200+ Women In L.A.’s Animation Ind Demand Studios End Sexual Harassment In Workplace

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  4 Weeks Ago
Look guys at the end of the day, people no matter the gender should feel  that they are safe at work , you know to do work no matter their gender or sexual orientation.
The mere fact that so many high visibility a female animators state that there is indeed a problem in the industry tell me that this is a problem that should not be treated lightly.

Anyway please lets keep the conversation civil.
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Last edited by RobertoOrtiz : 4 Weeks Ago at 12:25 PM.
 
  4 Weeks Ago
It is all about balance.   The problem is people are getting out of balance.  
There are people watering down real serious sexual harassment by calling everything harassment even criticism vs real harrassment that needs to be handled quickly, efficiently and effectively to stop.   Asking a coworker for a date (male or female) should be fine.   Keep asking over and over again is harassment.   Getting back at the person or impeding that persons career as revenge is harassment.   Asking on a date, get declined, and respectfully understanding and moving on should be fine.   But it is getting to the point where folks think that is harassment.  
I think people are scared about things below.
People are starting to see crazy stuff like this
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RzA4dCT4X0I
and this happening
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WpvnO0p9KvU
So the key is respect, balance and treating others as you want to be treated.  Golden rule works really well if everyone just applied it.  
Harassment should never be allowed and should be fought but not everything should be considered harassment.   So what is to be marked as harassment and what is not?

I saw one politician lady get mad when a man interrupted her and say he was sexist.   But in reality the man was treating her like he would treat a fellow politician.  He would talk over a man just as easily as he talked over this lady.   In other words he treated her like his equal or just like anyone else.   So did she want special and treated like the patriarchal lady or treated as an equal?  

That is the question.  Where do you put the balance?  Attitudes of the loudest most outspoken are unbalanced.  So what to do?

Sure we should all want to treat others with respect and should but what do you do when even normal everyday interactions become harassment? 
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Last edited by ilovekaiju : 4 Weeks Ago at 05:42 AM.
 
  4 Weeks Ago
Originally Posted by ilovekaiju: It is all about balance.   The problem is people are getting out of balance. 

That is the question.  Where do you put the balance?  Attitudes of the loudest most outspoken are unbalanced.  So what to do?


You keep using that word, yet, you do not define it, so no one knows what you mean. A balance between what?
Between picking up women at work and work? Is it REALLY too much to ask, as a woman that one can enter a workplace and be expecting to be seen as a competent colleague and not a potential fuck? Or is that the balance you think we should find? The balance between being there for your pleasure and doing our work?
 
  4 Weeks Ago
Interesting BBC Survey:

http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-41741615

53% of Women and 20% of Men in the UK report being sexually harassed at work.

1 in 10 women says she left the place of employment because of the harassment.

in 30% of cases with Women it was a Boss or Senior Manager that did the harassing.
 
  4 Weeks Ago
Originally Posted by SD3D: What Grrinc is saying, though he realises it not, is that it's ok for men to have sex with any woman they want based on the outcome of some very happy relationships that resulted from it. The mere fact that 90+% of those sexual-encounters were actually rape is something he is willing to overlook. 

no, I don't think he said that, did he? what exactly are YOU saying here? 90+% of all work-relationships are actually rape?
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  4 Weeks Ago
Originally Posted by derOesi: no, I don't think he said that, did he? what exactly are YOU saying here? 90+% of all work-relationships are actually rape?
I would not go  there... and that is frankly one extreme.
But lets be honest here, the core idea of going to a place of employment is to get work done.
Socializing happens, and honestly it is expected.
BUT.... it should not get in the way of the productivity of an employee.

This means in plain english, that a person going to work, should have a reasonable expectation of personal space and  frankly privacy. He or she should not be expected to have to endure advances every day that frankly get in the way of getting anything done and make the workplace feel like a hostile  environment. 
It is not that hard.... Be friendly, not creepy.

and to take it ever farther there is the ugly specter of power dynamics, where the person asking for a dates are in management positions and they want to "date" and underling. 
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  4 Weeks Ago
Originally Posted by SD3D: Although actually, after reading all the replies, I do agree with AJ and Alice regarding some points. You don't date your work colleagues! I don't know what the feeling is, or the expression to describe it, but it irritates me when all (most) the men descend on a new attractive female at the workplace. Leave the poor lady alone! If you become good friends over a year or more, then OK, but anything else is just creepy and suffocating.
Right there. Right friggin there. Your last line. And I asked you why is it creepy.
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  4 Weeks Ago
I want to propose that the attitude discussed here, the "oh no, I cant even flirt at work" is the core of the problem for equality. The notion that men sees female and male colleagues differently. Take this study as an example: Harvard Business Review on the matter.
Yes, it is a long read but it is worth the read. Basically, what it is saying is that even though men and women do the same work, has the same contacts in a dynamic environment, women aren't promoted at the same rate as men. At the core, people shine another light on women than on men. I say people, cause women are as much a hostage by this paradigm as men are.

