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Old 02 February 2013   #46
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Quote: The Brits might stop for a moment to be pissed off too, if they weren't all trying to move to, or come back to, 'Stralya


"Stralya" Good attempt though I dont think your accent quite cuts the mustard.
 
Old 02 February 2013   #47
Originally Posted by ThE_JacO: Of course they are, but not proportionally lower to the costs of living.

In general when evaluating working abroad there are several things to consider, will your savings allow you to start up and to survive if the place shuts down, how's the visa requirments, what are you actually saving in hard cash compared to a reference and/or stable standard (say the US dollar), what quality of living can you afford out of that saved margin and how close to, or above, your expectations it is and so on.

All in all, in those regards, Montreal is far from being bad, especially if you intend to stay there in the long-ish term.

It's easy to get drawn in from high pay and then find out that taxation and costs wash away the lot. London, which was rich milking for a lot of us for years, went through that at one point, and I remember colleagues from abroad being really surprised at how little they ended up saving or how much they had to sacrifice to save anything. Sydney is going that way, with wages that topped Cali for many roles, but with expenses that place it in the top ten world wide.

Some places don't pay anywhere the same, B.C. is a good example, but even inflated compared to the rest of Canada, for foreign seniors, it's far from being bad if you have a certain set of priorities in life, and Montreal for some people can be even better.

At the end of the day, while it might or might not be a step down in a long descending set of stairs that will bottom out somewhere in the East in a levelled out economy where our job has become fully comoditised the way it happened to web design, it's not like we're talking about moving to a third world country to make 30k a year living like a king but with savings worth squat.

It's no harder for the average mid-level to save 30k a year in Montreal than it is in Sydney, arguably it's easier for some lifestyles, so if you're ready to cope with the Francophone employment ladder and the worst coffee in the world (and weather cold enough to freeze a strong scotch if you dare drink it on a balcony ), and you appreciate all the good sides (I never lived there, but visited many times), it's far from a bad new venue to have.

Of course it will further piss off the average American (not making this a matter of nationalities for the sake of it, please don't take it that way) that has no visa problems anywhere in the world, has a relatively stable currency by modern economy standards, and is used to buying everything and anything for inexplicably low prices, but there are many more nationalities in this industry that don't stand a chance to work in their own country that will probably be more than happy for a new location becoming available for high profile work.

The Brits might stop for a moment to be pissed off too, if they weren't all trying to move to, or come back to, 'Stralya



Montreal is way easier to settle down than Vancouver. Vancouver house prices/rent are insanely high, nobody on a CG salary can afford a house here except the very very few. It is not San Francisco bad yet but getting there.
 
Old 02 February 2013   #48
Originally Posted by SheepFactory: Montreal is way easier to settle down than Vancouver. Vancouver house prices/rent are insanely high, nobody on a CG salary can afford a house here except the very very few. It is not San Francisco bad yet but getting there.


Van's housing market has been on a down trend since mid-late last year, alongside a few other big markets, but we're talking small amounts. The influx of foreign money is what Vancouver is. Its not a city made for canadians to live in, not unless you're talking old money. All development has been built and marketed to chinese money for the past 5-7 yrs more than usual, and its been great for the developers there. Now however, things seem to be slowing down a bit.

Montreal vs Vancouver living cost differences are quite large. Not large enough that 50k in Montreal is worth 140k in Vancouver, but they're substantial.
 
Old 02 February 2013   #49
Originally Posted by evolucian: Montreal vs Vancouver living cost differences are quite large. Not large enough that 50k in Montreal is worth 140k in Vancouver, but they're substantial.


Agreed. When I moved to Montreal from Vancouver, my salary (same amount, same company) went down $500 a month just for income taxes alone.

Property tax etc are also quite a bit higher in Montreal.

So Vancouver is un-affordable when it comes to housing, but everything else is pretty nice
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Old 02 February 2013   #50
Originally Posted by ThE_JacO: and the worst coffee in the world


OT - Ok its not Italie -but the *worst*?! If you keep away from the predictable franchises you can find something quite nice. But true you might have to do some R&D.

B-OT Being a transplant to Montreal of nearly 20 years I can't say I am ungrateful for the attention its getting. But I too wonder if it is just an Industry cycle...
 
Old 02 February 2013   #51
Originally Posted by kees: Agreed. When I moved to Montreal from Vancouver, my salary (same amount, same company) went down $500 a month just for income taxes alone.

Property tax etc are also quite a bit higher in Montreal.

So Vancouver is un-affordable when it comes to housing, but everything else is pretty nice


in Quebec, federal taxes are the same (as BC, Ontario,etc) but the provicial taxes are near double to others.

