View Full Version : DWIII - 3D - Swizzle - Pyre

02 February 2008, 09:04 AM
The winning pose image:

The beauty render:

Everything in chronological order with some comments:


Concepts soon to follow. :buttrock:

02 February 2008, 09:20 AM
Some good ref there. I recognize the top middle image.

02 February 2008, 09:25 AM
great ref, looking forward to some concepts

02 February 2008, 09:57 AM
Wow, some awesome reference you got there.
I gotta start collecting myself. haha. Good luck man!!

02 February 2008, 10:08 AM
*looks at Inpiration Pix*

Right. 'Nuff said. :thumbsup:

So...all you gotta do now is raise the bar on that stuff. *grin*

Good luck, Swizz !!
Lookin' forward to seein' your digital pyrotechnics. ;)

02 February 2008, 04:00 AM
This is certainly not a final concept. Just warming up the concepting muscles.

02 February 2008, 04:51 AM
Looks cool man! Can't wait to see more :)

02 February 2008, 05:09 AM
Sweet concept so far, I like the idea of something being forged by natural/magical fire so hard that no mechanical/metal devices can harm him; superheated sword slicing through the metal beasts like pads of butter... & incinerating all organic foes. :D

If you don't mind my asking. What are the three major paintingly inspiration references? The top left three.

02 February 2008, 05:21 AM
If you don't mind my asking. What are the three major paintingly inspiration references? The top left three.The woman and the red/gold armored guy are concept art from Guild Wars by Kekai Kotaki. The one in the top middle is by Mathias Verhasselt (

02 February 2008, 05:26 AM
Sweet!! I really like the idea!! the scribing on the metal is a nice touch cant wait to see more!! great start:thumbsup:

02 February 2008, 05:27 AM
Concept looks wicked even in its base form, which shows a good character design. I like the monster hunter rathalos armour and guild wars concepts in your ref ;)

02 February 2008, 05:40 AM
great choices for reference and as a result, a great start too! cant wait to see more!

02 February 2008, 06:26 AM
Groovus Maximus !!!

I think my hair got singed just lookin' at that!

+2 points for Effectiveness! *grin*

02 February 2008, 06:41 AM
Thanks for all the compliments! My ego has officially been inflated. :D

One more before bed. This is probably a little closer to the feeling I'll be going for in the final version. I like the idea of the guy being made entirely out of glowing fire stuff, and I really like the teeth and chin sticking out of the helmet.

Also, I'm pretty blatantly stealing ideas from all over the place. The glowy crap/armor contrast looks almost exactly like some stuff from Guild Wars, the frontal design for the helmet was originally stolen from a very different concept by Niklas Jansson and I just added glowing shit and teeth, and I've also stolen some design elements from stuff at Polycount.

God, I love the internet. :buttrock:

02 February 2008, 07:46 AM
This one reminds me of the elementals from warcraft, and I love those guys. So this one can be really cool. keep up the good work :)

02 February 2008, 08:33 AM
I really like this already man, good solid design and basic shapes.

Please dont end up being one of those guys thats puts so much detail on top of details on top of details so we loose all focus on the nice heavy silhouette :D :thumbsup:

02 February 2008, 10:08 AM
"God, I love the internet. :buttrock:"

Teh internets rulez! Nice start! Like Hazardous said, don't overcomplcate it. At the same time you have a theme going using the little glowing circles all over, in the initial sketch I got the sense that there would be some sort of connectivity between all of the glowing parts sort of like the energy was being channeled across the surface of the armor to the dominant spots (or it's just early and I'm delusional), that would really work nice if you follow me.

02 February 2008, 11:23 AM
this is looking fantastic!!! It has the winning elements already, although I prefer the style of the mask in the original concept, I like the idea of firey squiggles/writing over the armour! :thumbsup:

02 February 2008, 01:05 PM
Great start, man. I feel the power within this character. Go on, I'll be following your progress.

02 February 2008, 02:42 PM
I agree great start! cant wait for some updates :D

02 February 2008, 02:51 PM
Looks great man love your painting skills keep up the good work.

02 February 2008, 03:05 PM
In your insperation picture, who did the celtic warriro amazon tyle woman in the middle bottom?Just curious!

02 February 2008, 03:06 PM
Looks great! I always did have a special love for elementals in armor. Will be keeping a close eye on this one. :)

02 February 2008, 03:44 PM
Nice artz. This guy is blazing with force. Love the feel. He's got a lot of malice to him.

02 February 2008, 04:23 PM
Cool colors :thumbsup:

02 February 2008, 05:15 PM
JockeP, jramauri, Matellis, Xarxys, BluntPencil, Deep_Wulf, Muflon:
Thank you all very much!

I can't stand it when people murder their art by throwing all sorts of unnecessary details at it. Makes things too busy. True, I'm going to be adding more little glowy bits all over, but I don't want to take it to such extremes that the character doesn't read anymore.

I like the idea, so I'm going to try it out along with some of the others I've got.

I actually like the orignal mask pretty well, too, but I felt it'd be a little more interesting to try and make this guy look completely evil.

That's a concept for Guild Wars by Kekai Kotaki.

I'm going to try to have a few more doodles up later today, so stay tuned.

02 February 2008, 06:06 PM
This is looking awesome, can't wait to see more...

02 February 2008, 07:28 PM
WOW.......Holy carp....

02 February 2008, 08:57 PM
hey man, I love it just like everyone eles!
The head bothers me a bit though because it looks like that monster from Hellgate london.
I think you should just add some adjustments
I can't seem to find the monster's picture, but he appears very often in the game.

02 February 2008, 12:41 AM
man, i dig the the design! Simple, nice silhouette. I wonder how u gonna pull it off with those cool lava effect on ur model

02 February 2008, 02:16 AM
Zenchi, KonL:

I haven't actually played Hellgate, so I'll have to look up that monster you're talking about. Does it have a name so I can look for pictures of it online?

