Movies that "made a differance"

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  10 October 2012
Originally Posted by leigh: On the contrary, that scene is one of the most horrifying scenes of callous inhumanity ever to grace the screen. It doesn't glamourise war, it does the complete opposite by showing viewers how war transforms people into husks of their former selves, so devoid of empathy that they napalm civilians while thinking about surfing.


Its how its perceived nowadays. Do people remember the anti war message?
Nope--its all about the spectacle of that scene and the music. Its really hard to change society's perceptions about something like war--its like crime-people hate it but it still happens. Dont see a movie changing that.


And on the Private Ryan bullet thing-reminds me of something I read about the maker of the machine gun--he called it the gun to end war because he believed that when people saw what a gun can do to a body-they would outlaw it.

I think da Vinci knew better. Legend has it he didnt publish his submarine design because he thought people would assassinate each other under the sea.

One of my favorite books is the Iliad--all about war. Pretty fair with both sides--itdidnt stop war either.
I dont think an anti-war movie can really change society--but that's separate from the Truffaut observations.
 
  10 October 2012
Originally Posted by leigh: On the contrary, that scene is one of the most horrifying scenes of callous inhumanity ever to grace the screen. It doesn't glamourise war, it does the complete opposite by showing viewers how war transforms people into husks of their former selves, so devoid of empathy that they napalm civilians while thinking about surfing.

The entire film shows war in a very negative light. Willard's narration is one of increasingly fragmented introspection amidst the horror, and the cloying, oppressive atmosphere and increasingly sinister and bizarre environment further enhances this negative image. The film's story is a metaphor for the emotional journey experienced by many soldiers - as Willard's boat moves further upstream, he and his companions become increasingly detached from reality, moving into darkness (the "Heart of Darkness" which the original novel, from which the film was adapted, was named).

I really can't imagine how you could say this film glamourises war. It's the complete opposite, not only anti war in general, but also quite specifically critical of the Vietnam War.


Huh, I wrote almost this exact reply and ff crashed and I didn't have time to re-write it. The fact that Kilgore had dramatically choreographed the attack and supplied his own rousing soundtrack says volumes about how Americans saw that war. There are just so many little things, like peopledying on the ground and choppers being shot down while he sips his coffee, that set this scene apart.

That said, Kilgore (the name alone should tip you off) is one of the most fascinating characters in any movie ever. For a real mind-f*ck, watch the AN Redux version with the extended Kilgore scene. It kind of ruins the character and makes him into a cartoon. But it's a great example of how leaving something out can actually add depth to a character.
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  10 October 2012
For fans of Apocalypse now I STRONGLY suggest you catch the doc
"Hearts of Darkness: The Making of Apocalypse Now"

The making of this masterpiece was an insane experience.
Also I would recommend these anti war movies


Das Boot, Full Metal Jacket
and
Paths of Glory
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Last edited by RobertoOrtiz : 10 October 2012 at 04:17 AM.
 
  10 October 2012
Saving Private Ryan - This film I think was the first one I saw where I finally saw battle sequences I had no wish in being a part of.

I was actually distracted for a time... thinking about what a terrible time it must have been to be part of D-Day. I mean imagine you're the first guy in those landing boats... you're like... "Well I guess this is it."

Maybe I'm easy or something. But the opening sequence is burned in my mind forever. Like that guy picking up his arm, or the flame throwers....
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  10 October 2012
Blade Runner in my opinion was pretty influential, not on the rela world, but the film world. The cyberpunk look it established has been the standard for a nasty run down future look.

The documentary Restrepo hit me pretty hard. It was about some young soldiers that established a Firebase in the korengal valley, Afganistan. while there, they were surrounded by hostiles, regularly under fire and it just ingeneral looked like a pretty horrid place to be. The film crew that was embedded with them recorded some very intense moments. The opening sequence when they were in a convoy of humvees and get ambushed was pretty crazy. the mic on the camera was damaged so there was no sound. And the ambush in the middle of the documentary stuck with me more then any other documentary i have ever seen. The documentary had no narration, the camera operator rarely asked questions and there was no music, other then what was recorded by the camera mic.

I remember Requiem for a Dream having a very big emotional effect on me as well.

A movie i hope has a positive effect on the world of film making is Inception, proof that you can have a story and action and special effects and that you do not have to be a sequel, remake or reboot.
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  10 October 2012
I looked it up--Truffaut's view was that you can never truly make an anti war film because just the act of showing warfare on screen makes it exciting. I think one can back up his point with the fact that when people highlight Apocalypse Now they don't focus on Sheen or Brando-they focus on Duvall and the helicopter attack. They do NOT focus on the villagers being killed.
Just the attack and him saying it smells like victory. You can say people should be looking in him in a negative fashion but I think that's suspect. He is made to be cool in a way despite the intentions.
Like the Terminator blowing away cops in the police station.
http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.p...DoThisCoolThing
 
  10 October 2012
Originally Posted by CGIPadawan: This film I think was the first one I saw where I finally saw battle sequences I had no wish in being a part of.

I have stood in a field with an AK47 for real by happenstance,.... I had the same feeling as that sequence I will never forget and don't want to repeat.
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Last edited by Kanga : 10 October 2012 at 07:16 AM.
 
  10 October 2012
One anti-war film that no one has mentioned yet which I personally love is The Good, The Bad and The Ugly. The whole sequence with the two armies fighting over the bridge is brilliant. Awesome film.

Which makes me think of Tarantino who has certainly influenced a new generation of film makers, most notably with Pulp Fiction.

Jaws was mentioned previously. It's impact on the industry cannot be understated as it was the first true blockbuster with nation wide release and changed the way films were distributed.

