Why now accept everything that is submitted in 3D Stills?

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  05 May 2013
Originally Posted by leigh: Well in all honesty there should never really have been any "prestige" to the main gallery. I always saw the CG Choice Award as being the prestige to aim for, really.

Regardless whether submissions were declined for good/bad/personal reasons, don't you think that you (all) created this "prestige" yourselves?
With so many people to be disappointed it became a prestige by itself.
As someone else pointed out it became a "lottery" and I see that as being prestiguous.

I think you're right in saying that the "CG Choice Award" is the ultimate thing to aim for here, but "just" the 3D gallery itself also became too much of a challenge if you consider the number of declined works and disappointed people venting their frustrations here in the open.

So in the end this may be a gamble as you say, but in a way it actually fits better with the CG Choice award prestige you have explained.

Originally Posted by leigh: I realise this is a bit of a gamble and we may well lose some viewers for the gallery, but I'm hoping that somehow it'll work out in the end. We are also currently overhauling the entire Portfolio system which should make it easier for people to get their work uploaded and available for comments and stuff.

That's great to hear and I'm looking forward to this new system
I think it will add another layer of interactivity.
Already you can build a kind of network with your portfolio, but having it available for comments "and stuff" will encourage this even further.
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Last edited by Tangled-Universe : 05 May 2013 at 06:47 PM.
  05 May 2013
Originally Posted by leigh: Because we're tired of people being unhappy about their work being declined.

I understand that fighting against this is tiring. I can't imagine having to deal with all this whiners, threatning to kill all of your relatives cause their work is mediocre at best after a day of work. Being honest with myself, I can not ask you guys (and gals) to keep doing such a tedious work.

However, having said that, I can't help but feel that we're (as we in the forums) are losing the battle against the whiners and the immature, who feels entitled to a place in the galleries just because they are so special. I don't see myself checking the 3d stills gallery from now on, and ironically I believe at some point, another "gallery" will emerge from all the work in the forums, something like "aspiring to cgchoice". And when that happens, a furious amount of people will complain to death because their work was not selected as a nominee for such price .

Just in case it didn't feel like it, to all the mods making the calls on the work and dealing with so much complain and whining, I salute you, your work on it has been very appreciated and it will be missed.
  05 May 2013
Originally Posted by leigh: .....and pictures of barbarian chicks......

Wow, we have pictures of barbarian chicks? Where are they!

Seriously though, you just can't please everyone all the time. If lowering the bar on the 3D Stills forum means less headaches and stress for the moderators, I'm all for it.
The main thing is that the CG Choice forum will retain it's high standard.
I like to learn.
  05 May 2013
All the whining about not getting posted should simply merit a link to deviantart anyway. Numerous groups on there are just dumps of cg blehh :/
  05 May 2013
Don't panic just yet, guys.
This is only a first step in a series aimed at providing a mix of better visibility and more content.

There might be a disgreaceful period of pollution (although even looking at the first batch views and other things still tend to shuffle things quality first to some extent), but it will ultimately lead to more good content once other things get done.

We've swung back and forth on this and related issues many times, but it's not done based on mood and whims. Times change, traffic changes, the way people interact with the internet has changed dramatically several times over since this site started, so those rules move back and forth to respond to the context while bit by bit more is added to regulate it.

It's a tricky balance to make sure that enough content is submitted to not filter out the good stuff, and therefore keeping things fresh, and making sure that the noise doesn't swamp the signal, and it's an ever changing game.

The whining and the quality of the whining and who it comes from is listened to not because we don't want to be bothered and therefore "cave in to terrorism", but because if you know how to read it it's a reflection of current trends.

Things were getting to the point where we were missing out on GOOD stuff through no fault of our own.
Be it a mix of discouraged professionals, small mistakes, skewed numbers occasionally not lining up for content that was plug worthy not even making it to the gallery and so on.

While we don't want the gallery to turn into a cesspit, we don't want it to become a desolate land either, so the first step is this, and it'll lead to more content. Once we have it, what we'll have to do to make sure signal remains solid will become appearant, and the tools to manage that are already well into development and should only be a few months away.

Just clench your teeth for a few weeks/months as we adjust things, this isn't going to become the next deviantart.
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  05 May 2013
Changes coming

Hi all,

Some great discussion going on here. I'm not sure I can say it any better than Raff.

