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Old 05-20-2013, 03:27 PM   #31
AntimatterVFX
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Simon Wicker
i know, how about i mention the four years i worked at ILM and you can come back with 'what were you, the janitor?'



Your job end up in China? Great time to be in VFX eh?
 
Old 05-20-2013, 03:38 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by AntimatterVFX
Your job end up in China? Great time to be in VFX eh?


dude, seriously, when are we going to see you on 'Britain's got Talent'? you shouldn't keep comedy gold like this to yourself. you are on fire today.

that'll teach me to try and get one up on you! i'll bow out now before you razzle dazzle me with more of your hum dinger zingers. i mean i feel like i'm 2 inches tall right now!

cheers, simon w.
 
Old 05-20-2013, 04:44 PM   #33
keremgo3d
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Thank you all for your time and some GREAT insights and opinions! It's really a useful topic for me!

My work was mostly digital painting, 3D scenery for music videos and album cover illustrations. Here is my portfolio: http://keremgogus.daportfolio.com/ majority and best of my work done with Cinema 4D and Vue. Future projects may require digital painting on multiple cards/layers and animate them After FX. I've made a simple demoreel just to show my work and practice that method at the end of 2010 - http://vimeo.com/15135375 -

However recently I interested more on 3d modeling side (vehicles, environments and most importantly characters). And some of you said 3ds max is for modeling mostly... I've worked with 3ds max for a while and it really has robust modeling tools and same for the C4D of course but max seems like a bit better on this and it has some of new tools added with that ribbon thing...

Maybe its just me because had chance to use max 2012 while I still have R13. I've seen some great sculpting tools on R14 - even just this exciting to do sculpting without leaving the C4D.

I'll jump to the Zbrush because when we mention sculpting it seems like the best solution so far. I have Zbrush also and some tutorials for it, just waiting on the side. Because I believe first I must learn to do all kinds of modeling work with Polygon Modeling tools before start sculpting. And sculpting obviously requires retopology which I don't know much about.

I think learning and using 3ds max wouldn't hurt, even though I feel sad while working with 3ds max instead of C4D ... I understand some of you switched to other software from C4D or maybe back to C4D from other software. So your experiences are important! Again thanks for sharing and more are welcome!
 
Old 05-20-2013, 05:07 PM   #34
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keremgo3d
I'll jump to the Zbrush because when we mention sculpting it seems like the best solution so far.


No chance of a balanced opinion for me on this - for sculpting ZBrush rules all, arguments against this are futile For me it's the closest thing to sketching on a piece of paper in terms of freedom, no other 3d app gives me that feeling. Plus Rick Baker uses ZBrush, nuff said!

Quote:
I feel sad while working with 3ds max instead of C4D

Well don't use Max then! Unless you absolutely have to for a job you should use what you enjoy, because if you want to be good at what you do you have to put a lot of time in. The more enjoyable you can make that time the better quality of life you'll have. And life is very short.

Cheers,
Brian
 
Old 05-20-2013, 06:02 PM   #35
keremgo3d
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Originally Posted by Horganovski
Well don't use Max then! Unless you absolutely have to for a job you should use what you enjoy, because if you want to be good at what you do you have to put a lot of time in. The more enjoyable you can make that time the better quality of life you'll have. And life is very short.


I just LOVE that approach and its really true! Many thanks for your input Brian!
 
Old 05-20-2013, 06:24 PM   #36
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All I know is Cinema has been letting me down in every single one of my last several projects. I do push it quite a bit but I'm only doing motion graphics/broadcast stuff most of the time. Complex scenes that slow to a crawl, simple scenes that slow to a crawl, Viewport issues (slow, footage in textures not showing the current frame, etc.), NET render issues, animation curves issues, lack of separate temporal and spatial interpolation, GI issues, several interface issues that affect productivity (like timeline/curves settings not sticking from one operation to the next, or scroll position jumping to the top of a multishader long list of textures instead of staying around the position of the texture I'm editing, etc.)

I could really write all afternoon about the various issues in C4D affecting my workflow and productivity on a daily basis. I love C4D but more than at any time in the past I'd wish I knew how to animate and texture in Maya instead. I would be using Cinema for Mograph stuff only.

In short, I don't feel like I'm using the best tool in the market to do my job at the moment. I really wish Maxon can address performance and productivity issues sooner than later. I doubt I'm the only one in this position and I'd hate to see them go down.
 
Old 05-20-2013, 06:30 PM   #37
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@AntimatterVFX

I can't disclose any information regarding development since I am not a beta tester anymore and work for MAXON now
While I was just in beta team, I could have maybe afford a heavily shrouded hint few days before release, but now now.
What I can do, is express my enthusiasm about future of Cinema 4D and upcoming release, and am willing to stake my reputation that people will be very, very happy with R15

Cheers
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Old 05-20-2013, 08:01 PM   #38
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hsrdelic
am willing to stake my reputation that people will be very, very happy with R15


Remember that you are dealing with people here who generally have big imaginations, so I'd keep in mind that it's better to 'under promise and over deliver' rather than the opposite (which generally drives people nuts and makes them lose faith in you).

