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Old 12-20-2012, 03:38 PM   #46
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Quote:
Originally Posted by leigh
I absolutely cannot understand how you can sit there and deny that US culture has a strong vein of paranoia running through it. I seem to recall saying this before to you, but I'll repeat it: I'm very well travelled, and the US is by far the most paranoid place I've ever been, starting right from the treatment you receive at the airport on arrival.


Unfortunately, the U.S. Government and American Mainstream Media directly and deliberately engineer the paranoia you are talking about.

Americans are constantly told that XYZ Police State-like measures are necessary, otherwise the big bad terrorists from the Middle East will strike again...

Examples:

"We need to X-Ray your body and search you down to your underwear to protect attacks against airliners".

"We need to log all phone calls, text messages, internet usage and skype conversations, otherwise, again, the big bad terrorists will strike again!"

"We need to become suspicious when people opt to pay with cash at stores. Any amount over 10 Dollars paid in cash may be a sign that the person is a terrorist."

This - to me rather daft - attitude translates into American made computer games like Call of Duty or Battlefield 3 as well.

All game-guns are based on real models, the combat action is fast & fierce, and the game's overarching objective is to fight the "Eastern Evildoers" using unrestrained armed force, which makes you a "hero" or "winner".

Of course part of the reason why so many Military shooter games are made in the last few years is so Uncle Sam's Army gets a steady stream of young recruits/volunteers who are inspired by jingoistic ra-ra-ra in these games, and can easily be persuaded to use lethal force against "evildoers overseas".

The whole thing is a huge moral & ethical mess in my opinion.

It is like America cannot stand the idea of a "normalization of affairs", where, say, paying for a mobile phone with 420 Dollars in cash does not make you an instant "person of interest" or "suspicious person".

My 2 Cents...
 
Old 12-20-2012, 04:00 PM   #47
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They don't engineer the paranoia, they simply stoke it. It's been simmering there since the Cold War. Just look at the frighteningly high numbers of US citizens who believe things like the 9/11 truther movement, that doubt Obama's US citizenship, that believe their religion is "under attack" by the government, even the tediously inevitable annual "Christmas is under attack!" that's hit the headlines of certain media outlets recently, etc - these are all paranoid fantasies (of course, anyone reading this who believes these will no doubt be thinking "that's what they want you to believe!"). This "under attack" rhetoric is the angle usually taken by these particular media outlets and politicians to whip up fear and paranoia in people, and sadly it works. It fosters a climate of persecution which in turn breeds paranoia, which causes problems not only domestically but also internationally; ask the average American about the conflicts the US is engaged in, and a large percentage of them will say something along the lines of "they're fighting for our freedom". What freedom, exactly? And how is a war halfway around the world ensuring the freedom of the US people anyway? See, this is a classic outcome of a culture of persecution; they believe their country and values are under attack from some undefined spectre at all times.

At any rate, my post has really veered off topic now and is going into the realms of political and social commentary that don't belong on this site so I'll stop there. Suffice to say that I can only hope that one day soon America takes a long, honest look at itself and embarks on a proper campaign to improve things. When you look at the positive side of America - their focus on family, their generosity, and their unwavering determination and ambition - it seems such a waste that these other rotten elements in their social strata are tearing those apart. When I read the news headlines about the Newtown shooting, my first thought was "ugh, not another one" because this has sadly become an almost uniquely American phenomenon.
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Old 12-20-2012, 04:02 PM   #48
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It's high time you American tax payers stood up and yelled 'ENOUGH ALREADY'. If the government wants to instigate an expensive survey that all their friends and relatives are involved in plus the kickbacks they will assuredly get, plus the publicity shooting for the dissatisfaction vote.

They can finance it themselves See how long that lasts. Doesnt Rockefeller have enough of your money already?

Really there are so many things you have to fix (well we all have to fix) instead of futzing about trying to create a variation on a solution the film industry has had for a long long time. What an astounding waste of time and resources.

To quote Brick:

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Old 12-20-2012, 04:13 PM   #49
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I am personally against censorship, and honestly I think we are due for some decent gun control laws here in the US. (And BTW we are on the knife's edge of the no politics forum rule)



But having said that,

Missions in FPS that are just pure nihilism bother the hell out of me.



Case in point.

The Modern Warfare 2 Airport Mission
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gXBDkevx5lM



I do think there is a industry wide discussion that should be started about going too far, in terms of violence, in a game.

But of course that not the intention of those clowns in the US Congress.
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Last edited by RobertoOrtiz : 12-20-2012 at 04:17 PM.
 
Old 12-20-2012, 04:18 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by earwax69
As far as media/games go, I think MTV is a lot more to blame than video games for gun violence in the US. Thug life, yeah right.


I think the key is to stop desensitizing our society.

It's a whole cultural thing, not just video games. It's all media (games, movies, tv, news, etc) with a bombardment of guns and hostile themes. That is our reality now.

Having armed teachers is stupid. They go nuts too and do stupid things too.

