Potential client upset at my estimate.

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Old 01 January 2013   #16
I dont know how anyone can say it's too low, or that it's too high, given what you have said, grundelboy.

I can think of about 50 questions regarding this shoot that need to be answered, and for me only with knowing the answers could one give a quote. Because from what you've stated, you could have an (relatively) straight forward job, or you could still be finishing it next year.

So to state that your was a good price or no, is dependent on the info you(or they) give, what questions you ask and what answers are given.

I dont think you can count the B list, it does not effect your job. And unless you know what or not are the terms of their contract, you dont know if they are doing it because ???? (fill in the blank), so you shouldn't make inferences from it.
 
Old 01 January 2013   #17
Originally Posted by cojam: I dont know how anyone can say it's too low, or that it's too high, given what you have said, grundelboy.

I can think of about 50 questions regarding this shoot that need to be answered, and for me only with knowing the answers could one give a quote. Because from what you've stated, you could have an (relatively) straight forward job, or you could still be finishing it next year.

So to state that your was a good price or no, is dependent on the info you(or they) give, what questions you ask and what answers are given.

I dont think you can count the B list, it does not effect your job. And unless you know what or not are the terms of their contract, you dont know if they are doing it because ???? (fill in the blank), so you shouldn't make inferences from it.


The fact that you can ask 50 questions regarding this shoot, makes you already more of an informed professional (and probably more expensive already out of the door) Some just jump blindly into assignments for a couple of coins.

I think the OP does a good thing by not budging. If someone gets scared of this amount, in the field of A/V , you don't know a lot about AV productions. More often than not it is hard to work with people who are unknowledgeable.
 
Old 01 January 2013   #18
True we don't know that much about the project grundelboy, can you post some more info?
Run time and comparable styles ect?
 
Old 01 January 2013   #19
I tell friends all the time that they can't afford me to set up their networks, repair their computers, or show them how to use their iMacs. Heck, I don't even own most of the fancy stuff they have LOL- Love seeing ppl with MacBook Pros who use them to surf the web.

Stick to your rate- you cut the guy a deal- it's human nature to want things for less/free. You will regret it if you don't stick to your guns.
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Old 01 January 2013   #20
there is no other style then "PIXAR like".
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Old 01 January 2013   #21
Originally Posted by x70: True we don't know that much about the project grundelboy, can you post some more info?
Run time and comparable styles ect?

The Style is a mix between a nightmare before christmas and the look from the new Oz trailer. But the majority of the project will have a cool silvery black and white look with 10% set in the real world and will be in color. ( For the 90% Black and White part think of the game LIMBO but in 3D with live action actors and Zbrush sculpted environments and characters)

And initially when I was contacted it was for a 2 min trailer. I reviewed the material and the shots and said that I was interested in taking on the project and didn't imagine the complexity to be too overbearing.

The Client said wonderful and contacted me later once he had picture lock. The scope of the project had changed drastically and was now 8 min long. I did a price breakdown of the project scene by scene and came up with $18,500 because I have a lot of prebuilt assets I could pull from.
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Last edited by grundelboy : 01 January 2013 at 04:26 PM.
 
Old 01 January 2013   #22
Originally Posted by grundelboy: I feel like I was giving a HUGE price break because this guys is just starting out and I want to see him make it.

Ah, that should tell you everything.
People just starting out have no idea what things cost and expect everything to be free.

Let him hire some students and fail. It builds character.
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Old 01 January 2013   #23
You'll get used to it, dont worry.


And yes, you gave him a damn cheap price.
 
Old 01 January 2013   #24
Originally Posted by grundelboy: The Style is a mix between a nightmare before christmas and the look from the new Oz trailer. But the majority of the project will have a cool silvery black and white look with 10% set in the real world and will be in color. ( For the 90% Black and White part think of the game LIMBO but in 3D with live action actors and Zbrush sculpted environments and characters)

And initially when I was contacted it was for a 2 min trailer. I reviewed the material and the shots and said that I was interested in taking on the project and didn't imagine the complexity to be too overbearing.