For me to be 'very very happy' with R15 it would need to have :

Massive scene performance improvement, character rigs, mograph, particles etc all several times faster. Everyone wins.
Some kind of nodal system for textures. No more copying/pasting channels ever, that workflow stinks.
Completely redone UV tools.
A render layers system.
Improved timeline tools, including basic stuff like a Euler filter command, non weighted tangents, working auto tangents.
Bodypaint mostly scrapped and replaced with a modern painting system that includes symmetrical painting, much better response and preview in the viewport.
Viewport improvements a la Viewport 2.0 in Maya, Cinemas viewport feels really dated these days.
New cloth system with full multithreading and features that finally catch up with nCloth, bidirectional interaction with the Hair dynamics system.

I could go on.. but I guess those would be a good start
Just to add, I'm not in the 'I'm jumping ship if xx isn't done' camp, and I'm pretty sure I'll upgrade to R15 (mainly to stay compatible with my clients to be honest) but I'm not expecting any radical changes to any of the apps I own. Happy to be proved wrong of course


Cheers,
Brian

Last edited by Horganovski : 05-20-2013 at 08:14 PM.
 
Old 05-20-2013, 09:09 PM   #39
Neil V
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I'm willing to bet my mortgage that none of these features you have listed will be addressed for R15.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Horganovski
Massive scene performance improvement, character rigs, mograph, particles etc all several times faster. Everyone wins.
Some kind of nodal system for textures. No more copying/pasting channels ever, that workflow stinks.
Completely redone UV tools.
A render layers system.
Improved timeline tools, including basic stuff like a Euler filter command, non weighted tangents, working auto tangents.
Bodypaint mostly scrapped and replaced with a modern painting system that includes symmetrical painting, much better response and preview in the viewport.
Viewport improvements a la Viewport 2.0 in Maya, Cinemas viewport feels really dated these days.
New cloth system with full multithreading and features that finally catch up with nCloth, bidirectional interaction with the Hair dynamics system.
 
Old 05-20-2013, 09:39 PM   #40
keremgo3d
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Horganovski
Some kind of nodal system for textures. No more copying/pasting channels ever, that workflow stinks.


Wow! I realize how simple minded I am right now. While working with Maya, I always thought how material editor of C4D is simple with all that copy/paste and "layering" functionality. Struggled with Hypershade's nodal system (if its a nodal system ) most of the time, until I learned to keep it simple.

Slate material editor of new 3ds max looks really cool but not fully experienced it yet.

Quote:
Originally Posted by Horganovski
Completely redone UV tools.


When it comes to UVs on C4D - I was praying to have Maya's UV editor instead of it!
 
Old 05-20-2013, 10:02 PM   #41
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This made me chuckle. "In order to make me happy, Maxon *only* has to do this list of improvements in the next version"

A little off topic, but it reminded me of this "modest proposal"
Everything Apple Needs to Introduce at WWDC to Appease the Internet
__________________
----end of line
 
Old 05-20-2013, 10:24 PM   #42
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Well, for me there are different levels of 'happy'

For me happy is 'hey that's a nice new feature/annoying bug fixed', so in those terms R15 is quite likely to make me 'happy' I guess.

But 'very,very happy' suggests to me that I'll be skipping through a field with joy wearing bunny slippers, and for that to happen it has to be my list above, or nothing
http://walk-cycle-depot.blogspot.ie...-by-h-rosa.html

Cheers,
Brian

Last edited by Horganovski : 05-20-2013 at 10:43 PM.
 
Old 05-20-2013, 10:28 PM   #43
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Quote:
Originally Posted by keremgo3d
While working with Maya, I always thought how material editor of C4D is simple with all that copy/paste and "layering" functionality. Struggled with Hypershade's nodal system (if its a nodal system ) most of the time, until I learned to keep it simple.


Mayas materials are nodal (the whole program is, every object you interact with is a node, a poly object for example consists of a transform node and a shape node). Yes I agree that layered textures are a bit of a PITA in Maya, but once you set stuff up it's so much easier to change things than it is in Cinema. The client tells you 'hey we changed the textures', you go fine, just select the file nodes, set their path to the new textures, everything is updated in one go, it doesn't matter if those textures were driving colors, bumps, displacements etc, you never have to go and find each of those and update them.

Cheers,
Brian

Last edited by Horganovski : 05-20-2013 at 10:44 PM.
 
Old 05-21-2013, 12:06 AM   #44
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I'd really like to see everything be multithreaded, as it benefits every single C4D user - allowing us all to work faster.
 
Old 05-21-2013, 01:31 AM   #45
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Absolutely, all joking aside, that's the one feature I really want in Cinema - just make it faster. I don't know if multithreading is the answer or changing how it handles objects in some other way but if it was generally quicker at handling lots of objects, no matter what kind they are, it would make a huge difference to every C4D user.

Cheers,
Brian
 
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