Something wrong..

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  07 July 2012
Something wrong..

Please tear this apart, it is a preview and not final, but still something about the whole thing is wrong and i can't work out what it is..

Is it lack of detail?
colour?
something else?
What would you change or do differently? I'm pretty much stuck with the models there as they are what the plan calls for.
Also this one has to be midday.

Edited (very quickly and crudely)


Unedited

I've had no training at all in art or post pro, but I've seen some images where the raw render from the 3d package looks flat and boring, but after editing it looks perfect, is there anywhere i can find out techniques for that?
i.e this:
https://vimeo.com/8217700

What's best to do in post and what's best to do in the 3d package?

modelled in blender, rendered in cycles (preview)

Thanks
 
  08 August 2012
Update, i'm a bit happier with this one although it still needs a lot of critique and work

early morning
 
  08 August 2012
I feel the biggest thing is just that is has a very uninteresting composition. It is very busy with the leaves and shrubs. and Their is no anchor point to for my eyes to settle on or any direction for my eyes to go. Just a wall of leaves and bricks.

I would say look online for rules of composition
Here is a site that really helped me http://www.colorpilot.com/comp_rules.html


Also you can create "high energy" action with just the the objects you have now with the appropriate lighting. The hint here is that angles are more dynamic than horizontal lines.
 
  08 August 2012
One other thing stands out to me and that is a lack of variation in the colour of the foliage, look at a hedge or bush and even though it is all green there is a multitude of slight differences in the colour of the leaves.
 
  08 August 2012
The top edited version looks best to me. Something about that square bush/hedge to the right of the foreground just looks odd. Maybe if you edit it so the texture doesn't look mirrored, it might help.
 
  08 August 2012
I've always been a fan of natural elements in art works. Some advice that I was once given is:
In photography, we aim to capture the perfect subject, but in cg, we aim to recreate that effect with imperfection.

I think it will help if you deliberately modeled parts of the scene to look different - varying heights of the bush, different colour, specie, arrangement of trees, and also a better ground texture.. Atm the ground texture seems a bit small, and facing a bland direction that almost makes it look like a flat grey colour.

The brightness of the lamps seem a bit too stark and clear, perhaps tune them down a bit, but make them affect the environment a bit more. Try to illuminate it's surrounding area to have that warm light.

Variance in the general lighting would also help. E.g. one side of the trees is barely lit, whilst the other is vibrant.
 
  08 August 2012
Do you have ambient oclussion (AO). The original pictures looks a little flat, which could explainif you do not have AO.

Also the low quality of the main tree is a dead giveaway. The tree texture are pretty low res.

The legs of the benches also give away that the grass patch is a flat plane. You could try adding some 3D grasses near the bench legs.
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  08 August 2012
Thanks very much for the feedback



Quote: I feel the biggest thing is just that is has a very uninteresting composition. It is very busy with the leaves and shrubs. and Their is no anchor point to for my eyes to settle on or any direction for my eyes to go. Just a wall of leaves and bricks.


Thanks for the link, I've moved the camera a bit now to try and make it a bit more interesting,

Quote: One other thing stands out to me and that is a lack of variation in the colour of the foliage, look at a hedge or bush and even though it is all green there is a multitude of slight differences in the colour of the leaves.


Thanks for the feedback, I've modeled some better leaves to put on top of the existing ones.

Quote: The top edited version looks best to me. Something about that square bush/hedge to the right of the foreground just looks odd. Maybe if you edit it so the texture doesn't look mirrored, it might help.


Yeah i originally just had 3 different blocks of hedge mesh which i used instances of to try to keep memory use low enough to have it fit onto my graphics card, I've put a particle system over the top now with a bigger variety of leaf, so hopefully it'll not be noticeable now.


Quote: I think it will help if you deliberately modeled parts of the scene to look different - varying heights of the bush, different colour, specie, arrangement of trees, and also a better ground texture.. Atm the ground texture seems a bit small, and facing a bland direction that almost makes it look like a flat grey colour.

The brightness of the lamps seem a bit too stark and clear, perhaps tune them down a bit, but make them affect the environment a bit more. Try to illuminate it's surrounding area to have that warm light.

Variance in the general lighting would also help. E.g. one side of the trees is barely lit, whilst the other is vibrant.


I've turned up the environment light now a bit, but i can't change of floor unfortunately because that's how it is in real life, but do you think a little bit of debris on the ground would help? and if so what debris can you put without making it look like a mess?

Quote: Do you have ambient oclussion (AO). The original pictures looks a little flat, which could explainif you do not have AO.

Also the low quality of the main tree is a dead giveaway. The tree texture are pretty low res.

The legs of the benches also give away that the grass patch is a flat plane. You could try adding some 3D grasses near the bench legs.


I've changed the trees, but i'm not sure if the textures much better, i might still need to improve that

I'm definitely going to add some 3d grass around the legs etc, thanks, i'll probably move back to that angle after this one.