We do need to change and keep up with trends. The team, here at the home office, will be making quite a few changes in the coming months, which will give new tools and ways of viewing the excellent art that our community works so hard to create an appreciate.

If you have any ideas, please feel free to PM me.

  05 May 2013
Edit: Ah I see we all posted at the same time. The guys above outlined it better.
The terminal velocity of individual particles is directly related to pink rabbits on a bank holiday.
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Last edited by Kanga : 05 May 2013 at 08:27 AM.
  05 May 2013
It is not only the people submitting work who need thicker skin. The reviewers, whoever that may be in the long run after the changes, they need to have thick skin for the brutality needed. Sure constructive critic is essential, you simply can not critic if you can not explain and propose changes. One of the good rules is to not complain if you can not propose alternative. Goes for any system under scrutiny or evaluation of art.

When it comes to reviewers see their critic being under scrutiny, suddenly the situation is upside down. Many elitist, if you will, sites have fallen to the prey of mediocrity and mass appeal. But if it wasn't for the Olympics or champions there would be nothing to thrive for. Medium to make it happen as Leigh described the system if it is submission or whatever naturally can be very different in different situations.

Main point being if you have system that allows both ends of the worlds exist. Thats nice. Go for it. Just don't give Olympic medal for every participants no matter how desperately they beg for the recognition. When they stand in the line of everyone else also getting the olympic gold medal they fail to see their own contribution on how it doesn't feel so special anymore. At the end of the day they are the first ones to escape the party and not uphold the community, as they never had the tenacity to push for excellence in the first place.

It is not accidental that there are many tiers of sports where people can find their local superiority and can settle to be the champion of backyard football club. There will be always the ones that proceed. I don't know how that would be implemented in this kind of format though, as the local superiority is hard to maintain in such dynamic and transparent environment. Physical world is such a good limiting factor in many aspects as it creates constrained local recognition to satisfy the given person.

Not only do you need system to rank the artists you may need a system to rank the reviewers and the quality of their feedback? What incentive do people have to provide good feedback if their name is not on the line in the same way as the artist puts his name on the line

Last edited by Cromfel : 05 May 2013 at 04:11 PM.
  05 May 2013
You guys forget that this site got its reputation because of its 'prestige' and highly professional members. Thats what made it different than most other online CG communities out there.

I fear opening the doors like this is not going to help you maintain that position or reputation.

Last edited by ACiD80 : 05 May 2013 at 04:23 PM.
  05 May 2013
Ahh well I roamed around to see the current showcase posts, another issue this change yields is the site getting new traffic or users leaving before staying. They post in 3d still showcase since it is the top and first thing they see and then get mauled by the community, brand new artists don't necessarily know how to take criticism both critical and blunt negative remarks. At least I think there should be a bit of a "Your piece has fundamental issues that could be corrected through WIP".
  05 May 2013
Originally Posted by CHRiTTeR: You guys forget that this site got its reputation because of its 'prestige' and highly professional members. Thats what made it different than most other online CG communities out there.

I fear opening the doors like this is not going to help you maintain that position or reputation.

I agree. Lowering the bar for the 3D Still Images Forum a little so it isn't as strict as the Select forum is wise. But dropping the bar altogether and allowing sheer rubbish in is a step to far, or too low imho.
  05 May 2013
The Poser and Bryce renders...they're here. *shudder*
"The best things in life are either illegal, fattening, or take too long to render."
  05 May 2013
Consider me also one who was in favor of work being veto'd before it could exist in any capacity on here. It was already slow going looking through that forum because a large amount of it was still shit, now there's no hope.
  05 May 2013
The regulation keeps CGSociety professional and respectable, it's not like they can't post period because that is what the WIPs are for. I just don't want to see CGS drift into this.
  05 May 2013
I'm honestly pretty surprised by the waves of Poser/DAZ renders and obvious tutorials (for example, this: http://forums.cgsociety.org/showthr...f=132&t=1105887 was most likely made from this: http://www.blenderguru.com/videos/c...c-fruit-splash/, people post images from that tut all the time on the Blender sub on Reddit.)

I figured there we be some stuff like that, but the amount of it is nuts. The 3D stills forum seems to have just dropped like a rock in quality.
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