I'm consciously trying to get an interesting, readable silhouette before I do any coloring, so I think that'll help even if I have a bunch of glowing crap everywhere. I do agree that reading a bunch of dark shapes 'midst glowing stuff as a character is going to be difficult to achieve, though, so I'll try to find a good balance.

Here's another... thing. I'm really not very good at drawing armor, having mostly just drawn plain ol' people in the past, so this is quite a challenge. I'm testing out all sorts of ideas right now, so this design may be radically different in a few days. I'm not totally satisfied with this image anyway.

02 February 2008, 02:35 AM
Nice work! Good for sorting out the silhouettes first, but don't forget the ones inside the form. Perhaps try to get more depth and weight out of the form, with really strong shapes inside and out. Try to make all the bits stand out maybe, like that collar - give it more reason to exist :)

I think he'd look a bit meaner with some more angular armor - kind of sharp, crude forms that cut up enemies when they try to attack :D (Maybe just here and there!) He looks a bit round and hugable at the moment! Similar to Full Metal Alchemist - and yes hellgate and a bunch of other things of course.

02 February 2008, 03:40 AM
Cool! CGS is gonna dominate this year man! :D CHEERS!!

02 February 2008, 04:02 AM
I'm still trying to work out how to balance forms inside as well as outside; since he has areas that glow, it's going to be hard to keep those from overpowering the whole business. Look at General Corum from the first DW; rawkstar found a clever solution to balancing glowy areas with light and dark tones on the armor and skin. I need to do the same.
I agree that he looks kind of huggable. I just don't like that last image very much; it seems too organic and obese.

You're inflating my ego. ;)

Did a quick doodle on a large pad of newsprint I had lying around. I figure that if I can get proportions down, the rest should work itself out pretty easily. I'm still not satisfied, though.

02 February 2008, 04:02 AM
This is looking realy cool man, I like the teeth sticking out of the helmet as well.

Keeping posted on this thread <3

02 February 2008, 05:33 AM
I'm realy liking this character. Just showing the mouth is very cool. Be careful not to make the head too small in proportion to the rest of him. It tends to make him look unintelligent...unless thats what you are going for. Keep working it out man. Cant wait to see more.

Want to know something funny...I had to look up the correct spelling for "unintelligent".

02 February 2008, 08:03 AM

02 February 2008, 09:02 AM

You dirty dirty man. I'de love to see you submit this as one of your concept pieces in the final submission, although you'de probably get disqualisfied. Concept looks cool so far, I'll be keeping an eye on this thread.

02 February 2008, 09:13 AM
I like the direction its going!

i particularly like the arachnid like eye pattern

I would say give it some more form though. The face plate is rather flat, round it out a little, maybe make it start to swoop backward after you reach the forehead, right now its just a little more than a flat panel.

In conjunction to that, I would make the plate on the front of the collar that guards the mouth area larger like you had in your earlier sketches. And bulk up those shoulder pieces that go from front to back!

all in all its looking VERY cool

02 February 2008, 09:34 AM
lol at the giant metal cod-piece. Really great concept. A firey mane pouring out of his spine or something similar might be look cool :P

Going to be following this chracter for sure.

02 February 2008, 02:35 PM
Nice Idea

btw. In the centre of those inspirational pictures who's the artist that created the woman picture?

02 February 2008, 06:15 AM
slick. I really like the helmet design.

02 February 2008, 06:47 AM
i'm digging the armor design, really cool. really nice concept.

02 February 2008, 07:25 AM
Man, you have no idea how tempted I am to throw that in the final concept submission.

You're definitely right about the helmet design; it needs a bit more interest from the side and the chin breaking up the line of the silhouette just won't be enough to offset all the rest of the smoothness. I'm still struggling with designing armor that doesn't look cheesy, so expect more crap to come forth.

I've actually thought about doing some sort of mane, though I'm not sure how exactly I could pull it off. We'll see.

Louis J. Browne:
Kekai Kotaki. That's actually the third time I've answered that question in this thread. :D

TonyEdwards, heavyness:

Here's a bit more futzing around. I seem to be working in reverse here; the first thing I posted was a fairly detailed drawing and they've gotten less and less detailed until it's nothing but flat shapes and silhouettes. Freakish.

02 February 2008, 07:30 AM
shaping up real nice I like the glow!! def want to see more!

02 February 2008, 01:21 PM
Great silhouette. Don't you think there's too much glows?

02 February 2008, 07:15 PM

I dunno yet. I had wanted all the chinks between sections of armor and stuff to be glowy like the only thing holding them up was fire instead of some sort of organic life form. I'm still trying to figure it out.

02 February 2008, 09:14 PM
Cool concept mate! :)

02 February 2008, 08:04 PM

Concepting on paper and in Photoshop hasn't been helping for the past couple of days, so I decided to throw together some primitives to check out proportions and such before I get to actual modeling. This has been an incredible help in visualizing how the final might look; things might look fine at one angle on paper, but look completely shite when you translate them to the third dimension, so this is a good way to check everything out before I get to modeling.

Another thing doing this illuminated for me was just how many tris 9000 really is. What you see right there is about 1700 triangles, so I'm kind of blown away by what might be possible with nine thousand.

02 February 2008, 09:14 PM
So how many of those are going to planes in the final model. Just wondered how you experts were doing things? Looking great. The final concept glows look amazing.

02 February 2008, 09:20 PM
So how many of those are going to planes in the final model. Just wondered how you experts were doing things? Looking great. The final concept glows look amazing.If by planes you mean alpha-mapped stuff, not much. 9000 triangles is a hell of a lot to throw at a game model, so I should be able to get away with modeling just about everything.

I'm no expert; I don't work in the industry and it'll probably be a while before I do get a job. This should end up being a decent portfolio piece, though.

02 February 2008, 09:29 PM
If by planes you mean alpha-mapped stuff, not much. 9000 triangles is a hell of a lot to throw at a game model, so I should be able to get away with modeling just about everything.

