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Old 05-19-2005, 06:33 PM   #16
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oops, //What happened here? Some posts are missing from this thread. Moderators?!
Edit: Sorry, wrong post.

Last edited by ashakarc : 05-19-2005 at 11:23 PM.
 
Old 05-20-2005, 04:52 AM   #17
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Gordonm - I'm not so clueless that I need to be explained that tools can do great things in the right hands--I was being sarcastic.

Brushes, pianos, ovens, computers..etc are ALL just tools. In the right hands, they can do wonderful things. That's why I don't think much of the quote. Now, I don't know just how primitive computers were in Picasso's days, but if they had the ability to at least crunch some numbers, then they are definitely useful for the right people. If they weren't even able to do that, then the quote itself has no relevance in today's world, and thus is itself pretty useless IMO.

Last edited by Lunatique : 05-20-2005 at 04:58 AM.
 
Old 05-20-2005, 05:48 AM   #18
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Lunatique
Gordonm - I'm not so clueless that I need to be explained that tools can do great things in the right hands--I was being sarcastic.

Brushes, pianos, ovens, computers..etc are ALL just tools. In the right hands, they can do wonderful things. That's why I don't think much of the quote. Now, I don't know just how primitive computers were in Picasso's days, but if they had the ability to at least crunch some numbers, then they are definitely useful for the right people. If they weren't even able to do that, then the quote itself has no relevance in today's world, and thus is itself pretty useless IMO.



Ya, I caught the sarcasim, and you are obviously NOT clueless. No offense was intended.

As far as the quote - IMHO - when the greatest and most innovative artist of our epoch, crossed paths with and commented on the technology, whose evolutionary descendants, we are now so dependent upon, I think it is worth taking a look.


Gord


btw: To my knowledge, the mainframe computers of 1968 had about 1 meg of ram, and were worth about $10 million dollars.
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Last edited by gordonm : 05-20-2005 at 06:27 AM.
 
Old 05-20-2005, 05:54 AM   #19
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Quote:
Originally Posted by gordonm
Paint brushes are not useless - when wielded by an artist of vision

Pianos are not useless - when placed at the service of a musician who understands the power of music to move us, and can act on that understanding.

Photoshop, Painter, Maya etc are useless tools, unless weilded by intelligent, creative, artistic individuals.

Behind every useful tool, is a person who makes it so.


That last comment is perceived to be different from the other two, though you said the same with with negatives.. rewording

Photoshop, Painter, Maya etc are not useless tools - when weilded by intelligent, creative, artistic individuals.

I dont know why you worded it differntly to ensure you put that these software tools 'are useless', though i will not dwell on it..

we have alot to owe to technology, i was watching a show just lastnight, about how those of the iron age had the exact same intelligence and ability to learn as us now, so bringing a normal baby to this day and age, could easily become anything they wanted.

The main jist of the show, was about how technology and medicine is responsible for destroying our paths of evolution in western countries. How people today survive, and get to pass on their defective genes, throught being kept alive via medicine and technology, long enough to pro create...
its certainly not survival of the fittest anymore... but it went on to talk about how we owe our intelligence to various form of technology, this including books, these methods 'recording' of events, discoveries etc, and how the computer/internet combines all of these things..

anyway im going off the point heer, but fact is, computers advance.. "640k should be enough for anybody" remember...
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Old 05-20-2005, 09:04 AM   #20
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Quote:
Originally Posted by paperclip
Here's a 74 computer..




WOW ! it's widescreen !
Here's what it takes to render this smiley () in 1970's



Now imagine this smiley ( )

Note: These guy's took years to render a pixel of a smiley.

Last edited by ??? : 05-20-2005 at 09:11 AM.
 
Old 05-20-2005, 11:00 AM   #21
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Quote:
when the greatest and most innovative artist of our epoch, crossed paths with and commented on the technology


True, he was a creative genius, quite smart, good with the ladies and good at selling himself, and he grew to become very old and wise in the ways of the world... but that doesn't make him Noam Chomsky. I'd take that quote of his with a big pinch of salt, smells like cliche wrapped in wordplay; designed to impress...

