused. Would you mind posting a screen cap of the process? I'm interested in your solution.
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Old 07 July 2013   #26
Originally Posted by fluffouille: Er.. I'm confused. Would you mind posting a screen cap of the process? I'm interested in your solution.


It's not anything elegant or magnificent.

The idea is you have 2 keyframes and there's a flip in there somewhere. So Key A and Key B.

You have two routes you can take. You can take Key B, copy it to the frame after Key A(let's call this Breakdown A), and then adjust your coords to resemble what the next frame of the breakdown will be. However, having used Key B as a starting point, and not rotating in all 3 axes in the 3D Viewport(sort of the root of the problem often), you will have a clean, no flipping interpolation from Key A, to Breakdown A, to Key B.

You can do it the opposite and copy A over to B etc. etc, if you gotta work backwards.

Like I said, I would like a Euler filter, I would totally support it, but it's not terribly hard to fix. It's not elegant to fix either.
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Old 07 July 2013   #27
Ah I see. That's what I'm actually doing as well, thanks for the clarification!
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Old 07 July 2013   #28
I literally take doodle, draw over the item (95% of the time it's hands) on the frame b where it ends after the flip, and then similar to bret, copy a onto b, and then match it to my drawing.

Been meaning to try it out, but in theory the ghosting cache feature might allow you to actually store an image of the pose. Basically set ghosting to object mode, frames before and after to 0, the turn on use keys, run calculate cache, and then you should be able to replace a key with a prior and still see the wireframe mesh of the pose you want to match too. Need to find time to try it.
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Old 07 July 2013   #29
Originally Posted by LucentDreams: Been meaning to try it out, but in theory the ghosting cache feature might allow you to actually store an image of the pose.
Works like a charm ...but it's still easier to stick to the pivot handles for rotation so the problem doesn't occur.
 
Old 07 July 2013   #30
Originally Posted by bunk: Works like a charm ...but it's still easier to stick to the pivot handles for rotation so the problem doesn't occur.


Occurs less often, it still can certainly occur as that's the only way I ever rotate I never freely rotate.
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