I'm no expert; I don't work in the industry and it'll probably be a while before I do get a job. This should end up being a decent portfolio piece, though.

A 30 day zbrush trial might be your friend in this instance if your up for it.

02 February 2008, 09:32 PM
Great silhouette. Don't you think there's too much glows?
There can never be enough glows. :D

From your 3D model, I'd either shrink the gloves a bit or make his legs (boots especially) a bit bigger. He's looking a bit top-heavy as it is.

02 February 2008, 09:46 PM
I actually bought the student version of Mudbox a while ago, so I shouldn't need to get Zbrush unless I suddenly get real interested in learning it.

I agree about him looking top-heavy. I'm actually screwing around with the proportions between writing posts on here, so the proportions should look a bit better next time I post.
Also, glowy shit is fun as hell.

02 February 2008, 07:38 AM
Decided I've spent enough time screwing off with concepts and other crap, so I'm starting on the high-poly mesh. Not quite sure what's going to happen with this, considering that I haven't done much high-poly modeling outside Mudbox, but it should at least be interesting.

I'm probably going to be dropping the buckles and crap later on. They were fun diversions.

02 February 2008, 10:02 AM
I adore the way the chestpiece envelops his head.

02 February 2008, 11:06 PM
looks cool :) sort of has an antique diver feel to it.. that anonymous, hard to tell nice or bad guy etc nice feeling :)
are you going to be able to model without scratching your head with such an undetailed concept though? it sertainly shows the concept works and is cool.. just wondering if you're more of a decide-details-in-modeller type of person. I know I get totally halted if I leave a decision up to model phase :/ but probably fine to sketch then too if you're used to it.

I think the armour-attached-by-char-made-up-by-glowing-[insert stuff here] is risky in terms of originality but can't say I didn't like how it looked nontheless! :)
keep it up!

02 February 2008, 04:00 AM
Thanks. I wasn't sure how well that'd work or not, but it's looking okay so far. I may try out a version with a smaller chest piece and a guard that's welded or riveted on.

I think I'll be able to pull off the modeling without getting too terribly stuck. I know the general direction I want to head in and I have a few slightly more detailed sketches of parts of the armor that I haven't posted here. I think the most trouble I'll have is going to come from the boots; I'm not very good at designing leg- or footwear. Most of the concepting has just been about getting some ideas out there so I can pull from all of them to make the model, though I don't always do things this way—this is actually a lot more freeform than I'm used to.
Oh, and I'm going to have a bunch of buckles and crap on the final, I think. I, too, was worried about the originality of the armor just sort of floating there, so I'm going to try to make it look a little more like it's strapped on.

A bit more progress on the high-poly, this time with belts and GIANT METAL CODPIECES! I've decided to keep the buckles for now because it was looking a little bare.

02 February 2008, 06:35 AM
Looking HOT!!
Ok... That was cheezy, but truthfully, I think its looking awesome, I love his armor design and I like your choice of inspirations. Can't wait to see it in 3D

02 February 2008, 06:50 AM
man, this is the best thing i have seen in a while, not just dwar related. best of luck to you, this is completely awesome.

02 February 2008, 05:11 PM
I really, really, really liked your initial concept on post 6. I hope you lean more towards this in the end! Keep it up! You're moving along a great pace! :thumbsup:

02 February 2008, 05:23 PM
I'm really digging the first run at the armor. Your form and and use of color, in the concepts, is great, really inspiring. Keep it up!

02 February 2008, 06:51 PM
SashaP, Goffskullz, etd382:
Thanks very much! Glad to know you like it.

I actually like that one a lot too, so I'm trying to incorporate some designs from that one into this model. The only thing I think I'm really set on is the head; I really didn't like the first helmet, but the newer version with just the mouth showing is a design I like much better.

Here's a little update. I'm still trying to figure out what I can do with the upper arms and thighs, but I'm sure something'll come to me. I'm glad the deadline's way off in April.

02 February 2008, 08:23 PM
Well a little bit input from a newb here, :) I think for the shoulders you could make it like what you have on the head, two layers plated, then a skinny upper hands made of rocks with a texture of lava flowing.
would be that kind of rock and lava hands, I dont know just some idea to help. well then good luck

02 February 2008, 08:24 PM
Cool deal. The head is a solid design and you should stick to it. My main concern looking at the model is the piece on the back turd cutter region. There is no way he would ever be able to sit down on that tubular cod piece . I think (now I could be wrong because I'm not looking at a reference right now) that those areas are usually left open on armor or there is a skirted kinda piece that attaches to the belt. Regardless, I think you should change it because I don't think you would want to sit down on a bed pan like that, would you? Other than that, everything else looks dang solid! Keep it up. I agree on the deadline, *sigh*, thank goodness.

02 February 2008, 10:20 PM
Nice progress Swizzle. Those buckles are looking nice. Got me antsy to get started modeling...

02 February 2008, 11:33 PM
I was kind of doubtful at first about doing anything more to the shoulders, but after trying it out I think I like it better with two layers as you suggested. As for the fire/lava stuff, I think what I'm going to do is make the chin/teeth and hands look a lot like lava because they need to seem solid, but the rest is going to look a bit like the hair in Shadow of the Colossus. I just did a test to see if it was feasible, and it looks like I could probably stay within the poly limits while giving him a few semi-transparent layers over the top of an opaque skin so it looks like he's on fire.

I agree with you on the bedpan ass; I just haven't quite found a solution that I like yet. I really want to stay away from chainmail if I can help it because I don't want to have a bunch of chainmail over the top of glowing stuff. If I did that, it'd probably just end up a muddy mess. I may end up doing something like a mail skirt, though.


02 February 2008, 01:59 AM
I was having some doubts about this guy before; I wasn't sure if I could get the high-poly modeling done, I wasn't sure how I was going to texture him, I didn't know if I should go for a more original design, etc.

Now I don't care.

I just did a quick test with some cylinders in place of arms and legs and stuff with a glowing material:

It may not look the best right now, but it's better than I was hoping for. Full steam ahead!