Or it may have been honestly prompted by
1. fear of the unknown (don't tell me he actually knew much about computers),
2. resistance to forced change (we're all very conservative that way, even those of us who like to experiment), or
3. the artist's fear that art (or indeed everything) would be corrupted by greedy industrialists and their horrid mechanical devices...
 
Old 05-20-2005, 11:47 AM   #22
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Hard to imagine Picasso as a luddite. As I said before, he would likely have embraced it, had it been the way it is today. Also, for reasons Stahlberg put forth above, it is understandable that he didn't.

I bet Leonardo would have the time of his life in our age--all the wonderful advancements in technology would have helped him SO much in his studies. I wonder if we'll have another Leonardo in our time?
 
Old 05-20-2005, 12:29 PM   #23
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stahlberg
True, he was a creative genius, quite smart, good with the ladies and good at selling himself, and he grew to become very old and wise...
Picaso was more than a bit of a jerk.

He is not a man that should be admired, or whose opinon should be cared about, but I guess people will forgive any behaivor if the person is talented enough.

Recommended reading: "Life with Picasso" by Francoise Gilot, wife to Picasso
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Old 05-20-2005, 12:34 PM   #24
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If Picasso was around now we'd probably be talking to him in this very thread and checking out his entry in the Master and Servant challenge.
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Old 05-20-2005, 01:39 PM   #25
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i think picasso would gone psycho after seeing stahlbergs art and he might evan buy a copy of photoshop and burn it.......take a pic of it with a digital camera and post it on his own weird abstract website with really bad coding as a state ment to all artist that the computers are evil...ummm ......he was a contraversal guy.....again i think it would be me doing that if i was him but who am i to say what he'ed do....i'm just a rookie.
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Last edited by THECLYKE : 05-20-2005 at 01:44 PM.
 
Old 05-20-2005, 02:11 PM   #26
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Remember that old story of Icarus, why build wings, and came realy near to the sun, so the wax holding the feathers melted, and he felt from the sky?

I think itīs the same with artists. There are many men who are creative. I would explain creativity as something subconscious. Itīs the influence and the ideas of our subconscious mind that make us creative. Sometimes we donīt even have to think about it. Once we close our eyes, we might start to see pictures, sceneries complex enough, that it would take days or even weeks to paint them.
But they donīt stay constant, they are changing, getting disturbed by new pictures, and different ideas. Most people are not able to carry their ideas because the carrying structure, the we we do is to week.
Sometimes itīs like someone is throwing 2000 balls at you, and you try to catch them all. Thatīs what beginners do. They are not uncreative, they just have a high degree of diffusion. Experience artist develope something like a concept, a method. They build it up procedurally. They catch one ball at a time, and if they are experienced enough, their concepts will carrie them to extreme hights without melting.

Those procedures have sometimes a high tendency towards computing. They can be very strict and precise, there are decisions made, and they are compatible to both, the creative mind, and exact tools like the computer.

In fact all tools are just a manifestation of concepts. They wouldnīt exist if the wouldnīt solve a purpose, and in the field of art it is allways the carrying of ideas.

I still wonder why Picasso said that, cos he was both, a good craftsman, and a highly creative person. Anyway, Iīm sure he would like photoshop or painter.
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Old 05-20-2005, 02:44 PM   #27
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Laeng
Anyway, Iīm sure he would like photoshop or painter.

WISE WORDS

BUT.....

