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Old 11-02-2013, 06:32 PM   #31
Alice
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Originally Posted by Playdo
I call it playtime too

..Couldn't resist bringing a bit of light heartedness into the thread

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Old 11-02-2013, 06:45 PM   #32
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alice
Maybe your failure to see anything of merit in what she says is that you deemed her as a "shallow, weasly, husk of a lady"?


Quote:
Originally Posted by Alice
Yes, guilty. I used Anita as to weed out the trolls.


Quote:
Originally Posted by "Alice
You mentioned she had "weaseled herself onto a TED stage. I guess you haven't watched it as she explains that in the TED talk.


Let me just interject for a minute.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wild_weasel


There we go. That is all I really have to say. Anika is what they like to call a "wild weasel" when it comes to finding sexists in the gaming industry. The "wild weasel" motto is YGBSM short for... well... you can figure it out. Peace.

Last edited by PaulEMcLaughlin : 11-02-2013 at 06:48 PM.
 
Old 11-02-2013, 06:55 PM   #33
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Originally Posted by PaulEMcLaughlin
Let me just interject for a minute.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wild_weasel
There we go. That is all I really have to say. Anika is what they like to call a "wild weasel" when it comes to finding sexists in the gaming industry.

Basically fly around in her gender equality jet and bait trolls and sexists into insulting her so everyone else knows where all the sexists and trolls are.


So back to topic. You said you are NOT in video game industry and you are NOT involved in taking console gaming to the larger demographic of women. So far you haven't had any input on the topic of how to sell more games to women.
Lets solve this once and for all, go make a thread on Anita and discuss her person there.
 
Old 11-02-2013, 07:02 PM   #34
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I think I'll start a thread on how Jesus wouldn't approve of video games, then when the shitstorm rolls in, I'll say this thread isn't about Jesus.

And I have worked in the gaming field, so if you need that...
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Old 11-02-2013, 07:18 PM   #35
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alice
So back to topic. You said you are NOT in video game industry and you are NOT involved in taking console gaming to the larger demographic of women. So far you haven't had any input on the topic of how to sell more games to women.
Lets solve this once and for all, go make a thread on Anita and discuss her person there.


What I said was extremely on topic.

Women should realize about video games that even seemingly ungirly things like war games have relevance to other things in life. In my opinion, the "greatest generation" was in part so great because they were able to take lessons learned during ww2 and apply them to civilian life. Not so much directly, but violent games can teach you a great deal about strategy, planning, prioritization, efficiency, etc. all things that have an extreme amount of relevance to other things.

Take a game like modern warfare. This game teaches you, or is supposed to, teach you things like concentration, teamwork, quick thinking, etc. These are all extremely valuable life skills that go far beyond direct relevance to war games. In addition to that, becoming familiar with modern weapons allows you a certain degree more of peace of mind when it comes to understanding political issues which often deal with military or police matters. So when you read in the news "so and so fired upon a group of individuals with an ar-15" you aren't left as a hopeless little girl not knowing what an ar-15 is, and living in a big bad mans world at the whim of big bad scary sounding man things. So instead of going "oh gee golly whats an ar-15 that sounds scary" you can go "oh an ar-15 I know what that is, suddenly this evet is less scary to me because I understand a little bit more about it" Knowledge is power. Fear is the mind killer, and you will always fear what you don't understand.

Last edited by PaulEMcLaughlin : 11-02-2013 at 07:22 PM.
 
Old 11-02-2013, 07:20 PM   #36
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Quote:
Originally Posted by imashination
All comments on her videos are disabled so theres no dialogue with her.

To be frank, that's what happened when the comments WERE enabled...

http://www.feministfrequency.com/20...ing-on-youtube/

Quote:
Originally Posted by imashination
And finally, just how does one person spend $160,000 to make three short youtube videos?

She did not ask for $160.000, only for $6.000. The fact her Kickstarter goal has been reached in less than 24 hours and the MASSIVE barrage of threats and insults that rained down on her suggests there indeed might be a problem that needs to be addressed...
 
Old 11-02-2013, 07:24 PM   #37
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What I am saying is this, I think both men and women miss out on a lot by ignoring things that the other sex does. I am not suggesting cross dressing or erasing gender, just a little more openmindedness.
 