02 February 2008, 02:33 AM
Really turning out for the better. I like how the fire forms his body but shouldn't it be a bit more organic? I'd also lengthen the lower part of the body and slim the legs down. Your concept has got to be one of my faves. It really nice and I can't wait to see the finished product.

02 February 2008, 03:26 AM
looks sweet so far, but i prefer the proportions from the first sketch. i like the skinnier arms with the wider/lower waist.
looking forward to more

02 February 2008, 05:04 AM
Youre making some great progress on the model man, I think sticking with your ideas was a good decision. I would probably make the legs longer, only because i think once you add the hands it may make him look stumpy.

02 February 2008, 08:50 AM

I'm just trying to help, for me it would look better like that, but every people are different, but yeah I think the two layers of shoulder in my mind. Well you are on the right track though, I haven't even start model mine yet, ><. Good luck to you though

edited : maybe the yellow thingy of the body should be thinner or slimmer.

02 February 2008, 06:02 AM
Don't worry; I just threw some cylinders in there to simulate what it might look like later on. This is certainly not completely representative of the final product! The legs are going to have a bit more work done on them to get a better "leggy" sort of feel; they won't just be some fat cylinders. :D

I'm actually going to be drawing upon that first sketch a lot more later on. This is just the first pass on the armor and stuff while I sort of get acquainted with the proportions and stuff.

Lukavi:I too had noticed that his legs were looking a mite short, so that along with lots of other proportional adjustments will be coming.

I'm still going back and forth on what to do with his midsection and shoulder pads; they're both areas that need some love, yet I'm not quite sure what kind yet.

I'm having a bit of trouble getting this guy so the first thing you look at is his head, the second his hands and the third any other part of his body. I'm pretty certain that the best way to do that would be to increase the amount of visible glowy crap around the areas I want people to see and decrease it around less important areas, but how? I'm still debating chainmail because it runs the risk of becoming muddy, but I'm not sure what else I could do except more armor... which would be a pain in the ass and would probably look cheesy.

Eh, anyway:

Which breastplate should I do?

02 February 2008, 06:39 AM
3, for the side profile. looks cool :D

02 February 2008, 07:34 AM
I'd swing 2's goemetry more in the direction of 3's profile.

02 February 2008, 08:20 AM
3 is the shit man ... tho in any good design, form follows function so i'd bring it a little closer to his face so it actually protects something ...

awesome overall design going on though :)

02 February 2008, 10:42 AM
yeah 3 :)
keep it up!

02 February 2008, 12:25 PM
dude, i love the mix of traditional buckles and leather looking straps mixed with that Giger alien shaped helmet/head - really contrasts well!

I really like the idea of breast plate 3 being on a hinge. I imagine he gets overheated after battle and opens up that flap to let out steam from his chest, that would make a really cool image.

keep it bro, you're in my top 3! :scream:

02 February 2008, 01:30 PM
3, stick with 3 :)
You should keep the buckles too.

Great progress.

02 February 2008, 02:31 PM
3 is the shit man ... tho in any good design, form follows function so i'd bring it a little closer to his face so it actually protects something ...

awesome overall design going on though :)

completely agree. And awesome job so far. /openfire!

02 February 2008, 04:02 PM
Very good concept

02 February 2008, 04:04 PM
Hey Swizz, the dudes comin' along nicely!

Breastplate : I'm likin' 2. Of the choices its got good balance between Stylish and Effective.

Like you said, I'd also like it if the head was more ... eye-catching. Dunn how you wanna go about doin' that but maybe you could try :

1. The helm/head has a great side-profile as is, but perhaps you could add some forward-curving horn/ear-guard/helm-decoration to give the front-view a bit more bad-assedness ?

Drop the front-top part of the breastplate so you can see more of his face and make sure the mouth part is the Brightest-glowing/highest-contrasting part of the model

Oh, and like the rest of the guys said, the buckles an' stuff are great! :thumbsup:

02 February 2008, 09:03 PM
your'e quick ;) if you want to cover some of the glowing areas.. on the texture try something like this ( or this ( (ground)

02 February 2008, 10:09 PM
Holy wow. Lots of responses!

Thanks for the lava image. I think you may've helped me decide on how best to approach the less-glowy parts.

Thanks for helping me to decide, everybody. I think I'm going with #3—it seems to go well with the rest of the armor because it echoes a lot of shapes and themes already in place. It's only moderately practical, I know that, but after a little more work it should be fairly satisfactory.

Sooo... Here's a paintover. I kind of like the idea of some sort of firey mane (somebody suggested that not long ago), and I think it could help draw the eye to the head. Whatcha think? Suggestions?

02 February 2008, 10:25 PM
Yeah, I like that idea too and think that you should go along with it.
Here's some :

Anyways, your concept is really good and coming along nicely. I seriously can't wait to see hot it'll turn out. Keep it up and coming.

02 February 2008, 11:48 PM
your whole concept is so hot right now.

Yeah man, excellent work so far. Lavalicious! :P i'm glad you're going with no. 3.

03 March 2008, 05:19 AM
you gonna update this thing or what?

03 March 2008, 05:28 AM
you gonna update this thing or what?Yeah. I've actually done a little work on it, but not enough to show. Been a bit busy with real life and stuff. I want to have the high-poly version done by the end of the week, though, so it's full steam ahead again starting tomorrow.

03 March 2008, 07:43 PM
Your character could be really cool in the final renders with those glows. Some highcolor blooms on the glows will surely make the model complete. I wonder if that kind of posteffects are permitted? :curious:

03 March 2008, 07:51 PM
Very cool concept art.

03 March 2008, 11:22 PM
You can do anything you want as far as post effects and rendering wizardry on the beauty shot. I'm pretty sure the only one you're not allowed to have fancy stuff on is the winning pose shot.


Here's a little bit of progress. I spent a couple hours last night and a couple today screwing around with this. Got the body mostly done, though I'm going to be doing a bit of sculpting to bulk up the legs and arms and adjust some proportions. I'm glad this doesn't have to be seen without the armor on; the torso's little more than a tube!

