startrek - starship bridge

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Old 03 March 2013   #1
startrek - starship bridge



i had a thread someplace else ... but cant seem to find it ... well that just goes to show that i post in too many different web forums :S
 
Old 03 March 2013   #2


hmmm i dont seem to be getting any replies herre, i wonder if im posting in the wrong section or doing something else wrong
 
Old 03 March 2013   #3
Why don't you tell us about what you're trying to do with this image? What is its purpose? What are your intentions? What are your goals as an artist and how does this image relate to your goals? See, the more you can tell us the better we can help you.
 
Old 03 March 2013   #4


uh ... im actually not very good at this kind of stuff
so i thought that if i tried to do things like this, and study things like this
it might help me get better at doing this kind of stuff
 
Old 03 March 2013   #5


i think im finished with this, im getting frustrated -_-
 
Old 03 March 2013   #6
Hi, still early to get frustrated.

I think you need to determine in which stage are you:
- It looks wrong but you don't know why.
- Or it looks wrong, you know why, but you don't know how to fix it.

So first things first, is this from your mind or is there a reference?

I would guess in a star ship there is complete light illumination rather than directional. So every thing is lit sort off. But the light sources need to be shown to be emitting light.

The roof:
Shouldn't there be light sources on the roof? I don't see any, it just decorative wall. Also why is the sky shown in the center of the roof empty of stars or some activity?

The ground:
The ground looks matte, almost muddy, I think the reason is too much variation in color creating a scattered look. you need grainier scattering versus blurry scattering.

The screens:
The lit screens in the back and the sides need to be more saturated, they look dim.

Edges:
The whole painting has soft edges, there are no crisp defined edges to draw our eyes anywhere. or to give us depth cues. So cleaner lines here and there are needed.

Choose a different color for the chairs. They look blended into the ground.

I guess you were using something similar to this:

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Fil...ridge,_2364.jpg

But I think the producers meant to have a pale bridge room so that we the viewers focus on the people in the bridge more. If you can see they are dressed in strong saturated colors while the bridge room has desaturated color so we focus on the people, the leaders, the pilots.

In your painting there are no people, so you are left with a pale room to paint. If the room is the focus I think you should use some colors from this one to make it more interesting:

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Bri...lass_bridge.jpg

Or think how to make the room more alive since there are no people around. Also put more attention into the details, study each section alone and think what is missing.
 
Old 03 March 2013   #7
Originally Posted by FarisB: Hi, still early to get frustrated.

I think you need to determine in which stage are you:
- It looks wrong but you don't know why.
- Or it looks wrong, you know why, but you don't know how to fix it.

So first things first, is this from your mind or is there a reference?

I would guess in a star ship there is complete light illumination rather than directional. So every thing is lit sort off. But the light sources need to be shown to be emitting light.

The roof:
Shouldn't there be light sources on the roof? I don't see any, it just decorative wall. Also why is the sky shown in the center of the roof empty of stars or some activity?

The ground:
The ground looks matte, almost muddy, I think the reason is too much variation in color creating a scattered look. you need grainier scattering versus blurry scattering.

The screens:
The lit screens in the back and the sides need to be more saturated, they look dim.

Edges:
The whole painting has soft edges, there are no crisp defined edges to draw our eyes anywhere. or to give us depth cues. So cleaner lines here and there are needed.

Choose a different color for the chairs. They look blended into the ground.

I guess you were using something similar to this:

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Fil...ridge,_2364.jpg

But I think the producers meant to have a pale bridge room so that we the viewers focus on the people in the bridge more. If you can see they are dressed in strong saturated colors while the bridge room has de-saturated color so we focus on the people, the leaders, the pilots.

In your painting there are no people, so you are left with a pale room to paint. If the room is the focus I think you should use some colors from this one to make it more interesting:

http://en.memory-alpha.org/wiki/Bri...lass_bridge.jpg

Or think how to make the room more alive since there are no people around. Also put more attention into the details, study each section alone and think what is missing.


i think i'm in the

- looks wrong, don't know why, and don't want to bother any more with it since i spent several hours on it already

stage

but you make many valid points here and convinced me to attempt working on it a tad bit more.

seems like you can work on something for an undefined amount of time; if you just work on one thing indefinitely then you won't be able to produce different pieces. i've been told that you should setup a time limit or number of iterations or some sort of limit in-terms of how much you work on a single piece

Last edited by nelson-press : 03 March 2013 at 03:16 PM.
 
Old 03 March 2013   #8


working on it, be patient
 
Old 03 March 2013   #9
The most sincere advice I can give you is to let go of the "I'm frustrated" attitude, or "this is taking too much time". Sit down and decide, do I want to take the time to do this properly? or should I do something else? Spending x number of hours then quitting is just a waste of the x number of hours. You don't go 1/2 the way to the supermarket do you? You either go or you don't.

Regarding time limits and staying with one piece for too long... it like a math problem, if you just keep not sticking with a problem enough to solve it then you move to another problem you won't get anywhere.