Personally I would prefer to see tax dollars have more cops around and taking a shift in schools. I've seen a reduction in violence in my kids schools when an armed cop is roaming the halls. The visual deterent alone is usually enough. That and bullet proof glass and those really nice kevlar polo shirts and casual wear.

Last edited by XLNT-3d : 12-20-2012 at 04:22 PM.
 
Old 12-20-2012, 04:19 PM   #51
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I find it interesting people defend video games then immediately blame guns, you are also part of the problem.
 
Old 12-20-2012, 04:20 PM   #52
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I had no problem with the Modern Warfare airport mission. I think art has a duty to be provocative sometimes, and in this case, I applaud the developer's bravery with that mission. I absolutely believe it served a purpose in the story, and as such I'd not consider it nihilistic.
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Old 12-20-2012, 04:22 PM   #53
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Quote:
Originally Posted by BigPixolin
I find it interesting people defend video games then immediately blame guns, you are also part of the problem.


Did someone do that in this thread?
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Old 12-20-2012, 04:28 PM   #54
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that airport mission is some seriously sick piece of shit entertainment. Totally f*cked up writers to come up with that kind of shit for entertainment.

That's the kind of crap that is definitely polluting and desensitizing. That shit would never fly in my house and I would quit a company before producing that shit even for adults.
 
Old 12-20-2012, 04:30 PM   #55
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Kanga
It's high time you American tax payers stood up and yelled 'ENOUGH ALREADY'. If the government wants to instigate an expensive survey that all their friends and relatives are involved in plus the kickbacks they will assuredly get, plus the publicity shooting for the dissatisfaction vote.

They can finance it themselves See how long that lasts. Doesnt Rockefeller have enough of your money already?

Really there are so many things you have to fix (well we all have to fix) instead of futzing about trying to create a variation on a solution the film industry has had for a long long time. What an astounding waste of time and resources.

To quote Brick:

'Dum Ass'


It's true, there was already a case last year in California about violent video games, it ended up costing at least $2 million
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Old 12-20-2012, 04:34 PM   #56
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XLNT-3d
that airport mission is some seriously sick piece of shit entertainment. Totally f*cked up writers to come up with that kind of shit for entertainment.

That's the kind of crap that is definitely polluting and desensitizing. That shit would never fly in my house and I would quit a company before producing that shit even for adults.


Why is it any more sick than the rest of the game? Killing is killing, from a purely moral standpoint. Did you play the game yourself? Do you know what the context of the mission was? I'm assuming from your post that you didn't and don't.

Also, can you prove that games are desensitising? Because last I heard, the jury is still out on that one.
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Old 12-20-2012, 04:35 PM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by XLNT-3d
that airport mission is some seriously sick piece of shit entertainment. Totally f*cked up writers to come up with that kind of shit for entertainment.

That's the kind of crap that is definitely polluting and desensitizing. That shit would never fly in my house and I would quit a company before producing that shit even for adults.


Part of the problem I think with games is that many of them want to be movies. Certainly with COD, half of the game isn't even an interactive experience (scripted events, vehicle/turret missions, stealth missions where they tell you exactly what to do, what's the point?)

But that's a sort of general games issue. As someone pointed out, games are available all around the world yet these events are different from what happens in other countries.
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Old 12-20-2012, 04:46 PM   #58
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I would contest that this is not a unique to America, there have been plenty of cases throughout history of mass killings.. it just seems to be the focus due to media bias.

I'm fairly certain, that statistically... gun related mass shootings in America has mostly been on the decline during the 2000's, and actually was at all time highs during the 1990's when America had strict prohibition for semi-automatic weapons. I wish i had a quick link to share on this, but I'm certain I have read this.

I wish it was a simple fix for all of our sake, but it honestly isn't just a single attribute or characteristic that is the cause.

and I believe that this is what Leigh was originally pointing out... that how quick we are to focus on something, that honestly may only be a part of a much larger.. systemic societal problem... one that is not limited to America.
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Old 12-20-2012, 04:59 PM   #59
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Quote:
Originally Posted by tswalk
I would contest that this is not a unique to America, there have been plenty of cases throughout history of mass killings.. it just seems to be the focus due to media bias.


Not even close to as much in America though. Whatever the causes, a discussion I think is meant for another forum, it is most certainly something more prevalent in the US than other developed countries. Unfortunately it isn't a quick fix with over-night legislation, it's a long and arduous journey towards a better future. Changing an ingrained property of a culture is extremely difficult. (which one do you think the media will report?)
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Old 12-20-2012, 05:16 PM   #60
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I thought they did this study at least 2 or 3 times before. It always came up empty. maybe they think this time it will be different.

They blamed rock and roll until TV came along then it was violent TV until video games came along and now they are the scape goat. Honesty we have 400 million americans most of them watching TV and playing some kind of violent game at least some point in their life. If not actually beating each other with sticks playing flash gordon and robin hood or shooting each other with cap guns playing the lone ranger if they came from that generation and in all of those millions some 3 or 4 people snapped and started shooting up schools. the problem isn't the violent TV, music, game, what ever comes next it is something that happened to those individuals.
 
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