I'm probably going to be completely encasing the right arm in some armor and chainmail. I was looking through some concept art and images of gladiator armor and I really liked the asymmetrical armor of the gladiators. I'll probably give him some sort of glove there, too.

03 March 2008, 12:58 AM
still not liking the proportions there Swizz, but the face is damn intriguing. mind posting a close-up of that?

03 March 2008, 01:55 AM
Aye, the proportions are still funky. I'm trying to get them looking better. Broadening the shoulders has helped a bit, but there's still more work to do.

As for the face, there isn't really much to see. It's mostly just a bunch of teeth right now. I'm going to be running it through Mudbox to get some more interesting detail and I'll certainly be changing the teeth, but the general layout's there. I'm not sure yet what kinds of details I'll put onto the front of the helmet.

03 March 2008, 02:12 AM
from further back they look pretty sweet...
up close, they kinda make me think of a "plush" Urah-Kai doll....

03 March 2008, 02:17 AM
Yeah. Not looking terribly impressive right now.

The Flork
03 March 2008, 03:31 AM
Just the one shoulder looks awesome and will totally one up the other arm for firey compusitions.
have you thought of giving him claws? like those goth rings but cooler and black. when i look at the color one i just wanna see black claws comming outta the fire.

03 March 2008, 06:53 AM
The Flork:
Yeah, I'm probably going to be giving him claws. I still have to do a bunch of detailing to do on the armor and stuff, so I'll probably add claws and give him little studs on different parts of his body or armor, among other things.

I'm still frustrated with the proportions, so I opened Modo and screwed around for about five minutes. I've never played World of Warcraft, but I've seen a lot of screenshots and thought I'd push the proportions more towards some of the stuff WoW has.

Whatcha think? Should I stay closer to the old proportions or go with something a little more exaggerated?

03 March 2008, 07:55 AM
Tweaked version looks better. Looks more impressive.

03 March 2008, 08:16 AM
Oh yes. Tweaked version it is :thumbsup:

03 March 2008, 08:51 AM
looking awesome there man.

One thing that instantly crossed my mind ... is he a right handed fighter ? if so, the shoulderarmor should go on his left shoulder, giving him protection on the open side of his stance (righthanded fighters stand with the left facing forward) it also gives him more manouvarabillity with his right arm.

other then that, the tweaked version looks awesome. not so much fan of the pointy gapped teeth though. I'd prefer them clustered together just long in the center (and crooked) and shorter to the sides.

03 March 2008, 09:51 AM
I'm in for the tweaked version too! Great work!

In any case is the empty shoulder really just empty or will you have some extra effects over there? Unless that one holds the weapon, he looks a bit off-balance for me but maybe it's just me and my damn symmetrical brain.

03 March 2008, 12:44 PM
looks cool! vote for modified one aswell.
about the right-side chest-to-shoulder-plate belt.. doesn't it seem it will obstruct movement?

03 March 2008, 01:03 PM
I'm glad you're taking the time to make some very important decisions and not rush through it. Keep it rolling!

03 March 2008, 02:58 PM
wow great progress, i love the way the armour plates are working out.
is your final 3d mesh going to be made up of numerous objects ? or are you gonna normal map them all into one or just a few meshes?

keep it up !

also how you gonna work in the fire ?

03 March 2008, 05:33 PM
Art2, MartinNielsen:
I definitely like the tweaked version better was well.

Y'know, I'm really not sure whether or not he's right-handed. It makes sense that the armored side would be forward, but I'm really not too terribly worried about it at this point. As long as it looks really cool and not completely unbelievable in the final version, it shouldn't matter too much.
About the teeth: I'm going to be remodeling them as separate meshes from the main body. That way I won't screw things up in the transition to Mudbox and I'll be able to put as many in as I want without having to worry about screwy geometry.

Getting him balanced is actually one of my main concerns. When you make something asymmetrical like this, there's got to be something to balance it or make it feel like it's balanced. In this case, yes, I'm going to be putting a bunch of firey crap over there.

Yeah, it probably does. :D I'm still working out a solution for the shoulder pad attchment, so this is mostly a placeholder.

Thanks! I figure that making decisions like changing up the proportions so it looks more appealing—even if he is an ugly bastard—will only help later on when there get to be fewer and fewer major changes I can make without throwing the whole thing off.

This is actually a question that's been bugging me since I started modeling the high-poly version. I think the best solution is going to be using one main mesh for the body and body armor, arms and close arm armor, legs and boots, head and helmet, and then use separate meshes for any other bits of armor. The shoulder pad, for example, will end up being a separate mesh that I just tack on to the main one.
For the firey bits, I'm going to have practically his whole left arm glowing and there are going to be some planes with fire textures. I'm also considering doing something like the hair in Shadow of the Colossus, except with fire stuff. His head is also going to be on fire and there's going to be a fair amount of glowing crap everywhere.

03 March 2008, 01:58 AM
dunno if it really comes across here, but i still think you need to get the proportions from your concept into the model

but also pull the shoulders forward a little more and stretch out the torso a tad

03 March 2008, 12:57 AM
I don't think I'm going to be doing any major proportional changes from here on. I like the tweaked, somewhat unrealistic proportions a lot better than those of that first sketch, so I'm going to stick with them.

I did a little bit of Mudboxing, mostly just to refine muscular forms and such. I'm really not going to be doing much more in Mudbox with this guy beyond what you see here because I can get the same effects I want by using the Nvidia normal map filter and CrazyBump. The larger forms of the normal maps also won't really be very visible in most places once I start putting glowy crap in there.

03 March 2008, 01:09 AM
"that is why you fail".

j/k, it still looks sweet so i guess ican let you continue down this route, just so long as you keep the mouth design...

03 March 2008, 01:13 AM
Heh heh. I'm set on keeping the mouth design. I might do a few slight structural changes like making the teeth and gums slightly asymmetrical, but that's it.