They tax a lot but also provide a lot. Free daycare, ridiculously low college and university program tuition fees, government provided auto insurance,etc which are things you'd pay for privately in the other provinces (may be subsidized to a specific % in terms of daycare, but far from "free).

It depends on whether your needs are met. If you have kids needing daycare or college education, or if you drive high-insurance rate cars, Quebec is the place to be. If not, you may like it more elsewhere. In Vancouver all that non-taxed money pretty much goes into your rent fees, same could be argued for Toronto (though there's more renting options, so you find more at both extremes of cheap and expensive).
 
Old 02 February 2013   #52
Originally Posted by evolucian: Free daycare, ridiculously low college and university program tuition fees, government provided auto insurance,etc which are things you'd pay for privately in the other provinces (may be subsidized to a specific % in terms of daycare, but far from "free).

I haven't come across free daycare-but yes $7-a-day daycare is what ya hope the get here.

However if you live (or work) in the wrong neighbourhood the waiting lists can be *years* (as in your child is starting school by the time their name comes up). But if ya get it (and i got it) yes its a huge savings compared to other places in the world to raise kids (daycare costing more than your rent/mortgage payments...! yowsa!)
 
Old 02 February 2013   #53
Originally Posted by circusboy: OT - Ok its not Italie -but the *worst*?! If you keep away from the predictable franchises you can find something quite nice. But true you might have to do some R&D.

Well, marginally OT. Caffeine fueled this industry for decades

Yeah, I'd say that for random, walk-in coffee it was really, really bad. While there are many cities I haven't visited, of the many I have Montreal consistently offered the worst coffee.

I'm sure with enough local knowledge and hot spotting you can find some venues that offer good brews, but walking anywhere to grab a coffee on the fly (something that in Italy or Oz will yield good chances of solid java) is like playing russian roulette with a revolver that has five out of six bullets rolling

Softimage's old HQ on Rue Saint Laurent had possibly THE worst coffee I have experienced in my life.

Rejoyce though, when someone talks about a city and the worst thing coming to mind is the coffee, it's clearly not too badly off.

/semi-OT
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Old 02 February 2013   #54
Originally Posted by ThE_JacO: Softimage's old HQ on Rue Saint Laurent had possibly THE worst coffee I have experienced in my life.


I preferred to think of it as "lukewarm brown liquid containing caffeine". That way, I was never disappointed.

But seriously after they replaced the old beige machines, it was fairly good. Not gourmet, but quite drinkable.

If you go to a proper coffee shop in Mtl, you'll probably get a pretty good or at least decent cup. If you go into a depanneur and serve yourself from one of those automated machines, or worse one of those pots that's been sitting on the burner for who knows how long, you'll get what you deserve.

BTW the Softimage coffee notwithstanding, the worst cup I ever had was in Oxford.
 
Old 02 February 2013   #55
Originally Posted by PerryDS: The issue about Alberta is that we have not much else other than oil. Film industry and cg type work in this province is very thin, so I do a lot of web dev work to compensate. We do have tax grants, but not much of a base to feed off it or build anything credible.



I'm running into guys not even 21 yet who are earning over $100 000 a year working in the Oil and Gas industry in Alberta.

Money and jobs are definitely in Alberta, especially in the Oil and Gas Sector.
 
Old 02 February 2013   #56
Originally Posted by Ismail: I'm running into guys not even 21 yet who are earning over $100 000 a year working in the Oil and Gas industry in Alberta.

Money and jobs are definitely in Alberta, especially in the Oil and Gas Sector.


I can confirm that. My own son is doing very well in the Oil sector. Long may it last.
 
Old 02 February 2013   #57
Originally Posted by wildjj: I can confirm that. My own son is doing very well in the Oil sector. Long may it last.


NICE!

Looking at about 400 years reserves of oil and gas in Alberta. Quebec has similar oil and gas reserves as Alberta that have yet to be explored.
 
Old 02 February 2013   #58
Originally Posted by Ismail: I'm running into guys not even 21 yet who are earning over $100 000 a year working in the Oil and Gas industry in Alberta.

Money and jobs are definitely in Alberta, especially in the Oil and Gas Sector.



If I had any idea on how to break into the oil sector in Alberta I would probably do it today.
 
Old 02 February 2013   #59
Originally Posted by SheepFactory: If I had any idea on how to break into the oil sector in Alberta I would probably do it today.



Not as hard as you think. They need people. Companies go as far as doing fly in and fly out. Meaning they fly people in to do the job and fly them home, and do it again. 14 days on 7 days off. From engineers, to laborers, to skilled trades workers. Flights from Vancouver, Calgary and Edmonton (mostly from these two cities.). They definitely need people willing to work.
 
Old 02 February 2013   #60
Just watch out for the scams. Apparently there is a thriving drug and prostitution sector in Alberta to get money out of the young naive oil workers or so I have read.
 
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