The Rules of the Game and Breathless are two French films that had massive influence in terms of style (both on and off the screen) as well as social commentary. Renoir and Goddard respectively.

I feel like any list of important films should include something by Tarkovski because so many people have been influenced by his work ... personally I like Stalker.

The Graduate made a lasting impact in Hollywood with its everyman lead.

Asian cinema has had a lot of important films to come out of there. You've got the Art House revival in asian headed by Wong Kar-Wai with Chung King Express, HK action cinema with the Shaw Brothers and their contemporaries. Then films like Killers and Police Story which helped bring HK cinema to the USA. Also Enter the Dragon earlier than the above, brilliant.

And obviously from Japan Kurosawa was incredibly influential. Rashamon is probably my favourate film of all time and is incredibly important in cinematic history. First it was the first Japanese film to really be exported. Secondly it was a treatese on post-modernism and subjectivity that was well ahead of its time, and Thirdly it was shot using so many interesting techniques that it's rightly considered a classic.

I imagine Potempkin was already mentioned but if not ... well yeah, inventing the montage right there.

Snow White, massive influence on animation as a valid feature format.

Night of the Living Dead and Psycho were the two films I think probably launched the thriller and horror genres. NotLD being zombie horror and Psycho before it with the low-budget sell-ability to horror.

Anyway there's heaps more films that had influence of various kinds but those are ones that a more-or-less dear to me
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  10 October 2012
Originally Posted by kelgy: I looked it up--Truffaut's view was that you can never truly make an anti war film because just the act of showing warfare on screen makes it exciting. I think one can back up his point with the fact that when people highlight Apocalypse Now they don't focus on Sheen or Brando-they focus on Duvall and the helicopter attack. They do NOT focus on the villagers being killed.
Just the attack and him saying it smells like victory. You can say people should be looking in him in a negative fashion but I think that's suspect. He is made to be cool in a way despite the intentions.


But he isn't shown to be cool, he is clearly depicted as having lost his humanity, and is cast in a 100% negative light. You'd have to be a completely brainwashed jarhead to look at him and think he's cool. And of course people remember the villagers being killed, as that's what the helicopters are doing.

I find your views on this very bizarre. I've never met anyone who shares your opinion.
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  10 October 2012
Originally Posted by leigh: But he isn't shown to be cool, he is clearly depicted as having lost his humanity, and is cast in a 100% negative light. You'd have to be a completely brainwashed jarhead to look at him and think he's cool. And of course people remember the villagers being killed, as that's what the helicopters are doing.

I find your views on this very bizarre. I've never met anyone who shares your opinion.


I agree with both of you to a certain extent. Obviously the scene in question in Apocalypse Now is highly critical both of the war in Vietnam and the United States military. That said the scene is full of action and shot to music, it's iconic and memorable and people who are not interested in the anti-war message find it exciting and entertaining for all the wrong reasons.

It's a difference between the site of the author and the site of the audience *shrug*. I still think it's an anti-war film and while I can appreciate Truffaut's point I don't agree with his conclusion that this invalidates films with an anti-war message.
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  10 October 2012
Hmmm I remember seeing apocalypse now in the theater when I was just a slip of a lad and the film was new I remember the whole thing being a nightmare from beginning to end, the characters to be tortured and twisted and the helicopter attack to be extremely sarcastic. I am no rocket scientist but the hints were so heavy and continuous that even those amongst us who are not the sharpest tools in the shed must have caught on,... surely.

Napalm in the morning must be the most grotesque line ever uttered in cinema. I remember the film being an awful experience but upon reflection an important one.
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  10 October 2012
Originally Posted by Kanga: must be the most grotesque line ever uttered in cinema. I remember the film being an awful experience but upon reflection an important one.

Agreed...

Platoon is also another film that greatly influence how the Vietnam was covered.
The cinicism in that film is so thick you can cut it with a knife.

BTW has anyone here seen a flick called "All is Quiet on the Western Front"

Originally Posted by kelgy: I looked it up--Truffaut's view was that you can never truly make an anti war film because just the act of showing warfare on screen makes it exciting. I think one can back up his point with the fact that when people highlight Apocalypse Now they don't focus on Sheen or Brando-they focus on Duvall and the helicopter attack. They do NOT focus on the villagers being killed.


Coppola did that on purpose.

In a way the movie is an allegory of the history of Vietnam.

From the US, The French Colonialism, etc.



During the Helo Attack Coppolla was showing us how America viewed itself at the time fighting the war, and proceeded to deconstruct that wrongheaded vision during the rest of the film.
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Last edited by RobertoOrtiz : 10 October 2012 at 01:53 PM.
 
  10 October 2012
donnie darko still sticks to my ribs. every time i watch that movie i usually shed a tear. very profound.
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  10 October 2012
Originally Posted by leigh: I find your views on this very bizarre. I've never met anyone who shares your opinion.


At the bottom of the tropes page it says the trope was originally called the Truffaut was right trope so lots of people apparently have said the same.
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  10 October 2012
Originally Posted by flipnap: donnie darko still sticks to my ribs. every time i watch that movie i usually shed a tear. very profound.

Donnie Darko was a brain blender the first time I watched it. There was so much hidden stuff throughout that its very difficult to understand exactly what has happened. I got so obsessed with it that I actually watched the directors commentary version to better understand it. The commentary is the director explaining everything and let me just say, once you hear it, you realize how stupid that movie really is. I like the movie just for the movies sake, but the actual story reads more like a fan fiction.

Hehe, anytime my wife and I disagree about something trivial its almost a guarantee one of us will say, "I'm starting to doubt your commitment to Sparkle Motion!"
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