03 March 2008, 02:26 AM
Great concept.
I'll be keeping an eye on the development of this guy. :)

03 March 2008, 10:56 PM
This is looking really good! Although I'm not too keen on the mouth design.. I like lips! But, I guess he'll be on fire... so... :P

03 March 2008, 11:16 PM
Pretty smooth Swizzle. Can't wait for more updates.

03 March 2008, 11:38 PM
Good progress in your models, keep it coming!:scream:

03 March 2008, 11:39 PM
Lookin good!

03 March 2008, 07:20 AM
Thanks for all the kind words and support, everyone.

I've started work on the low-poly version, though there currently isn't much to show:

It's currently at 5076 tris and there will certainly be further optimizations once this stage of modeling is nearing completion. The model is currently several different pieces, but I hope to make it an almost completely contiguous mesh with only a few pieces floating.

I want to get the low-poly version done by the end of the week so I have the remaining time to do texturing, something I definitely still need practice with, and final renders. I'm hoping I'll be able to get this done about four to five days before the deadline so I can submit it early and avoid the inevitable last-minute rush.

03 March 2008, 07:40 PM
I'm hoping I'll be able to get this done about four to five days before the deadline so I can submit it early and avoid the inevitable last-minute rush.

Now that sounds familiar...

03 March 2008, 01:05 AM
Yeah, yeah, I know everybody says that. However, I've been able to keep a fairly steady pace with this thing and I have confidence that I'll be able to do it. I should have the low-poly done by tonight so I can start texturing very soon. Remember, the contest ends on April 7th, just over three weeks away.

Right, haven't gotten too much time to work on this because of family obligations and such during the past few days, but the low-poly version's just about ready to be wrapped up. Or unwrapped. Whatever. :)

It's currently at 7404 tris. I've got just about the perfect amount of wiggle room for the sword and the fire effects, though I still have to finish up the head/neck area and the boots. I also need to do a bit of optimization as there are a few areas that are currently too dense.

03 March 2008, 01:19 AM
looking good ,

i like the glowing all over the place , i'll be waiting for the beauty pass on this one .
only three weeks to go....damn I just started drawing thumbnailes/consepts...

03 March 2008, 01:50 AM
Hey Swizzle,

Just wanted to stop by and let you know I think this is turning out very nice so far. I really like the fury of your concept painting. It looks like you are doing a very nice job in translating this concept into 3D. Keep it up. I can't wait to see how the textures turn out.

-[0,0,0]Gorgoth :)

03 March 2008, 12:12 AM
Clawz, DCFlath, thanks! And I'll see you in-game, DCF.

I decided to take an additional few days and solve some problems I was having a bit of trouble with before, and I think it paid off in that it's now more efficient and a few areas are a little more nicely constructed.

The low-poly is basically done now, with the only thing I need to add being the fire and stuff. I'm going to add the fire planes and stuff during the texturing stage since it's kind of hard to predict what the geometry should look like for the fire until I have a little texturing done and I know how I'm going to do some things.

Before anybody gets on me for the sword being too simplistic, I just want to say I did that on purpose. There's already enough geometric noise as it is and I don't need to compound that by having some freaky-looking weapon with Mudboxed skulls and crap. Once I start texturing, there's going to be even more visual noise to balance, so I want the weapon to have a very readable silhouette and minimal geometric detail.

This isn't to say that Mudboxed/Zbrushed skulls and crap are necessarily bad, just not my thing. :p

03 March 2008, 07:38 PM
Normal mapping's almost done. These look kind of weird (especially the feet) because they're just Modo screengrabs, but they get the point across. Still a lot of stuff I have to tweak, though, and I'm going to be playing around with adding smaller details to the normals in Photoshop.

I should be working on the diffuse by sometime tomorrow. Comments and critiques and... stuff are always welcome. :D

03 March 2008, 07:58 PM
Nice stuff, the lowpoly works great. Lots of details visible in the silhouette without looking too lowpoly.

Minor crit is that maybe you could give the shoulderpad some more polys, its a large important piece, and it looks much more solid in the highpoly. Also the cgs symbol should perhaps not bleed into the sharpened part of the blade. Aswell as the hilt could be tiny bit thicker maybe?

03 March 2008, 02:42 PM
I'm dying for some texturing and some pose mockups here Swiz!

03 March 2008, 06:06 PM
I've been thinking about it since you mentioned the shoulder pad, and I think you're definitely right. It could use another cut or two in there to smooth out the silhouette from the front, so I'm going to add a few more tris since I have some left.
I also agree about the CGS logo going onto the cutting edges and it'd been bugging me before you even mentioned it. Luckily, it's just a simple texture change on a very unfinished normal map.
Dunno if I'll change the hilt, but we'll see.

Oh, you think you want the textures done? I've been wanting to work on the textures since I started on the high-poly version! :D I should have the normal maps done (or at least good enough that I won't have to do much more tweaking) by tonight and a few base colors laid down on the diffuse.

03 March 2008, 06:08 PM


03 March 2008, 06:11 PM
You better kick it into high gear man! There's only two weeks left dude! I threw up last night when I realized that. Now it's your turn!

03 March 2008, 06:37 PM
You better kick it into high gear man! There's only two weeks left dude! I threw up last night when I realized that. Now it's your turn!Yeah, no kidding. I'm doing a lot better than some other people, though; what about all these people who are still detailing their high-poly versions and don't even have the low-poly done? Hell, I could probably kick a fairly finished version out the door by the end of the week if I really pushed myself, but a lot of other people don't have a chance. It's sad. :sad:

03 March 2008, 09:02 PM
Not to talk crap and not pointing fingers, but yes, I agree. It is sad. There are some amazing ideas that will not make it because there's no time left. I'm pretty far along myself and still have a gajillion more things to do. Time management and dedication, what it's all about.

