Why is it some people are naturally talented at drawing?

Become a member of the CGSociety

Connect, Share, and Learn with our Large Growing CG Art Community. It's Free!

THREAD CLOSED
 
Thread Tools Search this Thread Display Modes
Old 04 April 2005   #61
Jaforreal , man...I think I speak for everyone when I say this , please try to make sense in your posts man , they are too long and incoherent. read em before you post and try to say whatever it is you are trying to say in fewer words. I am not trying to insult you or anything Just trying to make sense of what you write gives me a headache.

For example:

The visual motivation for a drawing can be prompted by ones take on a physical manifestation of what they “see” with naked eye or what we “see” within a mental vision. A logical type of person may see things as they are with no thought of deviating from the physical visuals that are presented to them

Are you saying: "logical people just draw what they see" ?


Thank you.
 
Old 04 April 2005   #62
Originally Posted by Stahlberg: To try to find some answers I did a google on "talent genes art", here some highlights.
..............................


It's quite possible that people are motivated by their genes as far as the way that they do things. Also culture and upbringing can have some effect on us too. If we come from a family that is very basic in their approach to living with a focus on only the needs of living and without seeking creative outlets like music, art, story telling etc. this could effect our creativity.

We can look at some of the earlier societies of humans. These people had to come up with creative ways to entertain themselves at the end of each day with music, art, stories, etc. They didn't have the influences of the radio, TV, and films.

I have to turn off the TV, radio etc. just to collect my thoughts. I have come up with many good ideas just taking an evening walk. My cg work keeps my mind active as I have to come up with many creative functional designs every work day. Then I can take part in discussions like this one and get my creative juices going by talking about art with other artist.

In a sense we are gathering around with others at the end of the day to talk about creative matters here on CGtalk and elsewhere in online cg communities.
__________________
Modeling 3d objects on a 3d Beryl desktop. It's the 21st century, forreal.

Last edited by JA-forreal : 04 April 2005 at 08:31 AM.
 
Old 04 April 2005   #63
Originally Posted by Sheep Factory: Jaforreal , man...I think I speak for everyone when I say this , please try to make sense in your posts man , they are too long and incoherent. read em before you post and try to say whatever it is you are trying to say in fewer words. I am not trying to insult you or anything Just trying to make sense of what you write gives me a headache.

For example:

The visual motivation for a drawing can be prompted by ones take on a physical manifestation of what they “see” with naked eye or what we “see” within a mental vision. A logical type of person may see things as they are with no thought of deviating from the physical visuals that are presented to them

Are you saying: "logical people just draw what they see" ?


Thank you.


I meant what I said. But your statement works too. I lead in with the visual motivation sentence to more precisely illustrate how a logical person sees things. The visual motivation quote also covered the creative types that I mentioned later on and with the rest of the context. Other than that....

It looks like you got the gist of what I was saying so the quotes worked to communicate my points. I was not applying a specific process of writing with my quotes, I was just stating my opinions. My delivery was free form.
__________________
Modeling 3d objects on a 3d Beryl desktop. It's the 21st century, forreal.

Last edited by JA-forreal : 04 April 2005 at 08:29 AM.
 
Old 04 April 2005   #64
It worked because thats all i managed to read before giving up , the rest of the post i didnt even touch. Clarity over freeform
 
Old 04 April 2005   #65
Quote: or did they just have a photographic memory,

"Just"? What's so "just" about it? Having more or less of such a mental capability would be a huge factor in any artists success, wouldn't it? I don't understand the belittling of such an amazing power, calling it "just" photographic, and calling it "tracing" when it's used. It's the ability to truly observe something, then to see it clearly and precisely, in color and full shading, with your mind's eye; the most basic and important of all artistic skills. Some scientists call it spatial intelligence. I believe it has been proven that this ability is usually present to a higher degree in the more accomplished artist, and lesser degree in the less accomplished (however you want to define 'accomplished'). Of course I agree it can be improved by training - what human attribute can't? But most human attributes are also controlled by genes.

Quote:
how many of your favourite artists, or artists that you view as "talented" are/were idiot savants, had photographic memories, or were even childhood prodigies?

I believe most of them were, if not childhood prodigies like Picasso, at least had a touch of it - 'semi-prodigal' if you will. Most of them - not all. You're saying none of them had it, though, which seems a bit extreme to me.


Quote: do you think you're mentally less capable than those around you, or do you think those aroung you are less capable than yourself?
In certain matters, yes to both versions of the question.

