Practice Practice Practice makes perfect...

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  07 July 2009
hmm, how start...
it's sound very interesting the matter what is a intelligence practicing, find the goals, but for me the problems it's the goal, obvius it's very personal, but usualy i ask, what i do?, for why i do? what i looking for? how my art i likes look like? then is when i feel lost and stuck in the way to really apply a analytical or "prefect" practice... the most hard question for me is what i want to do, some times i don't find an answer...

Be original, or just make the things i like...
Feel presure for encourage myself in practice it's obvious "no pain no gain" but don't do the things i don't like it's a natural stage...

your talk about personality and how some don't fit for be an artist, for me i think it's obvious but, some times you only need find your path.

at last, the cuestion is you want be an artist like the industries want... we need sell and work
Everything is lost... even the hope...
  07 July 2009
Finding your own creative voice and a career path is a very personal thing, and this isn't something others can decide for you. Most creative people have a fairly clear vision of what they ultimately want to be, and the kind of creative work they want to be doing, but it isn't unheard of when someone is able to cope with the technical demands of a creative endeavor, but not as good with creative ideas. Sometimes people like that end up working in a more technical capacity in production studios--for example, rigging, particle effects, rendering, or even modeling, texturing...etc. Often when you specialize in something where you are told exactly what to do, you only have to just do it--not much creative input involved (this isn't to say people working in those jobs are only there because they are uncreative--some are quite creative with their personal works). Artist who are more on the creative side will go for jobs like concept art, storyboarding, animation, illustration, design...etc.

For personal works, it's really no one else's business what you do, and the only person you have to please is yourself. Some people choose to satisfy the basest level of gratification (sex, violence, lowbrow humor...etc) without ever being interested in exploring higher motivations (intellect, emotions, spiritual needs...etc), while some would feel guilty for giving in to the basest instincts without tapping into the higher motivations. No one can define who you are and who you aspire to become except yourself.

Last edited by Lunatique : 07 July 2009 at 03:14 AM.
  07 July 2009

thanks, i think, if we have a hi technical skills , we not will stuck be cause of some "problems" giving to life the ideas, we will have the free to choice, then the problems will what we choice, but you have right, it's a very personal way what we doing with our tools...

i'll need introspect what i want to my self.... XD sound i need a psychologist XD
Everything is lost... even the hope...
  07 July 2009
Hello. I am new to this forum. I am an illustrator, (well, I have just graduated from college) and I was just wondering: What If I am new to digital painting, and I want to learn it from scratch ? i.e. produce a really good painting from start to finish entirely on Photoshop/Painter, - without my stylistic drawing habits/quirks creeping back in ?

Originally Posted by Lunatique: Important stages of growth don't necessarily happen before one made a living as an artist. Whether you make money with your talent/skill is not really a watermark in your artistic journey--plenty of people who make a living as artists are very limited in their skill and even their level of talent--to the point of being dubbed as incompetent or a hack, yet they can still enjoy a career doing it. Which industry you become a pro in does make a difference though--for example, if you want to be a concept artist for film and games, then the accepted skill/talent level would generally be higher than some of the other industries. There's also style and intent. An artist who does abstract or very simple cute greeting card illustration may not have the goal of mastering photorealism, and it would be unreasonable to expect that from such an artist. So one question every aspiring artist needs to answer for himself is "What career path do I want to take?"

Sometimes when I try to learn, I end up integrating my stylised hand-drawn sketches into the final product, using it as a “guide” to help lay down flat colors and blending, - when in reality what I am trying achieve is a full ability to paint digitally, and professionally. My attempts usually end up colored in a “comic-style” which I’m trying to get past. So how do I solve this ? Career-wise, how can I make the transition from being an illustrator, to a concept artist/digital painter?
  07 July 2009
Josh - If you're talking about depicting images using the full dynamic range of values without relying on line art to define details, then it's really just a matter of changing your mentality and seeing everything only in values and lighting and color, not in lines.

One simple way is to fade the opacity of your drawing/sketch layer to a faint 20% or so and keep it as the very top layer. Then, you paint your values and colors underneath that faint drawing/sketch layer, and once the major shapes and lighting/colors are established, you can start to erase away the lines you don't need anymore, or simply paint over those lines on another layer over it.

Some artists don't even do line art at all--they just block in general shapes with values and colors right away and then sort of chisel away at then over the course of the whole painting process. You can try that too.
  07 July 2009
Thanks Lunatique! I guess I just need to see Photoshop as a new tool to try and master then .. So far I have always drawn traditionally but only developed an interest in “game art” when I had to consider career options. You see, because I have been using pens/pencils ever since I was a kid, I always saw a line drawn between the way I used to work back then, and the awesome skill I aspired to achieve in concept art.