03 March 2008, 01:07 AM
Aye, time management is even more important than being fast at modeling or texturing.

Speaking of texturing, here's the first stab at a diffuse map (there's a teensy bit of glow in there, too). I really don't want to show the whole thing because, frankly, it's pretty damn fugly right now, though this should be enough to give you an idea of where I'm going. I'm going to be adding trim along most of the metal areas because they look kind of bare right now. The base metal is going to be pretty dark while the trim will be lighter. I may also do some fancy script or runes or something like in the first concept.

This is almost completely hand-painted. I've used a couple of photo textures to add some nice noise, but all the colors and scratches are done by hand.

03 March 2008, 05:02 AM
There are still seams and normal map issues galore (doing layered armor was a stupid idea :banghead: ) but I've evened out a lot of things on the texture and it's looking almost presentable now. Yay.

I swear his left arm is going to look better.

03 March 2008, 07:00 AM
Looking good ma swizzle dizzle :D. Just keep at it and it will keep getting better, goodluck :O

03 March 2008, 07:08 AM
No crits, looks cool. Its not the right time to give any C&c's, cause ther is little time left.
Great job, keep going:).

03 March 2008, 08:15 AM
You're on the right track my friend :thumbsup: Keep going.

03 March 2008, 12:10 PM
There we go! That is what I'm talking about! Go, go, go!

03 March 2008, 12:25 AM
Thanks for all the kind words and support, guys.

Anytime is a great time for comments and critiques. This might not be the best time to slam my modeling technique or something, but any helpful comments on the textures would be great!

The diffuse is coming along pretty nicely, I guess, though I'm starting to like this greenish tinge less and less. I originally added it to give a bit of depth to the texture so it wasn't just a gray mess, but it's not really doing me any favors. I also think that stripe down the middle of the helmet looks pretty shite, so I'm going to do away with it.

The normal maps still need help, as evidenced by the fact that there's all sorts of wonky shading going on everywhere, but that should soon be fixed. I've gotten rather good at painting areas of the normal map to fix errors and stuff, so I don't think it'll give me too many problems in the final renders.

The one on the left is just the diffuse and the one on the right is the diffuse, normal and glow, by the way. No spec yet.

03 March 2008, 01:15 AM
Coming along great man! Looks awesome!

03 March 2008, 02:04 AM
Thanks, Firebert.

So I just found out about this model viewing program called Polyviewer+. It fantastic; very easy to use and gives some nice results. Realtime self-shadowing on everything, too. This is a screenshot from it:

You can get the program here ( and there's a thread on Polycount about it here (

03 March 2008, 11:18 PM
Texturing's almost done. I still need to finish up the hand and arm textures and I also need to finalize some minor details in various places, mostly having to do with trim and decorations, but all the major things are in place.

This is a screencap from Modo, so there's no transparency, but it should give you a good idea of the final look. I need to whip up a good specular map to really pop some of the details, but that can wait 'til the diffuse is done.

03 March 2008, 02:27 AM
I really like it man. This is gonna look sweet with the glow and opacity maps added in! What do you have in mind for the pedestal?

03 March 2008, 07:13 PM
nice armour modelling, and believe me I have made more than my fair share of armour myself!

03 March 2008, 08:10 PM
I'm not sure yet what I'm going to do with the pedestal. It'll probably be something fairly simple so it doesn't distract from the character, though. The one in this image is just a stand-in.

robert thornely:

Here's the latest render. I still need to finish up the fire around his head and do the glow for the sword (along with a few other small fixes). Everything should be done by Wednesday, I think.

The Flork
04 April 2008, 01:51 AM
lookin completly awesome!

04 April 2008, 07:38 AM
Thankya, Flork. Your stuff's looking really nice as well. The line work in your drawings is beautiful.

Here's a small update with somewhat better lighting and a bit of camera adjustment. The previous image is way too orange for my tastes. I think I'm going to be doing a bit moodier lighting than this in the final images; I'd like to have some cool rim highlights in there with dark shadows and some warmer fill.

Oh, I also de-wimpified the handle on the sword. Looks a bit more fitting, no?

Still have a bunch of work to do on the textures and pose right now, but nothing so big that it can't wait for tomorrow.

04 April 2008, 06:14 AM
It's over.

I'm done. I've finished. All I need to do is a few more renders, throw together some presentation images and it's all wrapped up. Here's the latest:

04 April 2008, 07:06 AM
Very Nice Swizzle... nothing else to say other than that! I'm fond of the glowy bits and the light being cast from the flames. My only crit would be to keep the molten pedestal it looks much nicer. All I can think of is Super Smash Brothers when I see the other one, little trophy pedestal :)

Anyway, glad to see your done with plenty of time for tweaking, I'm pretty behind on mine but hope to crunch through it this week!!!:thumbsup:

04 April 2008, 07:28 AM
Hes looking sharp Swizzle. I prefer the molten pedestal. A few things I think you can add to make this guy really 'glow'. I guess you're already adding this but Scuff him up a bit more with burn marks and lots of wear in general. A nice touch would be to make some of the metal pieces red hot in places. Good stuff.

04 April 2008, 08:19 AM
Hey great work, must be nice to be done. I have a quick question about Polyviewer+. It looks like you have real reflections working. They're supported by Polyviewer+? Also, is it free, and where can I find it?

Again, great work, Good luck :thumbsup:

04 April 2008, 08:42 AM
Hes looking sharp Swizzle. I prefer the molten pedestal. A few things I think you can add to make this guy really 'glow'. I guess you're already adding this but Scuff him up a bit more with burn marks and lots of wear in general. A nice touch would be to make some of the metal pieces red hot in places. Good stuff.

completely agree with this, especially the scuffing up.

looking really really good tho. top work fella

04 April 2008, 12:21 PM
Come on Swizz! You can totally push this guy further! I know you can! It looks great now, but I agree with taking your textures to the next step and making a huge impact!

04 April 2008, 05:31 PM
I'm definitely going to be using the lava pedestal for the final image, but I'm going to be adding some gold around the rim to make it look a little more tidy.