The Client said wonderful and contacted me later once he had picture lock. The scope of the project had changed drastically and was now 8 min long. I did a price breakdown of the project scene by scene and came up with $18,500 because I have a lot of prebuilt assets I could pull from.


grundelboy, after the updated info, i can see why you posted here, you want to help the man but such a large variation, is and always will be a problem. It might also be a problem if you get it, because for that much to change, means that whatever you did/do could be subject to that much change again. Which would make the quote even though its a good price, subject to so much stress, I think your enthusiasm would disappear faster than a rabbit down a hole.

I'd leave it alone for now, let him think about the styles, the cost, the changes, hopefully he settles down and actually lock's in what he wants and makes the changes now, which in the long run is best for everyone.

Most importantly he finally figures out what this story is all about, and how best to tell it, because right now he seems to be pulling it out of a hat.
 
Old 01 January 2013   #25
Originally Posted by grundelboy: The Style is a mix between a nightmare before christmas and the look from the new Oz trailer. But the majority of the project will have a cool silvery black and white look with 10% set in the real world and will be in color. ( For the 90% Black and White part think of the game LIMBO but in 3D with live action actors and Zbrush sculpted environments and characters)

And initially when I was contacted it was for a 2 min trailer. I reviewed the material and the shots and said that I was interested in taking on the project and didn't imagine the complexity to be too overbearing.

The Client said wonderful and contacted me later once he had picture lock. The scope of the project had changed drastically and was now 8 min long. I did a price breakdown of the project scene by scene and came up with $18,500 because I have a lot of prebuilt assets I could pull from.


I recently saw the ultra low-budget movie Adam Chaplin.

It´s an Italian splatter/fight movie with lots of exploding heads, limbs being ripped off, some comp shots of a CGI building in a real environment etc.

The splatter fx are a combination f very simple gory animatronics and CGI (to paste actors faces unto a dummy head that has to be sliced up...stuff like that.

I´m bringing this movie up here bc apparently it had a budget of only 20K. Obviously it shows, the whole thing is really very low-key. But it works, because it follows through with the cheap style and concentrates on outlandish action.

I´m sure the CGI guy in AC didn´t get the 20K, and that they probably have some arrangement in place.

But OK, that´s a geek movie and probably they´re a group of friends. Doesn´t apply here.

Under regular circumstances your estimate seems low for what you described. Unless the cost of greenn and lighting etc etc is not covered in the 20K. In that case it seems reasonable for a freelance gig of a few weeks.

But in that case they can´t expect super-realistic high quality and would have to adopt some kind of stylization imposed by what you can do for that amount.

Sorry, I´m rambling...hope it can give you some ideas.

Good luck.
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Old 01 January 2013   #26
Originally Posted by grundelboy: I think I just burned a bridge by submitting an estimate for a project totaling $18,500. The project has 50+ shots shot on green, camera tracking is needed full CGI background and some minor animated characters. Does this sound unreasonable for a VFX Indie film budget with a B list celebrity name attached?



Charge based on your work, not based on the project's estimated cost.
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Old 01 January 2013   #27
Originally Posted by NanoGator: Charge based on your work, not based on the project's estimated cost.

QFA,

out
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Old 01 January 2013   #28
Originally Posted by NanoGator: Charge based on your work, not based on the project's estimated cost.




Please elaborate more on this, I would like to know more.
 
Old 01 January 2013   #29
Originally Posted by goodshoes: Please elaborate more on this, I would like to know more.


My guess is, in short, he is telling you to charge based on (your) working hours.
 
Old 01 January 2013   #30
Originally Posted by grundelboy: I think I just burned a bridge by submitting an estimate for a project totaling $18,500. The project has 50+ shots shot on green, camera tracking is needed full CGI background and some minor animated characters. Does this sound unreasonable for a VFX Indie film budget with a B list celebrity name attached?


I personally think you are out of your depth and your setting up yourself for a big fail. 7 to 10k for a basic shot and that's with people who know what they are doing on set.

B
 
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