HMC #35: SPORTS IN MOTION!: A Moment of Victory (Gridiron)

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Old 08 August 2012   #31
This is some really great stuff going on here man! Lovely last update.
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Old 08 August 2012   #32
You sir are a robot
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CK Pinson
 
Old 08 August 2012   #33
@Wyatt: thanks dude

@PKT: thanks

@CKPinson: I sure felt like one when I got going on the pants...I got into this wierd creative groove like I've never been in before...

I should have another update ready to go later today
 
Old 08 August 2012   #34
i watch your impresing effort with great interest, how hardworking you are!
 
Old 08 August 2012   #35
Compression Top

While I'm not going to do the very under layer of padding I still have to do a compression

top that goes over it and has sleeves down to the elbow.

This is what I'll be basing it on.




I started with a fresh extraction of the body which I roughly capped and then I had to

reproject the polypainting onto it. I then inflated it slightly to give me my starting

point for the top.



Then I sculpted it a bit to remove alot of the body detail and for it to look a bit more

'shirty'. Next, I masked out the areas for the padding using the polypaint as a guide.

Unfortunately I then got so caught up I again forgot to take in between screencaps...lol

I basically followed the same process as I used on the pants.



I then traced in the seams with Dam_Standard.



Drawing out the topology was a bit easier this time, I decided not to worry about being

able to split each panel into a polygroup and instead followed the body topology with a few

alterations on the sleeves.



The new topology split into rought front, back and sleeves polygroups.



The finished sculpt, in Zbrush and rendered in max.(you can see the little nike badge and nfl shield I did for the pants in the Zbrush screen)




-------

Even though I simplifed the workflow a little bit I was still able to reduced the time it took from the 3 days for the pants to about 6 hours.

Head Progress

I did another render of the head and I think I'm going to have to redo the detailling (and texture for that matter) on the head, once I added it to the body it's UV space shrunk quite a bit. I may even up the res of the maps for the body.

 
Old 08 August 2012   #36
Marvelous!
 
Old 08 August 2012   #37
Wow this is inspirational work!



I generally get the workflow but in this case you mention a few things I just need to clarify.

You sculpt ignoring topology to get the look right.

You then retopo so the model can be rigged/moved elegantly later.

You then project the high polygon detail into the newly made movable mesh?


How does that work?
Do you sub-divide the low-polygon mesh to give it ample mesh density, and then displace the surface according to the high detail model?

In final use is that done using displacement or normal maps or something similar, or some kind of lookup mesh?

Basically, your retopo mesh with lots of sub-d's would just look super-smooth and low detailed, so how is the detail projected onto that smooth mesh to give it the detailed form?
Is it render-time displacement from textures, or actual displacement of the sub-divided mesh pre-render time via texture, or via some other look up system?

Seen loads of zbursh > realtime game stuff and it's just normal maps, but in this case I'm at a loss to what the method is


I can't wait to see this finished... I'm absolutely loving the details and explanations so far.

Thanks!

Dave
 
Old 08 August 2012   #38
Man congratz. I just receive my newletter from CGsociety and your threat are in it with the ref board has picture lol
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Old 08 August 2012   #39
I too just saw this on the newsletter. Excellent insight into workflow.
 
Old 08 August 2012   #40
This is seriously impressive work. You should update your portfolio and do you have a website?
I would love to see more of your work.
 
Old 08 August 2012   #41
@hleandre: thanks

@Mr Whippy: When I do the reprojection in Zbrush I do it in stages, going up in sub-d's matching the original model. so basically

Original subtool SD1 [projected onto] Retopo'd subtool SD1
Original subtool SD2 [projected onto] Retopo'd subtool SD2
.....and so on until.....
Original subtool SD7 [projected onto] Retopo'd subtool SD7

I find its easiest to do it this way as you're less likely to get any major projection artifacts (if any at all...I don't think I had any on the pants).

The reprojected pants had a point count of around 7.5 million in Zbrush and the mesh I use to bring into max is at around 22,000 points (I think it's SD 2 or 3).

From there I generate normal maps and displacement maps, for the pants these were generated at 4k.

Once in max I set the model up with a Turbosmooth (1 or 2 iterations) and a VrayDisplacementMod modifier. The displacement map is then plugged into that.