Even now, with regards to practice, I know that still drawing traditionally won’t make me a typical professional concept artist. Although I have an interest to try and learn it, at the same time I know I also have an interest in illustration for print, magazines, editorial etc. .. So it’s hard to choose which career path to try to pursue. In my teens, I never had access to stuff like Photoshop, animation programs to be able to learn that stuff, and at the same time I was reading comics, looking at digital art and just being amazed at “How did they create this stuff!?” It was as if, to me, that this industry just came out of nowhere, and I somehow felt that that kind of quality was what I ultimately had to aspire to. Even so, I used to think back then that game artists didn’t arise from the same backgrounds as “ordinary” artists – and I am still surprised that some great work I’ve seen come from artists who never went to art-school. I still ask myself now “Do I have a shot at being a concept artist ? – Or should I just stick with being an illustrator ?”

Originally Posted by Lunatique: ... seeing everything only in values and lighting and color, not in lines.
... just block in general shapes with values and colors right away and then sort of chisel away at then over the course of the whole painting process. You can try that too.

I don’t even know if I can adhere to these things the same way as I do with traditional art – although you make it sound so simple its not as easy to me, even if I am using a Wacom (I will upload one my attempts)
  07 July 2009
Take a look at this tutorial by Craig Mullins. I think you'll see pretty clearly how he approaches that workflow:

Also look in the sticky threads at the top of this forum. I think you'll find many of the tutorials helpful.
  11 November 2009
This is an excellent thread. Sorry, I haven't read all of it (only the few first posts on this thread). I do look forward to read all of it when time permits.

Here's what I do in order to practice my drawing skills. Repetition. Keep drawing the same thing again and again until you are able to draw it perfectly from scratch in a short time. For example, I draw the object in various perspectives, lighting etc (whatever technique needs improving).

Your own style comes in when you are having fun and not worrying too much about critiques/perfection.
  11 November 2009
Lunatique i started with Loomis but i am soo bad that i cannot even draw that human proportion. :(

You can see my sketch here:

Can you help me somehow? Thanks!
  11 November 2009
Aerendyl - How long have you been at it? Remember, it takes time and patience. Try judging angles and curves and distances in a very scientific and rational way, like you are measuring the dimensions of a space. Don't think of it as "this is the shoulder, this is the head, this is the...etc" but try to think in terms of "This is roughly two heads wide, This is a symmetrical oval shape like an egg, this is twice the height of...etc." Be precise. If you were measuring an empty space for a new piece of furniture, you'd have to be precise, otherwise you won't be able to fit the new furniture into that space. That's how precise you ought to be.
  11 November 2009
I have been in it for 10 minutes.

Some ppl recommended me from Gnomon a DVD of Basic drawing, so i will start there because you first do some lines, circles etc. Then i will switch to Loomis.
  11 November 2009
Ok Lunatique, so i have done lines and few thing from the Loomis book. You can see it here -

Now what? Should i repeat this things 100 time or? Thanks!
  11 November 2009

Yea for that first thing, but you can see my second post. I sketched that for around 1h and half.
  11 November 2009
Originally Posted by Aerendyl: I have been in it for 10 minutes. .


We'll - I'm not mutch of a painter/drawer (yet), but I'd answer something like "patience, patience, patience".

Speed comes with practice, before that you just need patience and fate.

Those who can, paint something in half of an hour that still takes a whole day from me. But having that patience increases fate, that even if this now looks awfull, I can make it look better if I just sit here long enought and scratch my wacom.

10 minutes? come on - you are kidding - right?
  11 November 2009
Thumbs up

Originally Posted by Aerendyl: @Halen

Yea for that first thing, but you can see my second post. I sketched that for around 1h and half.

Well, it clears a bit, because 1,5h sounds at least somewhat reasonable to even start anything. And just for the record - didn't mean to be mean. Just couldn't get that 10 minutes...

For me, 10 minutes of training would be something like this:

(open the book, find good place to read it) "hmm. I think I'll need some coffee" (makes some coffee, finds an another good place to read the book). "hmm...where were I...lets' see - yeah - draw something"... and thats it.

I propably misunderstand you on purpose, but do you mean that now you have rehearsed drawing human figures for 1 hour and 40 minutes? Imho those are not so bad for that.

Disclaimer: I don't have that Loomis book so I don't know where would it take you next, and as I stated earlier there are a lot better painters and drawers out there and you may get better advices from them.

So this is just my opinnion, but at this point I don't see a point just drawing lines and circles - at least I'd get boored in 10 seconds. This with an exection that you are not actually working on the quality of your line or learning how to hold the pen or different tools and papers work. If you are going for human figures, I'd make those sketches in different poses for at least a week. Post em to that skecth thread and see if it leads to anything.

Since these are skecthes, one may differ quite a lot from another and it would be usefull to see many of them to give better advice and see possible strengts and weaknesses. You already got some pretty good advice (I think, I'll try them next time also) like Lunatiques:

Quote: Try judging angles and curves and distances in a very scientific and rational way

It would propably help with those last ones too. How about measuring those distanges?

Just keep going. Those seconds are actually better than the first ones already.

Last edited by halen : 11 November 2009 at 09:44 PM. Reason: spell checking
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