MY GRANDFATHER LOVES SPORTS BUT AS SOON AS VIDEO GAMES CAME OUT HE SAID IT WAS A GOING TO TURN YOU INTO A BLOB....NOW PICASSO ...IF HE WERE AROUND MAY HAVE LIKED PHOTOSHOP OR PAINTER...BUT IT WOULD BE THE RESULT OF HIS OFFSPRING PISSING HIM OFF AND THEM HIM REALIZING IT'S A TOOL. NO ONE COULD SAY HEY PICASSO HERES PHOTOSHOP....ESPECAILY BECAUSE HE'S SO CLOSE TO HIS PAINTINGS...IMAGINE ART NOW WITHOUT COMPUTERS.....EVERY ARTIST CAN'T CREATE IMAGES MORE FASTER AND MORE RESPECTABLE TO THE PRICIPLES ART WITHOUT MESSING UP 1050 TIMES ON THE ONE PAINTING...THE OPTION CTL Z IS OUT...WHICH WOULD BEG THE QUESTION...... ARE SOME REALLY IN IT FOR THE LOVE. OR THE MONEY, FAME....LETS FACE IT IT IS EASIAR TOO NETWORK YOURSELF NOWADAYS..AND IT'S ALSO EASIAR TO BE COPIED OR INFLUENCED...I GREW UP LEARNING ART BY WATCHING CARTOONS AND READING STORIES AND COMICBOOKS....IF IT WASN'T FOR THE INTERNET I'D BE WORKING AT A FAST FOOD RESTURANT AND NEVER REALLY LEARN ABOUT THE TRUE HISTORY OF ART ...BUT HEY BACK TO PICASSO........I STAND BY MY STATEMENT....THINK MAN...IF THEY BRING OUT A NEW COMPTUER TOOL THAT CONECTS TO YOUR BRIAN AND ALOWS YOU TO MAKE A WORLD OR A SCENE BY MONITORING THE ELECTRIC ACTIVITY IN YOUR BRAIN WAVES CREATE OR THINKING RATHER......EVERYBODY WOULD BE DONG IT AND IT WOULD BE A.......PAST TIME......AND I KNOW IT WILL BE AVAILABLE AROUND THE TIME I'M 60.....I'M 22 NOW...I DON'T KNOW JUST A BUNCH OF THOUGHTS..I DON'T THINK IT SUPPORTS THE ARGUMENT.

HOLLA
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Last edited by THECLYKE : 05-20-2005 at 02:51 PM.
 
Old 05-20-2005, 04:08 PM   #28
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Quote:
Originally Posted by THE CLYKE
WISE WORDS

BUT.....

MY GRANDFATHER LOVES SPORTS BUT AS SOON AS VIDEO GAMES CAME OUT HE SAID IT WAS A GOING TO TURN YOU INTO A BLOB.......
Very hard to read. Are you alternating how you type every other post? First in all lower case, the next in all upper? What's next, a mixture of upper and lower, or will you just start repeating the pattern
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Old 05-20-2005, 04:16 PM   #29
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Quote:
Originally Posted by slaughters
Very hard to read. Are you alternating how you type every other post? First in all lower case, the next in all upper? What's next, a mixture of upper and lower, or will you just start repeating the pattern


STICK TO THE TOPIC MAN....I REALLY DON'T KNOW WHAT PICASSO THINKS...I'M JUST TRYING TO THINK AS ME AS A ESTABLISHED ARTIST WHO'S DONE ALOT IN MY LIFE WHICH HONESTLY I SUCK AT IT.....
AND SORRY FOR THE CAPS... I LOVE COMIC BOOKS.


THIS IS SHOUTING WHEN IT COMES TO WRITING....STICK TO THE TOPIC....IS THIS A GRAND ENGLISH WRITING WEBSITE THAT IS ONLY FOR THOSE WHO WRITE PROPER ENGLISH?
HMMMMMMM..........I THINK THIS IS A WORLD WIDE SITE FOR ARTISTS........WHY DO I HAVE TO EXPLAIN THIS?

JUST STICK TO THE TOPIC MAN....DOSE ANY BODY ELSE FEEL I'M WASTING MY BREATH AS A STUDENT
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Last edited by THECLYKE : 05-20-2005 at 04:28 PM.
 
Old 05-20-2005, 04:35 PM   #30
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Stahlberg
True, he was a creative genius, quite smart, good with the ladies and good at selling himself, and he grew to become very old and wise in the ways of the world... but that doesn't make him Noam Chomsky. I'd take that quote of his with a big pinch of salt, smells like cliche wrapped in wordplay; designed to impress...

Or it may have been honestly prompted by
1. fear of the unknown (don't tell me he actually knew much about computers),
2. resistance to forced change (we're all very conservative that way, even those of us who like to experiment), or
3. the artist's fear that art (or indeed everything) would be corrupted by greedy industrialists and their horrid mechanical devices...


You have presented some interesting points here.

Gord

ps:

re: "he was a creative genius, quite smart, good with the ladies and good at selling himself, and he grew to become very old and wise in the ways of the world"
- Hey.. Whats not to like about that!!!
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