At one end of this paradigm is the production, it suffers cause the best person isn't doing the job and it impairs the female workforce. In another end is the extreme output of this way of seeing women, there to flirt with. There for the pleasure of others. There to harass. To lay your hands on. In another end (cause this is a spectrum, not a dichotomy) social relationships are impaired for both men and women.

What you are saying when you defend the right to flirt at work is that you defend your right to shine this light on women at your workplace. You defend a paradigm where women somehow are responsible for your hard on at work. Yes, I can see how easy it is to see it from the egoistic point of view from a man who sees himself as "a good guy". But structures like this are upheld by good people and good intentions.
So what am I saying? That men should be castrated? Of cause not. I am saying, adjust your attitude at work. Who knows, maybe you'll even discover that people like you more when you don't sort them by their genitals.
 
  4 Weeks Ago
*edit
see post below

Last edited by ACiD80 : 4 Weeks Ago at 02:04 PM.
 
  4 Weeks Ago
Originally Posted by grrinc: Right there. Right friggin there. Your last line. And I asked you why is it creepy.
The problem with your "Argument" is that you are focused on a possible positive outcome but are ignoring the vast majority of negative ones. No one can argue against the positive outcome that you keep bringing up but it is an unlikely outcome. If further clarification is made in subsequent posts you discard material that doesnt fit your agenda.

The analogy is that if I said that playing the lottery was stupid, you'd say how is winning millions (insert your currency here) stupid!? Well, you cant argue with that positive outcome, its just that millions of people sink large somes of money into it and never win anything but you focus only on the unlikely positive.

Why do you need to ask people with which you work out on a date on day one? You spend many hours with them every day and even in a professional environment you will get to know them.

Of course this whole thing will go on forever because we are talking about analogue behaviour.
 
  4 Weeks Ago
Originally Posted by Alice: I want to propose that the attitude discussed here, the "oh no, I cant even flirt at work" is the core of the problem for equality.

What?!

You don't even try to understand what is said... All you see is someone not agreeing with you and you into attack mode. Twisting around what was actually said to make it look bad or in this case childish.

'the problem of equality' says the person who told guys who experienced similar problems not to post in here.
Also, all your posts are about men vs women with a very negative stereo typical view of the men which doesn't make you look very rational thinking either.

Problem is some people don't seem to understand the difference between flirting and harassing.
Too much flirting or exaggerated flirting is obviously harassment and no one in here is saying that's ok.
But there's also innocent ways to flirt and I see nothing wrong with that as long it doesnt get out of hand (like anything else).

Last edited by ACiD80 : 4 Weeks Ago at 02:16 PM.
 
  4 Weeks Ago
Originally Posted by ACiD80: What?!

You don't even try to understand what is said... All you see is someone not agreeing with you and you into attack mode. Twisting around what was actually said to make it look bad or in this case childish.


Since you seem incapable of having a mature normal conversation without turning rude, I opt not to include you in my conversation.
 
  4 Weeks Ago
Seems a quite a few here think it's a right for them to flirt at work which is a surprise to me. Issues of gender and "grey areas" aside it's simply not professional to flirt with a colleague, especially when there's any sort of hierarchy involved.  Even just from a pragmatic perspective pursuing a consensual relationship with someone you're working with directly just seems like a terrible idea. 

The idea of "balance" or "knowing the difference" misses the point entirely, your time at work is 100% about doing your job. Developing collegial relationships is part of that, developing romantic relationships is not. 
 
  4 Weeks Ago
Originally Posted by unaccompanieddminor: Your time at work is 100% about doing your job.

To a point I agree... again there's a balance.
But 100% ... So, remove all windows from the office, make everything in the office grey/neutral, don't bring ANYTHING else up unless its about work and cubicles are the best thing ever?
Don't dare to give a wink at a colleague or ask if he/she's interested in going out some time... Fired!

Last edited by ACiD80 : 4 Weeks Ago at 02:58 PM.
 
  4 Weeks Ago
Originally Posted by ACiD80: To a point I agree... again there's a balance.
But 100% ... So, remove all windows from the office, make everything in the office grey/neutral, don't bring ANYTHING else up unless its about work and cubicles are the best thing ever?

No, people are better at their jobs when they're comfortable, relaxed and respected. Do you honestly think flirting is an essential part of being a productive employee?
 
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