Quote:
how do you know you're right and not just too humble/arrogant? have you ever pushed yourself, have those around you when you're around?
Yes, I have pushed myself. For example with math. Or soccer. Or ice hockey. Or slalom. You might as well ask someone blind from birth to see. Other things come so easy to me I feel sorry for those around me who can't do it. And I've seen others pushing themselves and failing too. Sometimes pushing works, sometimes it doesn't. That Amway Pull-Yourself-Up-By-Your-Bootstraps bull sounds believable because A: we all like to believe it, and B: it's accidentally right sometimes - that person did have pre-existing talent to become a great Amway salesman. I tried for over 2 years, really thought I was onto something, but in the end failed miserably. Same thing with most others around me - it's a pyramid scheme after all. The gaussian bellcurve again - 1 or 2 couples have what it takes to "go Diamond" as they say. There's a handful of intermediates, then there's the base of the pyramid who don't get anywhere. Same thing with most other talents or skills.

Quote: then how are you going to deal with it? are you a winner, innovator, ritualist, retreater or rebel at the fruit machine of life?

Sounds like it's straight out of "7 Habits of Highly Successful People". A good book per se, with lots of wisdom in it, but... life just isn't as simple as the Amway library would like us to believe.
 
Old 04 April 2005   #66
Originally Posted by Sheep Factory: It worked because thats all i managed to read before giving up , the rest of the post i didnt even touch. Clarity over freeform


No problem. We don't have to read every post in a thread anyway.

We are artist here expressing ourselves lest we forget. Hehehe.
__________________
Modeling 3d objects on a 3d Beryl desktop. It's the 21st century, forreal.
 
Old 04 April 2005   #67
Free forms have mass too. According to Newton, there must be gravity.

cheers,
 
Old 04 April 2005   #68
Talent fairy myths

I'm sorry, but come on! We are all at different places in our artistic journey. We all traverse different parts of that road with different speeds. We are not carbon copies of each other but that does not logically lead to the conlusion that artistic skills are the result of some mystical tap on the head from the talent fairy! In fact, I can think of nothing that discourages more people from getting better and benefitting from study, hard work, observation, and education than their buying into the idea that it's just a talent and you've either got it or you don't. Great artists wouldn't tell you their favorite books to read on the subject if it wasn't learnable. Master and apprentice style learning would never have created the masters throughout the ages that it has. Ian McCaig wouldn't tell you that anyone can learn it if they want to if it wasn't so. Don't be discouraged! Keep trying! Enjoy the journey instead of trying to fall in love with any single image. Study related ideas like color, composition, lighting, photography, painting, sculpture, 2d, 3d, emulate, copy, look, SEE! Put your left brain to sleep and watch what you can make. Get real education if you want it. Inside I think most of us are drawn to imagery and want to create, have been that way for 50,000 years or so. More emotion, information, and mood can be conveyed in an image than all these clumsy words I'm using! I have watched so many artists, young and old, go from seemingly hopelessly amateur, to well established in the habits and patterns that will make them artists for life with just a year or two of dedicated effort that I am absolutley convinced that if you want it, well, then it shall be yours.
 
Old 04 April 2005   #69
hear hear royalwin! I like your encouraging advice.

non should be discouraged, we all carry immense potential. its up to every single one of us to understand it ourselves and unlock it with attention to one self, the world around us and the ability be in the presence and work work work and reflect on that work. I was a crappy photographer when i started. now Im a good photographer and a crappy 3D artist aspiring to become good ...takes time for most people to get there
 
Old 04 April 2005   #70
Originally Posted by Faber: hear hear royalwin! I like your encouraging advice.

non should be discouraged, we all carry immense potential. its up to every single one of us to understand it ourselves and unlock it with attention to one self, the world around us and the ability be in the presence and work work work and reflect on that work. I was a crappy photographer when i started. now Im a good photographer and a crappy 3D artist aspiring to become good ...takes time for most people to get there


I checked out your website and your renders are very professional and show your skill as as a photographer. But art requires diversity and unexpected deviations from what we logically consider normal. As 3d artist often our work has to be practical. Some 3d artist just "dirty up" their scenes textures and knock out tiles and bricks in places. This can be interesting but you can only go so far with dirt.

2d hand drawn art lets you quickly create art as sketches just by using a few strokes here and there on a sketch pad. We can surprise ourselves with unexpected artistic discoveries during sketching sessions. If you are a 3d modeler you can do the same thing by just going wild cutting up a cube and extruding out shapes and letting your model take on form as your work progresses in 3d space. We can then fit these artistic discoveries back into our 3d environments as props like sculptures and accessories to add some flavor to our scenes.