Here's an update, i think i may possibly need to make the hedge a bit denser closer to the camera





click for full res

Keep the crits coming
 
  08 August 2012
That one looks great, well done. Something odd in one of the top windows, bricks visible instead of glass. You probbaly already seen that. Otherwise you did really well with it, the variations in leaves colours adds good realism.
 
  08 August 2012
Last render is really nice, its definitely getting there.
Photoshop re-touching can do A LOT and give realism, character and atmosphere to renders. To give you an idea of what you could probably move towards later iv'e simply added two gradients to your render just to see what it could do. When I work with my visualization I tend to bring renders into Photoshop in the midst of a projects to try things out and to develop more ideas of what it is I intend to achieve.

Heres just a test and hopefully it might help you a bit.
It adds a bit of contrast into the render and gives it more of variety between the various spaces; which adds to the realism.



Next thing i'd do in Photoshop would be just adding a bit of dirt texture to the ground to give it more variety and depth. Theres plenty of small things that can be done VERY FAST in Photoshop to make renders look MUCH better. Hope you don't mind me just getting in there to do the test!

Hope this helps you,
Good luck!
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Last edited by Fahim : 08 August 2012 at 01:54 AM.
 
  08 August 2012
It looks really nice now. But I think the sunlight need to be more harsh (bright).

Now its looks like an evening shot, but the sky looks like a mid day. And if it is a day shot, the lights should not be on, & even if they are on, the sunlight would have overwhelm the lights, making them look less bright. They look like night time lighting at the moment.

Try going out in a sunny day & on your torchlight & see what I mean.

By the way, what tools did you used to generate the hedge & trees?
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  08 August 2012
Something New

Something I just realized while looking at the image both old and new was the perspective was wonky. I feel like I am but a small child or little person because the eye level is at the same level as the tops of the hedges and lamps. the scale just based on my experience with hedges is you can see over them.
 
  08 August 2012
Originally Posted by Jackofkings: Something I just realized while looking at the image both old and new was the perspective was wonky. I feel like I am but a small child or little person because the eye level is at the same level as the tops of the hedges and lamps. the scale just based on my experience with hedges is you can see over them.


That in itself wouldn't make the image "wrong", as a lot of photographers shoot from low down, FI using medium format cameras on pods with the viewing screen facing up. But of course we would have to bear that in mind when viewing the images here.
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  08 August 2012
Quote: That one looks great, well done. Something odd in one of the top windows, bricks visible instead of glass. You probbaly already seen that. Otherwise you did really well with it, the variations in leaves colours adds good realism.


Ah yeah, that's the reflection from the end of the building, i think i might need to tone down the reflectiveness of the windows.

Quote: Last render is really nice, its definitely getting there.
Photoshop re-touching can do A LOT and give realism, character and atmosphere to renders. To give you an idea of what you could probably move towards later iv'e simply added two gradients to your render just to see what it could do. When I work with my visualization I tend to bring renders into Photoshop in the midst of a projects to try things out and to develop more ideas of what it is I intend to achieve.

Heres just a test and hopefully it might help you a bit.
It adds a bit of contrast into the render and gives it more of variety between the various spaces; which adds to the realism.



Next thing i'd do in Photoshop would be just adding a bit of dirt texture to the ground to give it more variety and depth. Theres plenty of small things that can be done VERY FAST in Photoshop to make renders look MUCH better. Hope you don't mind me just getting in there to do the test!

Hope this helps you,
Good luck!


Thanks a lot for that, it's amazing how much difference that edit makes to the feel of the image, I'll definitely try adding some dirt etc to the floor, But are there any tutorials or guides for that sort of thing as i'm a bit of a PS noob


Quote: It looks really nice now. But I think the sunlight need to be more harsh (bright).

Now its looks like an evening shot, but the sky looks like a mid day. And if it is a day shot, the lights should not be on, & even if they are on, the sunlight would have overwhelm the lights, making them look less bright. They look like night time lighting at the moment.

Try going out in a sunny day & on your torchlight & see what I mean.

By the way, what tools did you used to generate the hedge & trees?


Hmm, yes i'll try putting the original sky back in to see what it looks like, i used the glare effect node on this image, so it's brightened up the lamps and sky especially.

I'll try a test without the lights on too, but i just don't want it to end up looking very dull.

The hedge was orginally part of a model from turbosquid, but i cut a chink out and used instances of it to try to keep memory usage down. The new hedge I went out and got a bit of a hedge and just modeled it, then used it as hair in the particle system over the top of the old one.

I originally tried to make the trees with the sapling add-on, but i couldn't get them to look right as its a strange type of tree called Sneezewood, so i just modeled it by hand.



I've been experimenting with particle grass for the other angle, here's a quick test render, the grass is a bit patchy close to the camera, so i'll have to add some more there.
I wonder if any blender users know if it's possible to automatically control the amount of particles based on the distance of the camera, i.e lots close too, then a lot thinner further away.

 
  08 August 2012
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