The idea is to solve the problem in the time given, not leave it unsolved because the time is up. Time limits are to keep you focused and learn how to work faster. But that is after you learned how to solve the problem and you want to apply what you learned.

If the math problem is tough, it will take time. It's an exercise so you need to absorb yourself in it.

Or at least that's my opinion, which is just another opinion I guess.

You worked on the roof, looks a lot better now. Looking forward for the update.
 
Old 03 March 2013   #10
Old masters in past centuries often spend months and years on a single painting. Today, people are so impatient and so lacking in discipline, they think a few hours is too much time to spend on something.

What does being an artist mean to you? How important is it to you? Is it a passion or just a casual hobby?

If you are serious about being an artist, several hours on a painting means nothing. If you don't have the discipline to spend several hours a painting, then you're not going to get very far as an artist. If you are a hobbyist and this is just casual fun for you, then it doesn't really matter, since your aspirations and career goals aren't on the line if you don't have the discipline to focus on a piece of work for prolonged period of time.

The ability to work faster comes with experience, and in order to amass experience, you have to pay your dues and draw/paint constantly, for years and years, focusing on your weaknesses and targeting them in your studies and practices.

As a point of reference, the average time it takes a professional artist to do a polished piece of work is a few days to a week or two of full-time work, depending on the complexity of the piece. The several hours you've spent in comparison, is jut the first day's work on a piece.
 
Old 04 April 2013   #11


Trying it both ways;
if I set limits, then I can actually get some pieces and have something to show (but quality may not be as good)
but if I don't well the inevitable final product may be better, but I find that I'm unable to accumulate stuff to show (and I don't seem to be able to complete anything anyways). At some point it seems like it stops improving and just changes and looks different and doesn't actually improve.

kinda seems like I'm getting burned on either end of the stick :S

Isn't it just important to keep working on stuff perpetually constantly aiming to do better regardless of how many pieces you work on and whether or not you've set limitations on how long you working on them?

maybe it would be better to do it both ways, have stuff you set limits for and have stuff that you don't set limits for.
 
Old 04 April 2013   #12
Originally Posted by nelson-press:
seems like you can work on something for an undefined amount of time; if you just work on one thing indefinitely then you won't be able to produce different pieces. i've been told that you should setup a time limit or number of iterations or some sort of limit in-terms of how much you work on a single piece


One of the things you learn as an artist is when to walk away from something when it's not working - it's something that can only be learned by practice. There are no set rules to it, it's something you have to be aware of and decide for yourself.

I think perhaps this is too ambitious for you, for several reasons: you don't have enough experience. I would break this down, and work on it in small pieces - do a few pieces, or one piece of wall, to experiment with lighting and shade and most importantly, perspective.

Also, for a piece like this, you really need a strong, clean drawing underneath it. I think half of the problem is you don't have any really clean, straight lines, and the perspective is all over the place. If I were your teacher, I would assign you to draw this as just a line drawing, so you can learn and work out the problems with perspective, then render it later with lighting and texture.
 
Old 04 April 2013   #13
Yeah, here are the things

---

If your building a 3d character from start to finish starting from the concept stage and doing all the modelling texturing rigging etc that can easily take about a week maybe even 2 weeks working on it full time

I'll describe to anyone the amount of time and energy it takes to complete any of these art projects they usually fluff me off and make like I'm just being undisciplined and lazy or that I'm just not managing my time properly something.

---

And it seems like no matter how I approach this I get scrutinized. If I try to work within my means, my abilities, my skill level, then I get scrutinized for not being ambitious and not trying to push it, sticking to my 'comfort zone' etc.

But if I try to push it and be ambitious and what not, I'm advised to ease up, scale back, work more within my level.

Either way I proceed I'm advised to do the opposite. not really certain what to do.

---

Isn't it more important to be consistently working on stuff and focusing on your weaknesses aiming to improve and do better as opposed to what you complete and how much time you spend on stuff?
 
Old 04 April 2013   #14
I don't think this is beyond your ability--it just takes patience to get done. The fact you didn't have a well-planned layout/sketch will slow you down, but it's not something you can't overcome. Like I said, speed and efficiency takes experience to gain, so it'll come eventually.

One thing to remember about learning/growing in any endeavor, is to not just blindly work hard and run around in circles, but to also work smart and use efficient strategies so you can learn/improve at a much faster rate and not waste time on ineffective approaches (which is a very common problem for learning artists--many waste years and years not improving much because they have no idea how to improve efficiently).
 
Old 04 April 2013   #15
Originally Posted by Lunatique: One thing to remember about learning/growing in any endeavor, is to not just blindly work hard and run around in circles, but to also work smart and use efficient strategies so you can learn/improve at a much faster rate and not waste time on ineffective approaches (which is a very common problem for learning artists--many waste years and years not improving much because they have no idea how to improve efficiently).



true, i feel like ive pretty much rammed into that kind of issue
 
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