Since I still have several days until the deadline, I'm probably going to be cleaning up the textures and pushing a few of the smaller details to make them really pop. I'll add a bit more scratches to a few of the larger, bare areas. I was actually planning on putting areas on the metal that were red hot, but it really doesn't work very well because right now it's just the stuff under the armor that glows and it breaks the continuity to have stuff on the outside glowing as well.

The only image I posted from Polyviewer+ was the one in post 137, so don't think I've been able to achieve these results with it. Polyviewer+ does specular highlights, not true reflections.
You can get the program here ( and there's a thread on Polycount about it here (


Other than adding some scratches, I'm really having a hard time thinking of what I could do to the textures to make them better. There's already so much going on with the highlights and the trim, the glowing areas, the floating text, I'm just not sure if I could do much more without it becoming totally unreadable.

04 April 2008, 05:51 AM
Decided that I didn't really like the additional scratches and stuff, so I submitted everything today.

The winning pose image:

The beauty render:

Everything in chronological order with some comments:

04 April 2008, 01:33 PM
wow looking great! :) good luck!

04 April 2008, 04:37 PM
Looks really great swiz. Nice and clean. I love the glows. To be honest, I was hoping the text would be a little smoother and pronounced, but it is still a great effect. My one wish is that you would have spent more time on the pedestal, and that's just a personal preference. I totally hear where you were coming from and applaud you for sticking to your guns on keeping it simple to avoid character detraction. Again, that's just me on beefing up the pedestal; it would have been sweet. So it's all up and submitted on the game artisans site? i'll go check it out! Best of luck to you man!

04 April 2008, 05:15 PM
Thanks, guys.

I don't think there's any place you can see the submitted entries yet. If I've read the judging page correctly, all the submitted entries will be available for viewing shortly after the contest is over.

04 April 2008, 07:07 PM
You are right, and now I'm pissed, so can you put them up here for us or are you going to hold out for a while?

04 April 2008, 07:09 PM
Check out that last link in the post with the images. I knew I should've put the link above the images.

04 April 2008, 07:15 PM
Well damn! Forgive my partial blindness. I was just too blown away to notice the 2pt Verdana text.

04 April 2008, 07:18 PM
Kudos to all the special effects, such as all the fire, glows and the text. Very good job done, even thought I would personally prefer more scratches and imperfections on the armor.

My only question is if the normalmap really produce 100% accurate result? On some places it looks only smoothed normals without any normalmap. Minor flaw, thought every bit is useful in this contest:)

04 April 2008, 08:22 PM
good job mate! dont know why but it reminded me of mario galaxy, think its cuz the shadders you´ve used! nevertheless, very well done!
good luck!

04 April 2008, 09:01 PM
I know what you mean about both the scratches and normal map. I decided against doing scratches because, while it might look kinda neat, it would just add too much visual noise to something that's already bordering on difficult to look at.
The normal map in this case doesn't do much more than add definition to things that need it, like bits of armor that have curves and creases that aren't actually there in the low-poly geometry. It's strongest on the arms and legs where I used Crazybump to add a lava texture, and that's the way I want it. I didn't want to go overboard with insane little details because they'd just detract, in my opinion, from the end result.

That would be the rim lighting, methinks. I have a bit of gradient on there based on incidence angle so it's lighter around the edges. It's something that lots of games (like Mario Galaxy, Half-Life 2: Ep 2, Call of Duty 4, etc.) are doing these days. It makes things pop out from their background a bit and can, if you do it really subtly, simulate peach fuzz on skin.

Overall, I'm satisfied with how this came out. I'm well aware of the various criticisms that could be made—especially those involving adding more wear and tear or burn marks or other details. However, I've submitted all my final images. It's finished, even with its imperfections and such, and I'm not going to be working on it further. Thanks for all the kind words, criticisms, critiques, everything.

Good luck to all with your entries. See you all at the judging!

04 April 2008, 11:06 AM
Nice charcter but need more details.
keep it up!

04 April 2008, 02:36 PM

That looks crazy good

04 April 2008, 05:14 PM
pretty sweet swizzle - what is the writing around his arm?

04 April 2008, 07:35 PM
It's my name and "CGSociety - Society of Digital Artists" in a font that's kind of difficult to read.

04 April 2008, 03:10 AM
nice man, thanks for the explanation :)
btw, I just visited your flickr page and found out that you were using this polyviewer soft, I downloaded that but everytime that I try to import my model inside it, the texture coordinates comes all wrongs, even if I use the model wich cames with the software, wierd... do you know why ?

04 April 2008, 03:45 AM
Nice job - the glow effect looks amazing. Good luck!

04 April 2008, 04:37 AM
nice man, thanks for the explanation :)
btw, I just visited your flickr page and found out that you were using this polyviewer soft, I downloaded that but everytime that I try to import my model inside it, the texture coordinates comes all wrongs, even if I use the model wich cames with the software, wierd... do you know why ?Whenever I used it, I had no problems. I suppose it could be a compatibility issue with your video card, but that's the only thing I can think of.

04 April 2008, 05:22 AM
awesome! love the contrast between the dark armor and fire. love the text effect rolling around his arm!

04 April 2008, 06:34 AM
cool character man, it's really nice to see it finished! also dont forget to submit it to the team posters :

04 April 2008, 06:41 AM
Thanks! You wouldn't believe the trouble I went to trying to get something around his arm that looked firey but didn't completely overwhelm the whole thing.

You know, I keep on telling myself I need to get on that. Hell, I've even done a couple of renders, but then I realize I've screwed something up at render time and I say "Screw it! I'll do it tomorrow!"
I should probably get it done... :D

04 April 2008, 09:54 AM
looks real cool. Congratulations for great job:)

04 April 2008, 12:49 PM
thanks for the answer Xavier!
good luck man :)

04 April 2008, 10:20 PM

Ultra Owned! - Besides, I really liked this guy, he is 100% my style really really liked him!

04 April 2008, 05:22 PM
He look strong! Great job man.

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