Old 11-02-2013, 07:27 PM   #38
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http://www.theesa.com/facts/gameplayer.asp
Some facts on gamers and gender.
Now, behind that number you also have a growing secondary target group in women as the age of the gamer is smack in the age where people have children and women makes a majority decisions regarding what to buy in a family. So it's not all about making games for women but also about making games that women feel comfortable in giving to their kids.
 
Old 11-02-2013, 07:30 PM   #39
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Anita, needs to look up the definition of 'confirmation bias'. That said, there is certainly some truth to what she's saying. There are some 'issues' in the gaming industry. But the way she goes about bringing it to discussion, leaves a lot to be desired.
 
Old 11-02-2013, 07:33 PM   #40
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Alice
So it's not all about making games for women but also about making games that women feel comfortable in giving to their kids.


Any woman that doesn't feel comfortable giving their kid a violent video game is not a woman in the first place.

If I ever have kids, male or female, I'm going to look them in the eye and say the following thing:

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There is no hunting like the hunting of man, and those who have hunted armed men long enough and liked it, never care for anything else thereafter.
 
Old 11-02-2013, 07:40 PM   #41
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulEMcLaughlin
Any woman that doesn't feel comfortable giving their kid a violent video game is not a woman in the first place.

If I ever have kids, male or female, I'm going to look them in the eye and say the following thing:


Well, then let's hope you'll never have any kids.
 
Old 11-02-2013, 07:44 PM   #42
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Quote:
Originally Posted by spurcell
Anita, needs to look up the definition of 'confirmation bias'. That said, there is certainly some truth to what she's saying. There are some 'issues' in the gaming industry. But the way she goes about bringing it to discussion, leaves a lot to be desired.


But hey, it's the first real massive debate about the subject. If we can push beyond the initial immature impulse to attack the messenger on a personal level and point out that she is a woman, then maybe the market and in the end the industry, will grow
 
Old 11-02-2013, 08:02 PM   #43
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Originally Posted by Alice
But hey, it's the first real massive debate about the subject. If we can push beyond the initial immature impulse to attack the messenger on a personal level and point out that she is a woman, then maybe the market and in the end the industry, will grow


It's easy. You filter out those people who can't have a mature discussion without making themselves out to be asshats. Their opinion isn't worthy of notice. If you're not prepared to deal with the trolls, when you broach a subject like this, than maybe you're not the person to be broaching it. I'm speaking to Anita, but it really applies to anybody, in this internet age.
 
Old 11-02-2013, 08:34 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by PaulEMcLaughlin
Any woman that doesn't feel comfortable giving their kid a violent video game is not a woman in the first place.


What the actual f**king f**k? This is one of the most simgularly stupid things I've ever read here. You seem to be about the least qualified person to be posting in this thread (self-admittedly), so you might want to quit now, or just wait for the lock.

As for OP, I'm not sure how working in games qualifies anyone to speak one way or the other about the subject at hand. I've worked in them for 20 years and don't feel qualified to do so. The games industry is in no better position to be the moral police of their industry than the oil industry is to reduce fossil fuel emissions. There are very few devs who make it their mission to uphold any kind of moral code since it's not approval they are after - it's money. If being sensitive to the portrayal of women in games could make more money for publishers, they'd do it in a heartbeat. They tend to go where the money is, not so much out of greed, but merely to stay in business.

There is also a trmendous difference between the depiction of women in games and attempting to attract more female players. Believe me, the industry would love nothing more than to include more females among their money-spending customers. But introducing a new gaming paradigm tha attracts both genders is much harder than it sounds, and involves a lot more risk on the part of publishers.

As for Ms. Sarkeesian, she seems as though she's just capitalizing on a hot-button issue, with very little solid research or information to back her up. If she can be proud of anything it's that, on the internet, both men and women are equally free to get people worked up about a cause that does nothing more than self-aggrandize themselves, preferrable while making some money in the process.
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Old 11-02-2013, 08:46 PM   #45
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as a woman who has worked in a male dominated industry for ten years now.