I think that even artist can impair themselves creatively if they over think their creative process and hold back their creative juices with technically artistic rules. You sometimes have to just go with what you feel and let the moment guide you. You can always put things back in line later on. If you want too.

I say this because I need to do this myself. Much of my 3d design works as developed art elements that present products and services. I am trying to sneak in more creativity to spice things up.
__________________
Modeling 3d objects on a 3d Beryl desktop. It's the 21st century, forreal.

Last edited by JA-forreal : 04 April 2005 at 04:02 PM.
 
Old 04 April 2005   #71
This thread is very interesting to follow, indeed.

I like to believe that each person on the planet has potential in various discipline, may it be only one or more. But potential becomes talent only if we develop it and work hard to make something out of it. Some are predisposed to be good at anything physical, others better at logical thoughts, others at creative stuff. But then, it is only a matter or developping this potential. One can still like and try something else and actually become good at it, but maybe it will take more time (or maybe not, depending on their ''passion'' for it and thetime they put into it.)

It is all a matter of puting together several factors that can interfere with our lives and our so called talent. But talents comes from hardwork, potential comes from the genes and stuff like that. Well ,it is my opinion about it. I am rambling and probably repeating something somebody already said but oh well... Just wanted to add my little thoughts in the thread.


(Not sure if i used the right words in some places.. )
__________________
 
Old 04 April 2005   #72
Ja-forreal: I completelt disagree with your thinking: an artist is a creator, recreator, reproducer. not a photocopy machine with an attitude complex.

that's why not everyone is an artist.

Logical thaught is an art. a form of art anyway. philosophers are artists too. they express their thaughts by writing.

art is the abstract of translation from thaught to reality, or influence of thaught by reality to reality. read my sig and counter argue... cheers...
__________________
Quote: Originally Posted by urg
Didn't I tell you? I'm rowing over to save money. Wish me luck!


Latest Work
 
Old 04 April 2005   #73
> JA-forreal

thanks for the kind words. the 3D part is a "little" biased towards architectual visualization, frankly I think my 3D there is boring. I havent done any of the 3D I want to do yet...hmm I am not sure how to yet, being the reason behind that, too many far fetched ideas

Quote: I think that even artist can impair themselves creatively if they over think their creative process and hold back their creative juices with technically artistic rules. You sometimes have to just go with what you feel and let the moment guide you. You can always put things back in line later on. If you want too.


I completely agree with you there. I try to be in the present when creating and never keep anything if it feels or rather looks "wrong".. kill your darlings (dont know whos quote that is)

I totally agree with cha0t1c1 that everybody is not an artist. I think there needs to be an urge to do it, a kind of necessity to create to understand and then perhaps express it (for me). A lot of people dont find an urge to express them selves in art for various reasons I guess.

Lilie > its an exciting discussion where this potential comes from...genes, heritage, how we consciously and subconsiously chose to interact with the universe through our given uniquely tuned senses. I think that has a lot to do with the unlocking to do.
 
Old 04 April 2005   #74
Does a wingless monkey learn to fly if he practises a lot? NO

Does a wingless monkey learn to fly if you yell and scream him a lot? NO

Does an artist learn to draw? YES

Are you an artist or wingless monkey? Find out by practise

*SIGH*
 
Old 04 April 2005   #75
Originally Posted by cha0t1c1: Ja-forreal: I completelt disagree with your thinking: an artist is a creator, recreator, reproducer. not a photocopy machine with an attitude complex.

that's why not everyone is an artist.

Logical thaught is an art. a form of art anyway. philosophers are artists too. they express their thaughts by writing.

art is the abstract of translation from thaught to reality, or influence of thaught by reality to reality. read my sig and counter argue... cheers...


If you work as an illustrator and most of your clients want you to create images of art that are in many cases replicas of their product image then you would see things differently. If you just make art for the fun of it or create whatever you're inspired by you shouldn't have to work like an artist who is hired to reproduce someone else's concept drawings or images.

Yeah working at an artistic job doesn't make you creative.

Many of us here at CGtalk are a part of art productions in which artist reproduce the visions of other people for a living.

Often the only time that we can explore our own art is in a WIP on CGtalk or some other cg forum.
__________________
Modeling 3d objects on a 3d Beryl desktop. It's the 21st century, forreal.

Last edited by JA-forreal : 04 April 2005 at 09:36 PM.
 
Thread Closed share thread



Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

vB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off
CGSociety
Society of Digital Artists
www.cgsociety.org

Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2006,
Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
Minimize Ads
Forum Jump
Miscellaneous

All times are GMT. The time now is 01:03 AM.


Powered by vBulletin
Copyright ©2000 - 2017, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.