Female character Chan (mild nudity)

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  06 June 2011
I think they are several equally important ways to get an unerring eye for human shapes. The first is to draw life models, posing nude strangers. It isnít that much the drawing itself, but more the absolutely noninvolved attention to the subject. Probably best to learn the average shape and all its variety, and a must to get a feel for the seemingly strange deformations while posing - very helpful here to focus from time to time on a single aspect of the body, like only the volume, or just the interaction btw fat and pose.

An other part of learning is to study nudes in art, especially drawings. How did other artists handle human shapes, what did they regard as important, were they emotionally involved, were they more the sarcastic voyeurs, etc, etc.

Personally iíve gained much experience also by working with dancers, where the focus is the whole day on the body, in a most objective way. So itís not entirely coincidental that painting artists arenít an uncommon view in ballet classes. Some of those guys are getting almost part of the furniture. Dance is probably best to learn how anatomy looks like in the field...

About the photo: (as mentioned) copy and paste the URL into the address bar of a new browser window.

The femur thing: Yes, youíre wrong. I guess you still have the anatomy books of Gottfried Bammes. Check the issue about the widest area of the female body there. Fat pads between upper thighs and buttocks are making the outline always much wider than above where the femur is just slightly looming (except on starved statures).
Here an other photo for your reference folder:

The back of your model is a lot better! Very good now also the muscles around the spine. Just the smaller back is looking slightly pushed in too much.

Not so good yet the lower buttocks at the outer sides regarding especially the body type.^^

A completely other issue: the ribcage seems to come out a little too much where the breasts are - especially on the 2nd render in 1/4 view.

Trousers look generally better. A weaker part now is still the buttocks area. The fabric looks like hanging there, while its nicely stretching at the front. One would expect much more tension around the strong thighs and the relatively big backside.

  06 June 2011
Very nice model mister3d. One thing I noticed, and it's because I have trouble with that area, is where the radiobrachialus ends. It feels like it needs to extend further up into the upper arm instead of ending right at the elbow.
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  06 June 2011
Thank you Zokana and Polygonpusher, your comments are very helpful. I checked the femur and you were right, Zokana. Theres a huge fat pad there. I want to take some drawing classes this autumn if I have time. All your other comments are sharply-correct as usual.
Now back to hair.
  06 June 2011
Hair update. I still dislike it. Something is wrong. Maybe a simpler shader looked somehow better. I will take a look later.

Looks like simple shading looks better. I'll have to redo the shader.

Last edited by mister3d : 06 June 2011 at 03:51 AM.
  06 June 2011
I think the main issue with your hair is the head shape at the sides and at the back. It looks like a sphere , the hair doesnít fall realistically - the top too wide in frontal view, and the straight hair seems to be magically attracted by the neck (frontal and side view), instead of simply falling in before resting on the shoulders. So the hair looks more like a wig made of artificial hair, having not the same smooth elasticity like real hair.

And here an exceptional ref concerning the shoulders of your model (if the link doesn't seem to work: rightclick and save to disk):
  06 June 2011
Thumbs up

Thanks man!
  03 March 2012
Worked a bit on her. I have little free time nowadays.

Last edited by mister3d : 03 March 2012 at 05:01 PM.
  03 March 2012
Nice to see you working on this again!

Some thoughts (and really not more than impressions):

- the face is nicely done, nice variety of subtle and stronger shapes.

- the jaw looks unusually narrow (ref?)

- the lower part of the ears is standing out while the upper half is pressed in - special. The source of the issue might be the position of the ear - the tragus should be under the zygoma and not on top of it.

- as mentioned, nicely done strong shapes, but perhaps somewhat overdone on the lips, looking at first glance almost bit stylised.

- the body is still very good especially legs look nicely shaped.

- iíd take a look at the lower abdo - not sure whether the crotch isnít too high - the area between belly button and genitals looks very compact in my eyes, somewhat compressed (but it might be just me..). (side note: suggested correction corresponds with the mentioned ilium below >> both issues, if any, should be addressed together)

- the sacrum could be pushed out just a little bit more - the curve going down from the small of the back looks slightly too concave.

- depending on the ref youíre using, but the ribcage could be narrower beside the breasts imo - having then more a female shape of the ribcage, which could add a lot to the overall Ďbottle shapeí(remember Bammes... ) And iíd try to give wider alae to the ilium, which look somewhat boyish now, regarding the rest of the body style.

- the forearm looks a bit short, the whole arm could be slightly longer and the hands slightly smaller - the latter difficult to judge because there seem to be several problems with hands(incl fingers) at this render size.

- also the feet are hardly judgeable - the area right behind the little toes appears to be rather flattened.

Hope helpful some way...
Keep it up!
  03 March 2012
Thumbs up

Thanks Zokana for your time. I agree on most of your points. I hope when I draw real humans I will get better. I even didn't look for refs for the body this time, I see I got little of them. Bad practice.
  03 March 2012
Originally Posted by mister3d: Thanks Zokana for your time. I agree on most of your points. I hope when I draw real humans I will get better. I even didn't look for refs for the body this time, I see I got little of them. Bad practice.

I believe that working without references from time to time isnít bad at all. It helps to get better in drawing/modeling from memory. Practicing only with refs and life-models wonít give the self-confidence needed when applying own ideas. The knowledge of anatomy, and the knowledge of the anatomical possibilities is helpful, but it doesnít fully compensate self-confidence, which we all miss a bit when judging own drawings/models of humans done from memory. Itís also a question of the own personality, but practicing will certainly help with getting more relaxed concerning the own work, losing then also the anxiety to reveal too much of ourselves by doing mistakes when using our imagination. Any kind of art is a sort of therapy, at least at the beginning. Itís losing the therapy effect after having more knowhow - unfortunately, using then too many proven patterns, needing the curious look at reality again. So you see, there is a phase for everything.

Just keep going, the model is already great! (the same for Peter, the great )
  08 August 2012
This is starting to looks really good. Nice hand & feet.

Anyway, about the face. I know you are going for an Asian look, typically, the eyelip lines tend to be mostly hidden (see picture).

In any case, IMO, the eyelips is better to be modeled (so eyes can be closed) at the lowest mesh level, instead of sculpted. Also, I think the tearline should be more defined (sharp, instead of rounded). If you look at your eyes, you will notice the pink teareye area, & the skin have a almost 90 degree bend.

Lastly, I think the sink in at the side of the forehead is a little too strong. Otherwise, good job.
My WIP Thread:
Next Gen Lara Croft 3D Model Fanart
  08 August 2012
Thank you, PKD. You are totally right and I appreciate your constructive and precise comments. I will address them shortly.
  08 August 2012
Oh, one more thing when modeling Eastern Asian (Oriental) eyes. Asian do not usually have a extended tearduct zone (for a lack of a better word at the moment)

A typical 'Western' eyes. Note the tear duct area.

Typical Asian eyes. Note the tear duct area again. See the differences?

Its not obvious different, but if you wanted to be more precise, you can take note of this, but do note when I say typically, which means just a norm, not to be taken as absolute.

Hope it helps.
My WIP Thread:
Next Gen Lara Croft 3D Model Fanart

Last edited by PKD : 08 August 2012 at 06:21 PM.
  09 September 2012
I made some cosmetical changes here and there. I'm not sure if I want to get rid of the ypper lid, I think it could be like this, but anyway, thank for the note, I tried to adjust more closely to the Asian look.

Last edited by mister3d : 09 September 2012 at 02:41 PM.
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