Well that right there is the main reason for the inequality, historically speaking, women just havent been interested in computer games or computers period, the most common thing I hear is that theyre made for men, theyre sexist, theyre not for women and it is largely true... but this is something which has defined the industry since the start even when games were largely androgynous. Pacman, defender, missile command, tetris, pong; even at this early stage, women just werent that interested. So of course if theres only one sex dominating the jobs then games will go down a specific route.

Computer games have a very low barrier to entry, grab a game, make a mod to transform the game, you can make it anything you like, if you have a good idea, gamers dont care who has made a game, so long as it is fun.

Quote:
I used her videos as a background. A LOT of men have been personally hurt by her opinions. So hurt that they have a lot of mean things to say about her or her character. this behavior is just appalling.


A lot of people are annoyed and will be overly defensive because from many gamer's point of view, shes attacking the games they loved and enjoyed. For the longest time, if I as a guy played games or talked about them publicly, I would be the target of ridicule from girls, but its what Ive enjoyed and grown up with. A lot of men are pissed off because their hobby and past time which has spent the longest time being mocked by women.... now has them complaining that video games arent targeted at women and that they dont cater to their desires. Even today I have a female friend, shes constantly taking the piss out of her boyfriend because he enjoys playing video games.

With that said, I dont see anyone complaining that women are making games, or that games are more and more being targeted towards them. The complaints are that shes digging into one of the most irrelevant, unimportant parts of the games, the simple damsel in distress. For a simple game where you have mere seconds to explain the story before the game starts, "go rescue your girlfriend" is one of the simplest you can possibly come up with, and seeing as guys have for the most part been the people that buy the consoles and games, it just made sense to have the male protagonist rescue a lady. For all the difference it makes, you could replace the damsel with a doughnut, its just a thing you like to work you way towards.

Quote:
After receiving death threats, a hate storm and even a game where one could beat her to a bloody pulp simply for implying that some games where a tad sexist, there was a public outcry of support for her.


My sympathy-o-meter isnt even twitching. Ive had death threats in response to making training videos for christs sake. If you make a public profile of yourself and put yourself out there, people wont like you, and bored anonymous 12 year olds will send you messages saying theyre going to kill you. Grow a thicker skin, throwing every mean message you get as evidence to support your cause wont garner any support.

Quote:
She isn't trying to destroy your little boys club you have going. She is doing you a favor.


Thats quite an accurate observation, but I wouldnt come to that conclusion. Games have been a boys club to a large degree for a long time, but not because the boys have banned the girls, but because the girls didnt want to join in and play. Now after a number of years, the girls are complaining the club doesnt cater towards them.

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just... wow
Maybe your failure to see anything of merit in what she says is that you deemed her as a "shallow, weasly, husk of a lady"?


No, its because shes shallow and weasely.

Quote:
Maybe cause the majority of comments comes from immature boys who cant talk about a media critic without using derogatory slanders and pointing out that she is a female?


I'd be inclined to agree entirely with that, yes, most comments are from immature boys. But shes using every little child-like comment as ammo against the genuine criticisms, dismissing every well thought out discussion as childish, but at the same time elevating every childish comment to that of a serious threat.

Quote:
You mentioned she had "weaseled herself onto a TED stage. I guess you haven't watched it as she explains that in the TED talk.


Ive watched every one of her videos more than once, Ive watched videos supporting her and videos against her. Im curious, what good points do you think she makes, and what comments from her do you think are rubbish? IMHO a few of the things she says have merit, but nothing thats new or original. All of her videos and presentations come across as overly rehearsed and edited, nothing she says seems to come from the heart, nothing she says seems like she actually cares about the topic, shes just picked something popular and and latched on. Take her live stage presentations and her appearance on a news channel; she says the exact same lines word for word each and every time. Its like watching a politician.

Just so you dont get the wrong idea, I want to see more women making games, I think more games should be aimed at women or at no sex in particular and yes, there are plenty of shallow things men do in games (bouncing boobs in fighting games anyone?). I think Anita is rubbish at putting across any factual or coherent arguments, she just panders to the feminazis* throwing up as many buzzwords as she can fit in.

*Nothing to do with feminism, just the man hating crazies who will bend anything a man says or does into a reason to hate them more.
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