I also have a material, which at this stage is just a standard max material, which I attach the normal map to using a "Normal Bump". I also added the fabric pattern into the "additional bump" slot within the Normal Bump map.

Hope that helps a bit.

@Scote & WavesOfLight: Well that was really unexpected. I had no idea they even put WIP type stuff in the newsletters. Awfully humbled to be put in there and to whoever put it in there, thanks.

@silas007: I really should update my portfolio...I haven't touched it for years. I had intended to do it after this challenge but perhaps I'll have to move it forward after this little bit of exposure. I also don't have a website at this stage (only several failed blogs...lol) but it is something I'm looking at getting up and running...

---------------

Update wise, I should have some more tonight, I've been working some shoulder pads today.
 
Old 08 August 2012   #42
Quote:
Originally Posted by robo3687
@Mr Whippy: When I do the reprojection in Zbrush I do it in stages, going up in sub-d's matching the original model. so basically

Original subtool SD1 [projected onto] Retopo'd subtool SD1
Original subtool SD2 [projected onto] Retopo'd subtool SD2
.....and so on until.....
Original subtool SD7 [projected onto] Retopo'd subtool SD7

I find its easiest to do it this way as you're less likely to get any major projection artifacts (if any at all...I don't think I had any on the pants).

The reprojected pants had a point count of around 7.5 million in Zbrush and the mesh I use to bring into max is at around 22,000 points (I think it's SD 2 or 3).

From there I generate normal maps and displacement maps, for the pants these were generated at 4k.

Once in max I set the model up with a Turbosmooth (1 or 2 iterations) and a VrayDisplacementMod modifier. The displacement map is then plugged into that.

I also have a material, which at this stage is just a standard max material, which I attach the normal map to using a "Normal Bump". I also added the fabric pattern into the "additional bump" slot within the Normal Bump map.

Hope that helps a bit.


OK, so you stage the zbrush copy of topology data to the new mesh. That makes sense to make sure each step goes ok before layering finer details to the new mesh topology.

But once in 3DS Max, do you use the new mesh you drew above (ie, the base retopology mesh) and then apply displacement/normal maps directly to that (after sub-dividing)...

Or do you bake in a bit more detail and use a slightly denser mesh as a base for the Max part of the work?



I take it you will be rigging/posing the character so I guess to do that you will do it in Max on the low poly retopo model, and then re-build up the details using texture maps only?
Or will you be doing all that work in Zbrush, and literally exporting appropriate meshes/textures per pose simply for final rendering in Max?


Just new to this side of the workflow so don't really get what is possible or not.

Thanks for explaining things so far!

Cheers

Dave
 
Old 08 August 2012   #43
Hmm, that's a good idea. I never thought about doing the reproject in stages like that but it sounds like it would eliminate the typical funky polys you get.

You really should try the new retopo brush again. I don't know what issue you were getting but its leaps and bounds better than the old one.
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Old 09 September 2012   #44
Damn Paul. Really coming along nicely. I love how much of the process you are showing too. Really great work so far. I'm at work so didn't have a chance to read through everything so pardon if it's already been said. Head looks fantastic, but only thing sticking out to me through all of it is his ear. It's really close but something about it feels off. The lobe in particular feels really weirdly flat. I think that's what is bothering me most about it. It's a minor thing, but with the rest of the head looking so good, it makes the weirdness in the ear stick out a bit more. Looking forward to seeing more of this one. Way to represent our football to the world.
 
Old 09 September 2012   #45
@MrWhippy: The mesh I bring into max is the retopologised mesh but up one or 2 subdivisions. The average size of the ones I'm bringing in is around 20k points.

And I was going to do a rig and stuff in Max but realised I have absolutely no idea how to...lol...so at this stage the plan is to pose it in Zbrush using Transpose Master and then maybe sculpt it a bit more from there and then bring it back into max as I have been.

@Wyatt: I think I wasn't being careful enough when I tried the topology brush and then I just got frustrated with it. I'll push on with the traditional method for now on this project (I strangely find it relaxing) but I'll definitely give it another go soon.

@TiMrozek: thanks dude, I haven't looked at the ear for a while but you're right it is a bit flat. I'll fix it eventually but for now with it hidden inside the helmet it'll have to be something further down my to-do list (I did a to-do list yesterday....it was really...really...long...lol)

I'll have a decent sized update tonight sometime hopefully...
 
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